Just wanted to jump in here and let everyone know I've really enjoyed all the back and forth on this: the negativity, positivity, blind loyalty, even the confused.
It's been fun. Grabbing this tomorrow and it will be the first time I haven't watched a pickup on Day 1. Will have to wait till October to experience this one.
I just got my copy in the mail about 6 hours ago from Barnes & Noble (included slipcover).
Overall I think I was expecting more detail for being 35mm. My 35th anniversary edition is still sealed on my shelf because I never got around to it, I’ll have to give that one a go to compare. I haven’t seen Halloween look better, but I was expecting a tad bit more grain and overall crispness, however there’s quite a few scenes that definitely look great so maybe it’s the focus of the film. Anyway, I myself do feel suspect there is *some* DNR. (but hey, I could be wrong)
For reference I’m using an E7 OLED.
Last edited by SonSon III; 09-25-2018 at 06:15 AM.
Yeah, I respect yoir opinion. I'll be lying if I told you that I dont like the THX DVD. Its main problems are that 1. Is not 100% consistent 2. Is not on HD & 3. Is from a very old master and needs some improvements. I think Dean Cundey meant that the 1998 transfer was for the fans and those who over the years complained that the movie didnt looked like it was set on fall. I mean Dean Cundey had the chance to remaster the THX dvd master for the 35th anniversary edition but he instead went to do a transfer that looked closer to the Criterion Laserdisc. So Halloween really was meant to be seen with its flaws and all. And in my opnion that's some of the things that make it special. Just like Jamie Lee Curtis and John Carpenter said, back in 1978 they never thought Halloween was going to be a huge influence comparing to how low budget it was made. Is a product of its time and every time I see the obvious goofs and heavy grain in the UHD transfer, i'm happy because it shows that a movie doesn't really need to be 100% perfect or free of plotholes to make a huge impact on people. I just wish the original mono was included as an option. Lmao
I've long said that the perfect option would be to do a raw scan (preferably something more future proof like an 8K scan) of the negative (for maximum detail) as well as the answer print or interpositive, then proceed to create two separate versions of the movie for a single package release.
-For the first version make it look exactly like the answer print or interpositive so you get the original theatrical experience.
-For the second version make it look like the answer print or interpositive then from there do extensive color correction and the like to make it look exactly like Halloween/autumn in the midwest in 1978. Erase the palm trees, make the leaves shades of golden, orange, and red and the like, give the general "air" an autumnal feel, etc. This must be a high level professional job though, this is a film on the National Registry after all, it's more than just some popular b-movie.
This way you have the best of both worlds. If George Lucas put out the original unblemished Star Wars films alongside his revised versions there would have been no issue, and so in the scenario I presented above no one would feel they aren't getting the presentation of the film they want to see.
I'd also add in do a brand new transfer of the original mono audio as well. I am not sure offhand how audio transfers are done, but I'm sure there's some equivalent to the ultra hd resolution scans for film (maybe set higher bit and khz parameters?). Then from there an Atmos/DTS:X/Auro 3-D audio mix staying true as possible to the original audio save for some minor corrections (like pitch shift of the theme after the "speed kills" bit, though I cannot recall if that was in the original mono or not).
And theatrical prints usually didn’t look like an IP or an answer print. So it wouldn’t be a theatrical experience. This obsession with faithfulness is laughable, because faithful to what? There are too many variables.
The Halloween UHD looks like film IMO. If I was personally responsible for the restoration, I would have given it more color. But this is how John and Dean want it to look like today. It’s good enough for me.
While the film excels mostly in its context of time, it is still perhaps the most quintessential slasher in the history if cinema. Halloween revolutionized the horror genre, basically creating the new sub-genre which is still alive today. Even the franchise itself has kept going, to the extent that both its director (for the score) and main actor have come back for the new upcoming sequel.
