Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[cheez avenger]

I don't blind buy films, or very rarely do, at this point. I have to budget myself with material nowadays especially when I'm trying to upgrade components, etc. If anything, I'll find a site that has a streaming version or hit up my local library system, Kanopy, Hoopla, etc., and use them for recon. Now if I do end up liking a film then i will definitely buy it.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Vilya

If you want to isolate yourself and be a movie/TV show hermit, that's another one of your choices. Deliberately keeping yourself unaware is just another form of denial and I'm not moving to that state ever. I'm not keeping myself in the dark about new content.

right now I have 64 films and 2 Tv seasons on my unwatched shelf and 57 items on my PVR. Am I a hermit because I have not seen those? how about stuff I decided not to PVR or buy because there is too much content I want to see already? we all need to find that goldilocks content to fill up our time and at least for me there is just way too much of it. accepting more crap just so that I can say there is even more crap I don't have time for is useless IMHO.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Smacks of rationalization to me, sorry.

No matter how you spin it, the less that you pay for titles on physical media is the less that you are supporting it. The less the studios earn from disc sales, the less motivated they are to release more.

Lol, so if Penguin buys a film on BD at less then MRSP it does not tell the studio that he is willing to buy that film, but when you watch it on streaming somehow that somehow helps physical media.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

I know, I am not disputing that all I am saying is

1) let's look at Night of the living dead 1968 (picked it because I know there are many versions on BD). You can get the Criterion, Forgotten Films,Mill Creek Entertainment... versions from each studio

If Vudu has an agreement with only one of those studios for D2D of their version of the film it is normal that the UPC from the others won't work because Vudu does not have such an agreement with the others

2) even if ll the different versions should be included, the reality is the studio would need to give all the UPCs for the film. when you look at a UPC there is nothing in the # that intrinsically means "true lies". the way UPC works is a company decides to buy a range ( and if they run out they can buy more ranges) and then they associate one of the UPCs with a product. So if a film was released with UPC1 UPC2 and UPC3 it is up to the studio to let Vudu know those three are interchangeable.

It is annoying for the consumer but in either cases I don't see it as Vudu's mistake.

In the case of the DVD release of True Lies, I can only find two releases of it, both by 20th Century Fox, and each has a different barcode. It was just my dumb luck to have the one that does not work. And, yes, I am aware of the work around.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

Lol, so if Penguin buys a film on BD at less then MRSP it does not tell the studio that he is willing to buy that film, but when you watch it on streaming somehow that somehow helps physical media.

Paying $2-$3 for "hundreds" of blu-rays is pretty far below MSRP. So far below in fact that the studios likely took a loss on these purchases. Losses are not motivational and they do not encourage the studios to release more content on disc.

If these "hundreds" of blu-rays were bought used, the studios definitely made nothing from these purchases and physical media was not supported at all. Purchasing used discs is not any different than when people buy digital codes on this website in that the film industry makes nothing in both cases. Making nothing is not very motivational, either.

Streaming is how I rent content; it is no different than if I watch a movie on TV. If I really like something that I watched on streaming, or on TV, I will buy that title on disc if it is available. I have done this many, many times, so, yes, my watching something on streaming or on TV often does help physical media. I pay the asking price, too, instead of waiting for a fire sale.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

yes and no. In Dec there was a bad storm and my sister lost her cable (and so internet), they came to my place and took a few films so that they have stuff to watch. If someone stole my identity, emptied my bank accounts, ruined my credit rating, caused my business to close, I would still be able to watch any of the films I have collected over the last decades as I am rebuilding my life. Would someone that only does streaming be able to do the same? In Jan I did not spend one penny on "entertainment" (Tv/films) I feel I could easily agree not to spend any money (or mooch off of someone else) for as many months as anyone here wants to do, would someone that just does streaming/pay TV be able to do the same?

You have a large collection to fall on and I agree someone can change from company X to company Y. But someone that only rents will always need to continue to rent (unless they change to buying)

The other side to your scary identity theft story is what if a fire or some other disaster destroys your home and all of your possessions. Insurance will not pay you anywhere near enough money to replace your library unless you add a special policy, or rider, at considerable expense that specifically covers one's collections. While you are recovering from this tremendous loss, you can log into your streaming services and/or digital collection from wherever you are and enjoy some much needed entertainment.

