Denon AVR-1610 & 1910 Receiver Thread

[blarneyrubble]

Denon AVR-1610


denon_avr1610T.jpg


Denon AVR-1910

denon_avr1910T.jpg


I have been lurking at this site for a few months now and have jumped into some discussions but I have a question that I want to ask all informed people. I recently upgraded my receiver from a Denon avr 887 to a avr 1910. It was a step down in power but gave me HD audio decoding. Anyways, I am not happy with my selection. The decrease in power is very noticeable, the front display is so small that I can't see it from my seat, and I am getting some strange sounds emitting from my speakers during Pro Logic IIx and Neo:6.

The thing that drew me back to the Denon way its ability to simulate the sixth and seventh speaker during 5.1 HD audio playback. I want that in whatever receiver I end up with. I am looking at returning the 1910 and getting either the Denon avr 2309ci, Marantz 5003 (I know it has the same power rating but Marantz is known for being a little bit more honest with their power ratings), the Pioneer VSX-1019AH-K, Sony ES STR-DA2400ES or the Onkyo 607. Can anybody tell me, and be 100% certain, if any of these will simulate the sixth and seventh channel during 5.1 lossless playback?

[callas01]

Originally Posted by blarneyrubble

I have been lurking at this site for a few months now and have jumped into some discussions but I have a question that I want to ask all informed people. I recently upgraded my receiver from a Denon avr 887 to a avr 1910. It was a step down in power but gave me HD audio decoding. Anyways, I am not happy with my selection. The decrease in power is very noticeable, the front display is so small that I can't see it from my seat, and I am getting some strange sounds emitting from my speakers during Pro Logic IIx and Neo:6.

The thing that drew me back to the Denon way its ability to simulate the sixth and seventh speaker during 5.1 HD audio playback. I want that in whatever receiver I end up with. I am looking at returning the 1910 and getting either the Denon avr 2309ci, Marantz 5003 (I know it has the same power rating but Marantz is known for being a little bit more honest with their power ratings), the Pioneer VSX-1019AH-K, Sony ES STR-DA2400ES or the Onkyo 607. Can anybody tell me, and be 100% certain, if any of these will simulate the sixth and seventh channel during 5.1 lossless playback?

almost all receivers now have DSPs (digital sound processing) that will create a virtual speaker or 2. I would say out of the ones listed you will be happiest with either the Denon 2309, the Marantz 5003 or the Sony ES. This was posted in another thread, but this is why I want that same Marantz....

Marantz SR5003 A/V Receiver:
HT Labs Measures
HT Labs Measures
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 103.8 watts
1% distortion at 118.0 watts

Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 88.2 watts
1% distortion at 99.9 watts

from hometheatermag.com

Pretty accurate to the stated 90 WPC that they call out on the spec sheet, wouldn't you say.

[reyz]

Originally Posted by callas01

almost all receivers now have DSPs (digital sound processing) that will create a virtual speaker or 2. I would say out of the ones listed you will be happiest with either the Denon 2309, the Marantz 5003 or the Sony ES. This was posted in another thread, but this is why I want that same Marantz....

Marantz SR5003 A/V Receiver:
HT Labs Measures
HT Labs Measures
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 103.8 watts
1% distortion at 118.0 watts

Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 88.2 watts
1% distortion at 99.9 watts

from hometheatermag.com

Pretty accurate to the stated 90 WPC that they call out on the spec sheet, wouldn't you say.

keep scouting for the sr-5003, i'm sure you'll find a good deal for it soon!

with mine being at the same price point as the rx-v66x models, i know i did

[blarneyrubble]

Originally Posted by callas01

almost all receivers now have DSPs (digital sound processing) that will create a virtual speaker or 2. I would say out of the ones listed you will be happiest with either the Denon 2309, the Marantz 5003 or the Sony ES. This was posted in another thread, but this is why I want that same Marantz....

Marantz SR5003 A/V Receiver:
HT Labs Measures
HT Labs Measures
Five channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 103.8 watts
1% distortion at 118.0 watts

Seven channels driven continuously into 8-ohm loads:
0.1% distortion at 88.2 watts
1% distortion at 99.9 watts

from hometheatermag.com

Pretty accurate to the stated 90 WPC that they call out on the spec sheet, wouldn't you say.