While the film itself is not deep in story or characters, it overcomes both thanks to its many other overachieving elements, like the camerawork, cinematography, score, acting from Jamie Lee Curtis and Donald Pleasence, and just its atmosphere and tension in general, making the suburbs one of the scariest settings in a horror movie. All this is done with minimal violence, which is actually quite tame, especially by today's standards. There are really no words that can accurately describe just how perfectly the film creates such a deeply scary atmosphere which combines terror, despair, and darkness without really being brutal or graphic. Perhaps the most attributing element to this, other than its impressive artistic and technical work, is the character of Michael Myers. The boogeyman in human form. Donald Pleasence does such a good job as the doctor trying to prevent a tragedy, that even though Michael himself does not have any lines of dialogue, his actions, combined with the picture which Dr. Loomis paints of him, are enough to be terrified of him even in the comfort of your own home. Seemingly unstoppable with no sense of morality or value for human life. That combined with the atmosphere makes Halloween the film to watch every year around this time.
Jamie Lee Curtis does a phenomenal job as the victim in this senseless act of violence. Even in her acting debut, she has enough gravitas and acting skills that we see how smart but vulnerable the young Laurie can be. Scared of something as simple as going to the dance with the guy she likes, but wise and brave enough to still protect the little kids under her care even as a serial killer is going after her. It is really the performance of a lifetime, making Laurie The final girl we all enjoy seeing escape from Michael's frenzy.
Even though there are arguably scarier films, none can quite match the artistic level of craft, enjoyment, and palpable sense of suburban terror that Halloween portrays with such confidence and skill. The film is really defined by the 'relationship' between serial killer/boogeyman Micheal Myers and survivor/final girl Laurie as they confront each other in one terrifying night during Halloween. Making this slasher a timeless film and perhaps the scary movie to end all scary movies.
PQ: 4 / 5
Lionsgate has remastered the film in 4K/HDR with a Dolby Vision encode for its 40th year anniversary. While the transfer is not demo material, and could arguably look better, the new HDR transfer still impresses, especially given not only the age, but also the budget the film was made with. The most impressive elements here are fine detail and added sense of depth thanks to the higher dynamic range. The picture is pretty dark, especially during its second and third acts, but nonetheless the picture looks great. Black levels are deep and inky. Not the deepest I've seen but still quite impressive, again, especially considering its age. Even then, shadow detail impresses throughout, never getting crushed even in the blackest and darkest scenes. That, combined with the outdoor and indoor lights from the suburb give the image some punch. This is quite apparent in scenes in which Michael is stalking his next victim, both during the opening scene and later in the film once Laurie is babysitting. Outside everything is really dark, but nonetheless you can still make out the different leaves of the bushes and grass as well as when he goes inside a dark house, with the textures from the dark cabinets in the kitchen looking perfectly defined despite the minimal brightness. The combination of brights and darks isn't as crazy as something like Alien: Covenant, but nonetheless the new transfer does provide the image with some impressive depth that SDR simply cannot capture. The transfer also benefits with HDR in specular highlights such as from lights reflecting off cars and other surfaces.
Fine detail is also impressive. Textures in long shots like the designs on the houses and textures on the tree trunks really catch the eye. They look very convincing and natural. Other textures inside houses like curtains and clothing on characters also receive a very nice uptick in detail. The transfer seems to have used the same color scheme as the 35th anniversary edition, that, while it makes the image somewhat drained of deep colors, the new HDR/WCG transfer still provides some benefit, such as the red tone of the car when Laurie and Linda are driving around town before babysitting. Another element that benefits from this are the different whites throughout the film. While these are not colorful, the 12-bit encode does provide them with more gradations which give them more detail and make them look very realistic. The curtains blowing in the wind outside Laurie's house as Michael looks up through her window in that infamous shot look especially vivid, making the shot even creepier than before.
As far as compression goes, it is overall good but not the best. Grain could have been handled better and that is really the only complaint I have about this transfer. In some areas of the picture it looks great, almost Sony-like. In other, it can look a bit noisy, and in others still, it can look a bit chunky. It does not ruin the transfer, but given that this is a 4K transfer with a more advanced compression codec, grain should look better. Lionsgate seems to have re-used the restoration that was used for the 35th anniversary edition. While the picture could arguably benefit from a brand-new scan, and definitely a better handling of film grain, this transfer is nonetheless quite impressive. The picture has lots of depth and nuance thanks to the HDR transfer. The picture is not very colorful, but the depth combined with the impressive amount of fine detail on display makes the picture look quite good, definitely better than the standard blu-ray even if it is not overall perfect.