I buy all of my content on disc, so I have the "safety net" that you describe as well as the one that I just described. I redeem my digital codes for remote access and I use streaming and an over the air antenna to watch titles that I likely will not want to own, but that I still want to see at least once. By doing all of these things, I have the widest possible access to home video entertainment.

Lastly, sharing subscription streaming accounts is not "mooching." Such sharing is perfectly permitted under their terms of service and people share their accounts of their own free will with the people that they choose to share them.

I share a streaming account with others and they share theirs with me. Many people do exactly this: I pay for one, they pay for one, and we both share. All we did was come to a mutually beneficial agreement that is in full compliance with the terms of service.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Good point. It’s the same with 3D titles. Don’t hang around for the lowest price, support the format by paying full price. If we all did that with 3DFA releases we probably wouldn’t have House Of Wax, Creature From The Black Lagoon, The Mask, The Maze, Inferno, It Came From Outer Space, The Bubble, Parasite, 3D Rarities, etc..

On the topic of Blu-ray purchases, with the exception of catalogue obviously, all my buys are blind. You can’t beat the excitement of a fresh film on movie night. I have a good success ratio of around 90% so it’s worked for me. I read spoiler free reviews at all times and I have often researched the film well in advance. I have watched 10 films so far this year (from my Blu-ray purchases) and I have been very happy with 9 of them.

I usually like to know basic things before making a purchase like the movie's genre, the cast, the director, and maybe a one or two sentence description of the story at most. I am also interested in how well a movie is generally regarded, by both audiences and critics, but that is more just my curiosity than a deciding factor. I find it interesting when both audiences and critics overwhelmingly love or hate a movie and when they have polar opposite feelings.

I make my share of blind buys, too, and I am more inclined to do so if the price is attractive. Gambling $25 on a blind buy is a less frequent occurrence. I'm on a fixed income afterall.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

right now I have 64 films and 2 Tv seasons on my unwatched shelf and 57 items on my PVR. Am I a hermit because I have not seen those? how about stuff I decided not to PVR or buy because there is too much content I want to see already? we all need to find that goldilocks content to fill up our time and at least for me there is just way too much of it. accepting more crap just so that I can say there is even more crap I don't have time for is useless IMHO.

I described him that way because of how he actively avoids learning about new content, specifically content not available on disc, and because of his insistence upon only watching content that he has purchased. He is walling himself off from both new release information and arbitrarily denying himself access to every title that is not available for purchase. I also acknowledged that these are his choices to make; I just think that they are extreme.

I have a lot of content that I have yet to watch, too, but I still try to stay informed about what's new, both catalog and literally brand new. I do not restrict myself from seeing something just because I can't buy it. As I said earlier, I do not want to own everything that I watch, but I wish to see everything that I want. There will always be content that you can't buy or that you can't stream, but I will watch what I want to see from whomever is offering it. I did this before streaming existed and I am doing the same thing now.

[JohnAV]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I have a lot of content that I have yet to watch, too

Judging by the size of your collection that is more or less guaranteed. Do you ever think of how many years you could hold out if the world ended as long as the HT worked?

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by JohnAV

Judging by the size of your collection that is more or less guaranteed. Do you ever think of how many years you could hold out if the world ended as long as the HT worked?

Based upon my collection statistics, it would take me 6.75 years to watch my entire collection if I watched every day for 8 hours per day. It would take even longer when you add in other formats, such as my laserdiscs, etc.

Give me a generator and I'm ready for the zombie apocalypse.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by cheez avenger

I don't blind buy films, or very rarely do, at this point. I have to budget myself with material nowadays especially when I'm trying to upgrade components, etc. If anything, I'll find a site that has a streaming version or hit up my local library system, Kanopy, Hoopla, etc., and use them for recon. Now if I do end up liking a film then i will definitely buy it.

But you have spoilt the whole experience by then. Your first experience of that film is inferior picture and audio. It lessens the impact imo.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I usually like to know basic things before making a purchase like the movie's genre, the cast, the director, and maybe a one or two sentence description of the story at most. I am also interested in how well a movie is generally regarded, by both audiences and critics, but that is more just my curiosity than a deciding factor. I find it interesting when both audiences and critics overwhelmingly love or hate a movie and when they have polar opposite feelings.

I make my share of blind buys, too, and I am more inclined to do so if the price is attractive. Gambling $25 on a blind buy is a less frequent occurrence. I'm on a fixed income afterall.

It’s no gamble to me. £15, people spend three times that on a night out on the drink. For that price I get movie night, repeat watches and excellent A/V quality. It’s a no brainer.
Having said that, I do buy in a takeaway.