I would say so! I spoke with a sony rep online and was told that the sony could not do it. I also chated with a sales rep at crutchfield who told me that the Marantz could not do it either. I sent Marantz an email a few hour ago and will hopefully get a reply today.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by blarneyrubble

I would say so! I spoke with a sony rep online and was told that the sony could not do it. I also chated with a sales rep at crutchfield who told me that the Marantz could not do it either. I sent Marantz an email a few hour ago and will hopefully get a reply today.

I have the Sony 920 which is the ES2400 minus RS-232 port and pre-outs, and YES it can create virtual speakers, the Sony rep sounds like a dip-$hit. I use a 6.1 setup and most movies are 5.1, but I get sound out of the SB speaker all the time. I used the movie button on the remote which puts it into Cinema Studio A, B, or C and yes it does create the virtual speaker and great audio. Since I have 6 speakers I also have the processing set to Neo 6 Cinema.

I would expect that Marantz has this also since specs show Discrete&Matrix6.1 and under DD virtual speakers........ Test this out at your local dealer.

EDIT:: on my Sony 920, if I watch a movie in 7.1 HD audio, and use the BDP to decode and send over the audio via LPCM, I get 6.1 HD audio as a discrete speaker, not a virtual one. FYI

[HAMP]

If your looking to get the Marantz 5003, There is a seller on Blu-ray that is selling his.
Here is the Link to the posting for the it.

I Know if I was in the market for one, I would get this one from him.

I just added a Denon 789 to my bedroom before he was selling it and I'm really happy with it.

[blarneyrubble]

Originally Posted by callas01

I have the Sony 920 which is the ES2400 minus RS-232 port and pre-outs, and YES it can create virtual speakers, the Sony rep sounds like a dip-$hit. I use a 6.1 setup and most movies are 5.1, but I get sound out of the SB speaker all the time. I used the movie button on the remote which puts it into Cinema Studio A, B, or C and yes it does create the virtual speaker and great audio. Since I have 6 speakers I also have the processing set to Neo 6 Cinema.

I would expect that Marantz has this also since specs show Discrete&Matrix6.1 and under DD virtual speakers........ Test this out at your local dealer.

EDIT:: on my Sony 920, if I watch a movie in 7.1 HD audio, and use the BDP to decode and send over the audio via LPCM, I get 6.1 HD audio as a discrete speaker, not a virtual one. FYI

Interesting?!? I am heading over to my local high end electronics experts, no not BB, and they sell all of the brands I am looking at. Hopefully somebody there knows.

[blarneyrubble]

Originally Posted by HAMP

If your looking to get the Marantz 5003, There is a seller on Blu-ray that is selling his.
Here is the Link to the posting for the it.

I Know if I was in the market for one, I would get this one from him.

I just added a Denon 789 to my bedroom before he was selling it and I'm really happy with it.

I will keep that in mind, if he still has it. I did find one online for $600 w/3 year extended warranty. If he has all of the paperwork to prove the warranty I may go with his.

Thanks.

[HAMP]

Originally Posted by blarneyrubble

I will keep that in mind, if he still has it. I did find one online for $600 w/3 year extended warranty. If he has all of the paperwork to prove the warranty I may go with his.

Thanks.

Keep us in mind and let us know how it turns out!

[PitbullMike]

Originally Posted by blarneyrubble

I will keep that in mind, if he still has it. I did find one online for $600 w/3 year extended warranty. If he has all of the paperwork to prove the warranty I may go with his.

Thanks.

Sorry just sold my sr5003

[blarneyrubble]

Originally Posted by PitbullMike

Sorry just sold my sr5003

Too bad. Did you use this with a 5.1 system or 7.1? If 7.1 can you answer my original question?

[ZIPPO]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong. If you play a 7.1 lossless audio track on a 5.1 system, the audio will be down mixed to 5.1. If you play a (Dolby TrueHD or Multi Ch-PCM) 5.1 lossless audio track on a 7.1 system, you can apply Dolby PLIIx to get 7 channel audio(won't work on DTS-HD MSTR 5.1). You can also apply Dolby Digital EX mode or DTS ES mode on (Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD MSTR or Multi Ch-PCM) to get sound from all seven channels.