AQ: 4 / 5
Unfortunately, Lionsgate has not provided the disc with the original sound of the film, lossy or lossless. Thankfully, the 7.1 Dolby TrueHD track sounds quite good. It does have different effects than the original design, but at least imo, they do not ruin the film at all. Lightning, wind, and rain impress while Dr. Loomis and the nurse go for Michael. The mix creates a really nice sense of immersion thanks to nice support from the surrounds. Throughout the movie, the score nicely bleeds from the front to the rears and backs, and upmixed with Dolby Surround, it creates a really nice bubble of sound for the viewer. Later in the film atmospherics like the wind once again travel to the rears as Laurie and her friends walk home from school, nicely opening up the soundstage and expanding it further than what a mono mix can accomplish. Dialogue is clear and intelligible. The low-end is used modestly, but given the age and budget of the production that is not really a surprise. Same with the dynamic range; it is not broad but it is enough to provide a nice listening experience. Overall it is a modest track but it is still capable of immersing its viewers in the terror of the story.
Overall:
While the picture impresses, it is disappointing that the original mono track was not included. Even though the 7.1 lossless mix can't quite replace the mono track, especially since it has changes in terms of its effects and cues, it is still a good mix that supports the film quite well. With a nice upgrade in picture quality, this 4K edition is very much worth getting. Could it look better? Yeah a little. But at least for now, this is the version to own, at least until the original mono is included in the next one, and perhaps with a new transfer that can fix the slight grain management deficits in the picture. Until then, this one is very recommended, especially considering the current low price (~$15 @ Target).
And theatrical prints usually didn’t look like an IP or an answer print. So it wouldn’t be a theatrical experience. This obsession with faithfulness is laughable, because faithful to what? There are too many variables.
The Halloween UHD looks like film IMO. If I was personally responsible for the restoration, I would have given it more color. But this is how John and Dean want it to look like today. It’s good enough for me.
Now let’s bring some other movies to the format.
I would have given it more color as well. The “grey” washed out look doesn’t feel definitive to me. I think this is worth a buy at the price for the resolution alone, but I’ll be dipping again on the next release if they release something a little more along the lines of how I remember Halloween. I need to do my homework about all the variations, but I’ve seen versions that are VERY blue, I’ve seen the springtime 2007 goofup, and now I’m experiencing the 35th anniversary grays. I watched this a ton on different VHS releases as well.
Can someone point me in the direction of the closest theatrical presentation release? Best TV version? Better yet, any diehard fan care to list the notable changes & differences to the color that have occurred for releases over time up until now?
Last edited by SonSon III; 09-25-2018 at 07:56 AM.
This "back and forth" on the PQ color timing is hilarious.
This is what I suspect:
the 1999 THX dvd was just the original color timing pumped up a bit for what were then smaller TV sets. The 35th Anniversary was yet another revisionist "greyed out like all modern horror movies" to sell to the modern crowd.
I don't believe for one second that HALLOWEEN was supposed to be a near colorless film. Forget about making the trees "orange" or any of that BS. You take a camera, film during the broad daylight without fudging with anything because your budget is so low you are raking the fake leaves up after every shot.. well guess what? You are going to get nice, bright natural colors because you are filming in broad daylight. Short of having a filter over the lens to decrease the light exposing onto the film and purposefully creating a dimmed image, you are going to get a bright colorful image provided to you courtesy of the Sun.
You add onto that the fact that Carpenter ripped off/copied Dario Argento and Mario Bava's use of colored gels in front of fill lights for the night shots, and you are going to get the more colorful shots akin to the 1999 THX dvd.
Hopefully someone in Europe will release a variation, the way we get between 88 Films and Code Red and it won't matter if we simply get a choice: a nice colorful "revisionist" HALLOWEEN with actual color or the modernistic "non revisionist" greyed out version we currently have.
Halloween is not a near colourless film in any release.