It’s my idea of heaven, especially if I have just watched my team win earlier in the day. Perfect day spent with family and then on my lonesome the way I like to watch films.

[cheez avenger]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

But you have spoilt the whole experience by then. Your first experience of that film is inferior picture and audio. It lessens the impact imo.

Not to me. Because if I go blind buying the BD and it sucks, I just wasted my money on that particular BD that I could have easily put towards something good. Either something else that I like but don't own, etc.

For example, I just rented a film from Amazon this morning that I also just finished watching. It cost me $4.99 to rent in HD, and it was just ok. It was released stateside by Kino for more than $22 on BD. It's not available on any of the free sites to stream anywhere yet. If I had spent the money on the BD I would have been upset because it wasn't worth the purchase. At least now, I sampled it, and I don't need it in my collection at all. If I ever want to watch it again, I'm sure my public library will carry the DVD later on.

I very rarely ever blind-buy. I'd rather leverage my money in other things that are more of a sure bet. In fact, one of the 4K discs that I will be blind-buying is that of the new Richard Stanley film "The Colour Out of Space." Why? Because of Stanley's track record. Hardware is a masterpiece and I dig the rest of his output. The reward outweighs the risk in this case.

[gotmule]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I described him that way because of how he actively avoids learning about new content, specifically content not available on disc, and because of his insistence upon only watching content that he has purchased. He is walling himself off from both new release information and arbitrarily denying himself access to every title that is not available for purchase. I also acknowledged that these are his choices to make; I just think that they are extreme.

I have a lot of content that I have yet to watch, too, but I still try to stay informed about what's new, both catalog and literally brand new. I do not restrict myself from seeing something just because I can't buy it. As I said earlier, I do not want to own everything that I watch, but I wish to see everything that I want. There will always be content that you can't buy or that you can't stream, but I will watch what I want to see from whomever is offering it. I did this before streaming existed and I am doing the same thing now.

I have been kicking this around for about year now, whether to get an Apple TV to start checking out some shows that have not come out on disc yet, and may never. Where I think I have landed is to wait until I retire in a couple of years, as I should in theory have more time to dig into a lot of the shows that are and will be offered. I appreciate this current debate, and like you guys, have a lot of content sitting there never played. My time away from work certainly has competing interests, as I am a sports fan, I am always working my way through a book, I listen to about two hours of music a day, I go to the gym just about every day, and lastly but most importantly, happily married for 26 years.

The other day, I counted 33 albums that have been unwrapped but have never seen my turntable. Currently, there are 9 movies and 2 TV series I have not watched yet that I own on disc.

The other aspect that nudges me towards not streaming a show is that a lot of them sound great on disc, and to stream something in a compromised quality means that I would lessening the experience. I don’t see myself watching a tv series twice with the exception of maybe a Breaking Bad, so to stream something and to say I will buy it afterwards is doesnt make sense. I have close to 200 movies that i enjoyed as a disc rental enough to buy on disc that have never been in my Oppo, so I can’t see adding whole tv shows to that growing list.

I manage about 140 people, and am always hearing about shows that are appealing, so it is tempting...but for now, not joining the streaming world is a way for me to filter out some choices, and to try and balance options competing for my attention and time.

One day however, I can see my wife and I streaming shows not in my home theater, but upstairs in the family room, as I know we would enjoy it.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by cheez avenger

Not to me. Because if I go blind buying the BD and it sucks, I just wasted my money on that particular BD that I could have easily put towards something good. Either something else that I like but don't own, etc.

For example, I just rented a film from Amazon this morning that I also just finished watching. It cost me $4.99 to rent in HD, and it was just ok. It was released stateside by Kino for more than $22 on BD. It's not available on any of the free sites to stream anywhere yet. If I had spent the money on the BD I would have been upset because it wasn't worth the purchase. At least now, I sampled it, and I don't need it in my collection at all. If I ever want to watch it again, I'm sure my public library will carry the DVD later on.

I very rarely ever blind-buy. I'd rather leverage my money in other things that are more of a sure bet. In fact, one of the 4K discs that I will be blind-buying is that of the new Richard Stanley film "The Colour Out of Space." Why? Because of Stanley's track record. Hardware is a masterpiece and I dig the rest of his output. The reward outweighs the risk in this case.