At least that's what my Marantz SR6003 manual says(page 78).

[Y2K000]

I got a Denon 1909 which I bought in August 2008 and I am blown away. At first I had issues with my reciever, but now I am all set to go. I had a previous Sony reciever. I plan on using my Denon 1909 for say 5 years before I get another one.

[blarneyrubble]

Originally Posted by ZIPPO

Someone correct me if I'm wrong. If you play a 7.1 lossless audio track on a 5.1 system, the audio will be down mixed to 5.1. If you play a (Dolby TrueHD or Multi Ch-PCM) 5.1 lossless audio track on a 7.1 system, you can apply Dolby PLIIx to get 7 channel audio(won't work on DTS-HD MSTR 5.1). You can also apply Dolby Digital EX mode or DTS ES mode on (Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD MSTR or Multi Ch-PCM) to get sound from all seven channels.

At least that's what my Marantz SR6003 manual says(page 78).

That might have answered it for me! I found the same thing in the 5003's manual. Hopefully the Marantz rep can verify this for me. I did go to my local Marantz dealer and the were about as much help as the 16 year olds at BB. The thing looked awesome though. So did the B&W 802D's,WOW!!

[PitbullMike]

Originally Posted by ZIPPO

Someone correct me if I'm wrong. If you play a 7.1 lossless audio track on a 5.1 system, the audio will be down mixed to 5.1. If you play a (Dolby TrueHD or Multi Ch-PCM) 5.1 lossless audio track on a 7.1 system, you can apply Dolby PLIIx to get 7 channel audio(won't work on DTS-HD MSTR 5.1). You can also apply Dolby Digital EX mode or DTS ES mode on (Dolby TrueHD, DTS-HD MSTR or Multi Ch-PCM) to get sound from all seven channels.

At least that's what my Marantz SR6003 manual says(page 78).

I used a 6.1 set up with my Marantz sr5003,ZIPPO sounds about right If you do decide to get it you wont be disappointed bc its an awesome receiver.

[reyz]

yes. its simply awesome. one minor flaw i discovered though (not a deal-breaker by any means)...

the Audyssey MultiEQ is applied to practically everything except Source/Pure Direct (goes without saying) and when lossless audio is bitstreamed to the receiver to decode.

in these 2 instances, it won't be applied, HOWEVER, if you have a BDP that does (excellent) onboard decoding and then sents it PCM to the receiver, the Audyssey MultiEQ settings can be applied to the signal.

i know this can be a major pain in the ass for people who have BDPs that cant decode all of the latest HD audio formats, because if they don't have good room acoustics etc they might not like it because the HD audio signal will not be EQ-ed in any way to meet their room acoustics.

however, THAT being said, many people have reviewed the Audyssey MultiEQ on the marantz sr-x003 receivers to be pretty insufficient and often out of sync with actual optimum settings (one often has to adjust a lowered bass, etc) and there are many who do just use the marantz for what it is (trusting their engineers over Audyssey's) which i cant dispute because Marantz is naturally one of the best-sounding receivers out there in its price range (and sometimes beyond!) Furthermore, this is a moot point if you intend to get a BDP with excellent onboard lossless decoding, something inevitable for me (and hopefully many more owners) in the future

i am slightly perplexed enough to ask one question though.. how come marantz receivers are so much cheaper in asia (particularly SEA) than its counterparts in US/Europe??? i can often find standalone models, not bundled with speakers, on sale at a substantially cheaper price (even after currency converts) than you can find elsewhere in the world. apparently, marantz's market share here isnt as impressive as elsewhere, although technically yamaha always has had the upper hand globally, but here the marantz-yamaha proportion is way more unbalanced (and even more puzzling considering marantz's receivers here are mighty cheap). An example would be the 663/665 yammy models that retail for a couple hundred dollars more here than the sr-5003, which is the total reverse case over in the states, am i not wrong?

so anyone care to explain or have a good plausible theory? mine is that the home audio market here is an emerging one and yamaha sales reps are prevalent everywhere (incl the one who tried to cheat me, more on this guy if you care to ask) and perhaps have been driving sales with the majority of uninitiated consumers? hence marantz has no choice but to step up its game with discounted receivers? (a good steal for consumers like me if this is the case...) anyway, i really do hope its of the same make! although i have had some assurances from a few dealers. but just want to be sure...

but regardless, the marantz and the BA speakers have arrived earlier than expected.. picked them up today. absolutely worth the arduous self-pick up (and tricky cramming into the car), cant wait to pounce on the system asap!