It just looks that way when the latest BDs are compared with the nearly twenty year old THX DVD, prepared for 20-38" CRTs, which people somehow assumed to be completely faithful and/or definitive.
You compare two releases on capsaholic and the less saturated one is always looks "desaturated". Or the one that's not been sharpened has "no detail". etc etc.
Watching the UHD in Dolby Vision, the colors are really not bad. But the original theatrical prints were probably a bit more saturated. I would ignore people posting pictures of their TV’s. This is a very strong release and will be the version I watch from now on.
[Show spoiler]While the film excels mostly in its context of time, it is still perhaps the most quintessential slasher in the history if cinema. Halloween revolutionized the horror genre, basically creating the new sub-genre which is still alive today. Even the franchise itself has kept going, to the extent that both its director (for the score) and main actor have come back for the new upcoming sequel.
While the film itself is not deep in story or characters, it overcomes both thanks to its many other overachieving elements, like the camerawork, cinematography, score, acting from Jamie Lee Curtis and Donald Pleasence, and just its atmosphere and tension in general, making the suburbs one of the scariest settings in a horror movie. All this is done with minimal violence, which is actually quite tame, especially by today's standards. There are really no words that can accurately describe just how perfectly the film creates such a deeply scary atmosphere which combines terror, despair, and darkness without really being brutal or graphic. Perhaps the most attributing element to this, other than its impressive artistic and technical work, is the character of Michael Myers. The boogeyman in human form. Donald Pleasence does such a good job as the doctor trying to prevent a tragedy, that even though Michael himself does not have any lines of dialogue, his actions, combined with the picture which Dr. Loomis paints of him, are enough to be terrified of him even in the comfort of your own home. Seemingly unstoppable with no sense of morality or value for human life. That combined with the atmosphere makes Halloween the film to watch every year around this time.
Jamie Lee Curtis does a phenomenal job as the victim in this senseless act of violence. Even in her acting debut, she has enough gravitas and acting skills that we see how smart but vulnerable the young Laurie can be. Scared of something as simple as going to the dance with the guy she likes, but wise and brave enough to still protect the little kids under her care even as a serial killer is going after her. It is really the performance of a lifetime, making Laurie The final girl we all enjoy seeing escape from Michael's frenzy.
Even though there are arguably scarier films, none can quite match the artistic level of craft, enjoyment, and palpable sense of suburban terror that Halloween portrays with such confidence and skill. The film is really defined by the 'relationship' between serial killer/boogeyman Micheal Myers and survivor/final girl Laurie as they confront each other in one terrifying night during Halloween. Making this slasher a timeless film and perhaps the scary movie to end all scary movies.
PQ: 4 / 5
Lionsgate has remastered the film in 4K/HDR with a Dolby Vision encode for its 40th year anniversary. While the transfer is not demo material, and could arguably look better, the new HDR transfer still impresses, especially given not only the age, but also the budget the film was made with. The most impressive elements here are fine detail and added sense of depth thanks to the higher dynamic range. The picture is pretty dark, especially during its second and third acts, but nonetheless the picture looks great. Black levels are deep and inky. Not the deepest I've seen but still quite impressive, again, especially considering its age. Even then, shadow detail impresses throughout, never getting crushed even in the blackest and darkest scenes. That, combined with the outdoor and indoor lights from the suburb give the image some punch. This is quite apparent in scenes in which Michael is stalking his next victim, both during the opening scene and later in the film once Laurie is babysitting. Outside everything is really dark, but nonetheless you can still make out the different leaves of the bushes and grass as well as when he goes inside a dark house, with the textures from the dark cabinets in the kitchen looking perfectly defined despite the minimal brightness. The combination of brights and darks isn't as crazy as something like Alien: Covenant, but nonetheless the new transfer does provide the image with some impressive depth that SDR simply cannot capture. The transfer also benefits with HDR in specular highlights such as from lights reflecting off cars and other surfaces.