That would cheapen the whole thing for me but fair play. If that’s your way, that’s your way.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by gotmule

I have been kicking this around for about year now, whether to get an Apple TV to start checking out some shows that have not come out on disc yet, and may never. Where I think I have landed is to wait until I retire in a couple of years, as I should in theory have more time to dig into a lot of the shows that are and will be offered. I appreciate this current debate, and like you guys, have a lot of content sitting there never played. My time away from work certainly has competing interests, as I am a sports fan, I am always working my way through a book, I listen to about two hours of music a day, I go to the gym just about every day, and lastly but most importantly, happily married for 26 years.

The other day, I counted 33 albums that have been unwrapped but have never seen my turntable. Currently, there are 9 movies and 2 TV series I have not watched yet that I own on disc.

The other aspect that nudges me towards not streaming a show is that a lot of them sound great on disc, and to stream something in a compromised quality means that I would lessening the experience. I don’t see myself watching a tv series twice with the exception of maybe a Breaking Bad, so to stream something and to say I will buy it afterwards is doesnt make sense. I have close to 200 movies that i enjoyed as a disc rental enough to buy on disc that have never been in my Oppo, so I can’t see adding whole tv shows to that growing list.

I manage about 140 people, and am always hearing about shows that are appealing, so it is tempting...but for now, not joining the streaming world is a way for me to filter out some choices, and to try and balance options competing for my attention and time.

One day however, I can see my wife and I streaming shows not in my home theater, but upstairs in the family room, as I know we would enjoy it.

Even with tv shows, you are still cheapening the experience though. Think of things like Chernobyl, where detail is everything.

When you say the family room, do you mean sacrificing your projector for a tv viewing? That doesn’t sound like a good idea to me. Couldn’t you and your wife just watch shows on your projector?

[gotmule]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Even with tv shows, you are still cheapening the experience though. Think of things like Chernobyl, where detail is everything.

When you say the family room, do you mean sacrificing your projector for a tv viewing? That doesn’t sound like a good idea to me. Couldn’t you and your wife just watch shows on your projector?

I do mean that, and yes, I know. But I have a no pet rule in the basement, as I would lose my mind if a cat jumped up on anything and scratched it. It is pretty difficult to get my wife downstairs to watch a movie currently, as one of her biggest stress reducers is to simply hang out upstairs reading a book with a cat on her lap. She also works, and needs to unplug, so that is usually where you can find her. As I type this, she is doing exactly that as I am taking care of dinner. I have a Sirloin on the grill, baked potatoes, and green beans going. We both are good cooks, and usually take turns, and today was her day to relax.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by gotmule

I do mean that, and yes, I know. But I have a no pet rule in the basement, as I would lose my mind if a cat jumped up on anything and scratched it. It is pretty difficult to get my wife downstairs to watch a movie currently, as one of her biggest stress reducers is to simply hang out upstairs reading a book with a cat on her lap. She also works, and needs to unplug, so that is usually where you can find her. As I type this, she is doing exactly that as I am taking care of dinner. I have a Sirloin on the grill, baked potatoes, and green beans going. We both are good cooks, and usually take turns, and today was her day to relax.

Would break my heart knowing I have a projector set up lol.

Never mind, enjoy your dinner. Sounds good.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

It’s no gamble to me. £15, people spend three times that on a night out on the drink. For that price I get movie night, repeat watches and excellent A/V quality. It’s a no brainer.
Having said that, I do buy in a takeaway.

It’s my idea of heaven, especially if I have just watched my team win earlier in the day. Perfect day spent with family and then on my lonesome the way I like to watch films.

The funny thing is that I buy so many movies that by the time I actually get around to watching some of them, I have already forgotten why I bought them in the first place making the net result the same as a blind buy.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

But you have spoilt the whole experience by then. Your first experience of that film is inferior picture and audio. It lessens the impact imo.

I think calling it a "spoilt experience" is a bit hyperbolic. Streaming doesn't offer the best presentation in most cases, but it's hardly the same as watching a pan & scan VHS tape on an old tube TV, either.

Much of what I stream are titles that I wind up never seeing again, by choice, and that first experience will be the only experience. If it turns out to be something that I love, I will buy it on disc, but that is the exception not the rule. By the time that I watch it again, it will be pretty close to being like watching it for the first time.

The experience I hate is to have spent $20+ on a title and not like it and then never watch it again. Wasting my money annoys me far more than watching a movie in streaming quality ever does. Thankfully, this seldom happens as I am pretty good about only buying titles that I really do like.