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The Hobbit Trilogy Discussion Thread
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The Hobbit is an upcoming two-part film based on the novel of the same name by J. R. R. Tolkien. The film is in development for releases in December 2011 (Part 1) and December 2012 (Part 2) and will be directed by Guillermo del Toro, with Peter Jackson, director of The Lord of the Rings film trilogy, serving as executive producer and co-writer. Originally, both parts would have served as separate films. The first would have adapted The Hobbit and the second would have bridged the gap between this and The Lord of the Rings. It is the director's intention to split and expand the narrative of The Hobbit over two parts of a singular film.
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UPDATES:
Updated July 28
What Peter Jackson plans for the two Hobbit movies and why
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Today producer/director Peter Jackson talks about The Hobbit films, updates us on their status, debunks a few rumors and talks about what the two movies will actually encompass and why.
Among the highlights: The script for the first film is about three weeks away; no casting has been decided; the two movies will encompass the story in the book and won't be one movie about the book and a second to bridge the period between The Hobbit and The Fellowship of the Ring, as has been speculated; and the films will draw in narratives from the same era as told in other writings.
This is part two of our group interview with Jackson from Comic-Con in San Diego last week; part one, about The Lovely Bones, posted yesterday, and part three, about his upcoming sci-fi action movie District 9, posts tomorrow.
Jackson first talked about his decision to hire Guillermo del Toro to direct the two movies, based on J.R.R. Tolkien's fantasy book and precursor to The Lord of the Rings.
"Guillermo's there not because I'm a mentor of him, but I just thought he would do a terrific job with that film," Jackson said. "It wasn't the type of movie I [wanted] to give to a young, novice filmmaker and have them sort of godfather it through. I wanted someone who ... was established, who I could trust with it. ... With The Hobbit, I really don't want to ... be too involved in looking over the shoulder of the director."
Jackson added that he chose not to direct the films himself for a specific reason: "So I didn't have to compete against myself," he said. "Because with the Lord of the Rings movies I did make, those were the very best films that I could make, given the circumstances and everything else. ... I poured my heart and soul into those films, and I just thought that I'd given everything I could to The Lord of the Rings, and now, with The Hobbit, I'd have to go there again, and now I'd be competing against myself. And how did I shoot Hobbiton the first time around? And how did I shoot Gandalf coming through the door? Now I'd have to look back at what I did the first time and do something different. Or not. And suddenly I could just imagine myself having this rather weird year or two where I was relating to my own work in a way in which I didn't feel comfortable. So I thought that the best thing—and honestly the best thing for the project and the fans of Tolkien and everything else—was to find another filmmaker who would do a really great job, and let them shoot Gandalf coming in the door, and let's all enjoy what they do with it and give somebody else a chance to do something fresh and original with it."
Jackson remains heavily involved, writing the scripts with longtime collaborators Fran Walsh and Philippa Boyens, as well as del Toro.
Following is an edited version of our conversation about The Hobbit, which is in preproduction in New Zealand.
Can you update us on the status of The Hobbit?
Jackson: ... We're about three weeks, I would say—give or take a little tailwind—about three weeks from turning over the first script for the first Hobbit movie to the studio. The process that we've been through so far is we wrote—and when I say "we," it's the four of us, it's Guillermo, Philippa, Fran and myself—we wrote an extensive treatment of the two films, which we pitched to the studio on a long conference call, and that was, I guess, about three or four months ago. And that was good, that went well, and they liked the idea. Because no one was really [in disagreement about] "Should it be one film? Should it be two films?"
gollum.jpg
There was talk about doing The Hobbit as one movie and doing an in-between-The Hobbit-and-The Lord of the Rings [movie], a bridge movie. ... We worked through the storyline, and we thought, "Well, obviously, we could squeeze The Hobbit into one movie," but even, like, a three-hour movie, you'd be amazed at how much of that story you'd have to lose. It's weird. I mean, the book ... is what the book is, and we just worked through a process of including all the events that we'd like to see in a film, and it was clear [that] it wasn't going to fit. Plus, the fact that we want to embellish a few things and put a little bit of extra ... narrative in for Gandalf and what he's doing in Dol Guldur and the Necromancer and various sort of side ... stories that are happening. And so we decided really that the two movies we were doing should be The Hobbit part one and part two.
So we devised this treatment, we pitched it to the studio, and they were happy with it. So then we set about, about three months ago we started in earnest to write the screenplay, which we're now about three weeks from delivering the first film.