Fine detail is also impressive. Textures in long shots like the designs on the houses and textures on the tree trunks really catch the eye. They look very convincing and natural. Other textures inside houses like curtains and clothing on characters also receive a very nice uptick in detail. The transfer seems to have used the same color scheme as the 35th anniversary edition, that, while it makes the image somewhat drained of deep colors, the new HDR/WCG transfer still provides some benefit, such as the red tone of the car when Laurie and Linda are driving around town before babysitting. Another element that benefits from this are the different whites throughout the film. While these are not colorful, the 12-bit encode does provide them with more gradations which give them more detail and make them look very realistic. The curtains blowing in the wind outside Laurie's house as Michael looks up through her window in that infamous shot look especially vivid, making the shot even creepier than before.
As far as compression goes, it is overall good but not the best. Grain could have been handled better and that is really the only complaint I have about this transfer. In some areas of the picture it looks great, almost Sony-like. In other, it can look a bit noisy, and in others still, it can look a bit chunky. It does not ruin the transfer, but given that this is a 4K transfer with a more advanced compression codec, grain should look better. Lionsgate seems to have re-used the restoration that was used for the 35th anniversary edition. While the picture could arguably benefit from a brand-new scan, and definitely a better handling of film grain, this transfer is nonetheless quite impressive. The picture has lots of depth and nuance thanks to the HDR transfer. The picture is not very colorful, but the depth combined with the impressive amount of fine detail on display makes the picture look quite good, definitely better than the standard blu-ray even if it is not overall perfect.
AQ: 4 / 5
Unfortunately, Lionsgate has not provided the disc with the original sound of the film, lossy or lossless. Thankfully, the 7.1 Dolby TrueHD track sounds quite good. It does have different effects than the original design, but at least imo, they do not ruin the film at all. Lightning, wind, and rain impress while Dr. Loomis and the nurse go for Michael. The mix creates a really nice sense of immersion thanks to nice support from the surrounds. Throughout the movie, the score nicely bleeds from the front to the rears and backs, and upmixed with Dolby Surround, it creates a really nice bubble of sound for the viewer. Later in the film atmospherics like the wind once again travel to the rears as Laurie and her friends walk home from school, nicely opening up the soundstage and expanding it further than what a mono mix can accomplish. Dialogue is clear and intelligible. The low-end is used modestly, but given the age and budget of the production that is not really a surprise. Same with the dynamic range; it is not broad but it is enough to provide a nice listening experience. Overall it is a modest track but it is still capable of immersing its viewers in the terror of the story.
Overall:
While the picture impresses, it is disappointing that the original mono track was not included. Even though the 7.1 lossless mix can't quite replace the mono track, especially since it has changes in terms of its effects and cues, it is still a good mix that supports the film quite well. With a nice upgrade in picture quality, this 4K edition is very much worth getting. Could it look better? Yeah a little. But at least for now, this is the version to own, at least until the original mono is included in the next one, and perhaps with a new transfer that can fix the slight grain management deficits in the picture. Until then, this one is very recommended, especially considering the current low price (~$15 @ Target).
It's well known that red was avoided in the design of Jaws. Yellow was preferred as a conspicuous contrast to the exceptions like Alex Kintner's shorts and the estuary victim's dinghy.
It just occurred to me that, apart from Annie's car and the top she wears underneath her rainbow plaid shirt (before she gets butter all over them), the only red that's worn conspicuously in Halloween is Tommy's jacket and Lindsay's vest/shirt. Maybe this was intended to subliminally make the audience fear for the children. Or maybe not.
3. Loomis’s final gun click at the end is missing on at least some surround mixes.
I'm happy to report the click is present in the 4K's 7.1 mix.
I received my copy in the mail from Best Buy yesterday. I haven't watched the entire film but I sampled a few scenes.
The best thing I can say about the color timing is you don't notice the color timing. Unlike some previous releases there is nothing artificial about the look of this one. I've owned almost every version of Halloween ever released on home video, all the way back to VHS. This is the cleanest, most natural-looking version I've seen.
I can't wait to sit down and watch the whole thing, but so far I'm very happy with what I've seen.
The THX DVD was revisionist. Literally no other version of the film including original prints I’ve seen has looked like that. It was done by a colorist and Cundey wasn’t involved, he just “approved” it. He was personally involved in the 35th Anniversary release.
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