And we haven't done any casting yet. I mean, that's the truth. There's all these rumors about people, but we haven't offered a single role to any actor yet, because everything's a process, and we haven't got a green light, and we haven't got a budget. And when you make an offer to an actor, one of the things that you have to obviously expect is they're going to ask to see a script, so we have to wait until we have a script. The other thing that you also need when you offer the role to an actor is you need dates. You need to be able to tell them when you want to start work and when they're going to finish work and how long they're going to work for. Because, obviously, an actor's deal is very much tied to the commitment of work. And so it's not until we deliver the script that we can break the script down, that we can get a budget, and then once we've got a budget we have to get a green light, which we haven't got.
I mean, we've been talking about releasing the first movie in December '11 and the second in December '12, and that's what we're aiming for. But we've only ever been aiming for it, and the studio obviously are not going to sign off on the films until they see a script and the budgets that are budgeting to that script.
So we're three weeks away from the first movie, the first script going in, and we haven't started working on the second script yet. We're just doing one at a time. But we'll start work with that as soon as we're done with the first script. And as soon as we do the first script, there'll be a breakdown of that done. We'll work out the needs of the cast. We'll do some extrapolating. We're not going to wait for the second script before we do a budget, so we'll use the first script, and we'll kind of do a guesstimate based on that how much we think the two films are going to cost. We'll be able to block out the actors' times that we think we're going to need. When we're going to start, when we're going to finish. What the duration of the [shoot is]. And then at that point we can actually go and talk to their agents and offer them a role. So there really isn't any casting news that I can report, and that's the reason why.
Have you talked about casting among yourselves? Are there people in mind that you can think of?
Jackson: ... There are some, yeah, which I wouldn't [want to say]. Obviously, there, ... the thing that we want to do is, any characters that were seen in The Lord of the Rings, we obviously want the actors that originated the characters to come back and play them again. So that obviously goes without saying.
And in terms of new characters, in some regards we are talking about people as ideas, but ... obviously it would be wrong of me to talk about that here, because we should talk to the actors themselves first before we talk about it over the 'net.
And in other ways we're waiting until we finish the script, because ... a key bit of casting are the dwarves, and the dwarves are ... important characters in the sense that they're a variety of personalities. And we're developing up those personalities as we write the script. And it's very fluid, and we don't ... even want to start thinking about who would play those roles of the dwarves until we really nail the scripts. Because, you know, is this Happy or Sleepy or Dopey or Grumpy or Doc? We need to know who's who. ... We need to know the personality of the particular character and what their function in the story is before we really can figure out what actor would be suitable for that role. So ... we're not really thinking too much about that at the moment.
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Updated July 19
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We’ve gotten so used to movies being shot with excessive CGI backgrounds that it’s kind of refreshing to know that someone is out there, in wide open spaces, actually building a life-size set. The One Ring is following around Guillermo del Toro’s production team for The Hobbit, and they managed to snap still photos of construction underway in New Zealand, where they’re rebuilding the fantastic Hobbiton set from Lord of the Rings.
The plan is simply to get it back in Hobbit shape, while at the same time adding perhaps a little more. Right now they’re planting hedgerows, fruit trees, and extending the path that runs in front of Bilbo and Frodo’s house at Bag End. New Hobbit holes have been marked out and should be going in, but even without any of that it’s still one of the most iconic locations in film history. Click over to The One Ring to see the slow return of Hobbiton.
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Updated July 18
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Originally Posted by Diesel
Lawsuit Seeks to Derail The Hobbit, No Bilbo Casting At Comic Con
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Yesterday we helped perpetuate the rumor that Guillermo del Toro and Peter Jackson might announce the actor who’ll play Bilbo Baggins in The Hobbit while at San Diego Comic Con next week. But reportedly, that isn’t happening. No surprise, but too bad. News would have livened up the Con quite a bit. Why won’t we hear anything? Because according to Peter Jackson, who spoke to Empire, the script isn’t done. “No, we won’t be announcing Bilbo for a little while. We’re starting to think about casting, but we’re knee-deep in the script right now. And when we do go to actors, they’re probably going to ask to see a script, so we’re powering ahead with getting the first draft done.”
Then again, if a Tolkien family lawsuit (yes, another LOTR lawsuit) takes its toll, the film might not happen at all. Insert ominous foley effects here, and then hit the jump to read more.
The bottom line is that the Tolkien family claims that they’re owed $220m from New Line to cover back profit payments from the Lord of the Rings trilogy. The family heirs are suing New Line claiming breach of contract, and as part of the suit are asking to recover all further film rights to Tolkein’s work. If that somehow went through, The Hobbit film (as currently set up at new Line and MGM) would be toast.
In 1969, JRR Tolkien sold the film rights for 250,000 pounds and 7.5% of future profits. But the family says they haven’t been paid anything out of the trilogy’s $6b worldwide sales. The Guardian reports that New Line lawyers say the original contract terms are ambiguous; Tolkien family lawyer Bonnie Eskenazi says “Should the case go all the way to trial, we are confident that New Line will lose its rights to The Hobbit.”
This is lawsuit number three regarding New Line and undistributed profits from the trilogy. Peter Jackson reached an undisclosed settlement in 2007, and Saul Zaentz settled in 2005. Hollywood accounting is notoriously creative and self-serving, and New Line (which struggled before being folded into Warner Bros) has been more determined than most.
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Updated July 16
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When Peter Jackson and Guillermo del Toro get The Hobbit going before cameras soon, Ian Holm, who played Hobbit hero Bilbo Baggins in the Lord of the Rings trilogy, won’t be back in big rubber feet. Casting Bilbo is a big deal; any actor chosen will have to hold his own against a horde of effects while still putting across a lot of character. Now three names are increasingly being rumored as options for Jackson and del Toro: Dr. Who’s David Tennant; Wanted’s James McAvoy; and Harry Potter’s Daniel Radcliffe. Musing about the options and probability of all three after the break.
Peter Jackson will be at the San Diego Comic Con next week, leading to supposition that we’ll get a casting announcement then. David Tennant is an interesting option; he’s making his first Comic Con appearance next week, which was originally surmised to be part of a push for a Dr. Who feature film. Now the Hero Complex blog of the LA Times wonders if he might not actually be there because of The Hobbit. Tennant would certainly be a neat choice. He’s done great things in Dr. Who and isn’t wildly exposed outside of genre circles, which would allow mainstream audiences to approach his work as Bilbo with fresh eyes.
That’s exactly why having Daniel Radcliffe’s name in the rumor ring doesn’t make sense. He’s already demonstrated an interest in playing smaller roles after Harry Potter; why would Radcliffe jump right into a long commitment to another big fantasy adaptation just as his last Potter films wrap? He can’t possibly need the payday.
That leaves James McAvoy, possibly more flexible and capable than Tennant, and only a bit more exposed. Sure, a lot of people saw Wanted (and some even saw Atonement and The Last King of Scotland) but McAvoy is hardly a household name. Tennant could get Bilbo’s good nature perfectly, but it’s easier to imagine McAvoy playing a little game with Gollum, down in the dark.
Or, it should go without saying, maybe it will be none of these names at all. If I recall correctly, McAvoy was originally rumored as a choice by one of the British tabloids, and trusting those is about as safe as chowing down on week-old roadkill.
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In order to publicise The Strain, his new vampire novel written by with Chuck Hogan, Guillermo del Toro
has been doing an awful lot of interviews. The best, perhaps, have been with MTV - at least in terms of the off-topic news they’ve managed to squeeze out of the fella. Not only have they had him all but spell out where the split between two films is going to come in his telling of The Hobbit, they’ve even teased out a confession that, at last, Del Toro is down to a single choice in the casting of Bilbo Baggins.
The specific format of this Hobbit adaptation hasn’t been too clear until now, but the following quotes from Del Toro nail it down pretty solidly:
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I’m doing only two movies because I felt that that was the best way to service the book. I’m not saying the other notion was not discussed. We discussed it a large degree. But I felt that for me, the two films were the way to go.
When you read the book, there is only one place to break it really, and everybody knows it. It’s been discussed in forums and there’s a lot of people that are right. That’s where it’s going to break. So it’s very simple. What we’re doing is because we have the relationship between Bilbo and Thorin and all the dwarves, there is a logical place for that relationship. There is a moment in the book where something is accomplished that allows us to say, ‘Okay, on to the next one after this.’
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As for the inclusion of material from the appendices, it seems that the run time of the two films will be expanded with “White Council or the Dol Guldur additions.”
I’m personally 100% sure that the break point he’s talking about is when Bilbo and the dwarves escape the Mirkwood elves on a raft made of barrels. That’s the chapter Barrels out of Bond, which I think does pretty much mark the half way point. And by my reckoning, that means the White Council and Dol Guldur scenes would feature in the second film. I’m no Tolkien expert.
If you’re wanting to bet on who will play Bilbo, get down to the bookies now. Del Toro tells MTV to expect the casting news within “the next few weeks”. If I have to pin my colours to one particular option… ohh… I’m finding it a tough call, but I think Ewen McGregor is looking pretty likely.
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Last edited by Sussudio; 04-22-2010 at 08:14 PM.
Reason: updated OP
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Glad he is returning, would not be the same if he wasn't in the movie.
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