[blarneyrubble]

Originally Posted by reyz

yes. its simply awesome. one minor flaw i discovered though (not a deal-breaker by any means)...

the Audyssey MultiEQ is applied to practically everything except Source/Pure Direct (goes without saying) and when lossless audio is bitstreamed to the receiver to decode.

in these 2 instances, it won't be applied, HOWEVER, if you have a BDP that does (excellent) onboard decoding and then sents it PCM to the receiver, the Audyssey MultiEQ settings can be applied to the signal.

i know this can be a major pain in the ass for people who have BDPs that cant decode all of the latest HD audio formats, because if they don't have good room acoustics etc they might not like it because the HD audio signal will not be EQ-ed in any way to meet their room acoustics.

however, THAT being said, many people have reviewed the Audyssey MultiEQ on the marantz sr-x003 receivers to be pretty insufficient and often out of sync with actual optimum settings (one often has to adjust a lowered bass, etc) and there are many who do just use the marantz for what it is (trusting their engineers over Audyssey's) which i cant dispute because Marantz is naturally one of the best-sounding receivers out there in its price range (and sometimes beyond!) Furthermore, this is a moot point if you intend to get a BDP with excellent onboard lossless decoding, something inevitable for me (and hopefully many more owners) in the future

i am slightly perplexed enough to ask one question though.. how come marantz receivers are so much cheaper in asia (particularly SEA) than its counterparts in US/Europe??? i can often find standalone models, not bundled with speakers, on sale at a substantially cheaper price (even after currency converts) than you can find elsewhere in the world. apparently, marantz's market share here isnt as impressive as elsewhere, although technically yamaha always has had the upper hand globally, but here the marantz-yamaha proportion is way more unbalanced (and even more puzzling considering marantz's receivers here are mighty cheap). An example would be the 663/665 yammy models that retail for a couple hundred dollars more here than the sr-5003, which is the total reverse case over in the states, am i not wrong?

so anyone care to explain or have a good plausible theory? mine is that the home audio market here is an emerging one and yamaha sales reps are prevalent everywhere (incl the one who tried to cheat me, more on this guy if you care to ask) and perhaps have been driving sales with the majority of uninitiated consumers? hence marantz has no choice but to step up its game with discounted receivers? (a good steal for consumers like me if this is the case...) anyway, i really do hope its of the same make! although i have had some assurances from a few dealers. but just want to be sure...

but regardless, the marantz and the BA speakers have arrived earlier than expected.. picked them up today. absolutely worth the arduous self-pick up (and tricky cramming into the car), cant wait to pounce on the system asap!

Nice, which Blu Ray player do you have?

[reyz]

currently borrowing a PS3 from a relative of mine, which she hardly uses

in the meantime, will continue to scout out for a good BDP and eagerly anticipating the predicted mega-drop in prices for BD technology in general by the end of this year

though if you do need one urgently, you should look at the samsung bd-p1600 (go for the p3600 if you've got the extra budget) and the bd390 by LG. although the PS3 is a very good substitute if you're looking at gaming as well

[PitbullMike]

ow Reyz you have the Marantz sr5003 in silver?where did you find it?Ive seen one and it looks amazing

[reyz]

haha. i found it at a store called Audio House, though i doubt you'll see it over in the states..

interesting story behind it though! i was almost destined to get the black one, which apparently looks better at first glance. and many people rave about the black finish. however, i recalled seeing a poster somewhere else in the store which stated that the marantz-BA deal only had the silver options left for the SR-5003. this was after the dubious yamaha salesman pushed for me to get the black instead.

so i decided to approach the store manager instead and he was pretty surprised because he replied that there was only one black left - and it was the display unit. he said that all the brand-new stock left was silver-gold.

so ultimately i went with the latter.

i'm rather certain now that the salesman was pretty upset that i didnt get the yamaha from him in the end and was trying to con me with a used marantz receiver. tsk!

anyway, im highly pleased with the silver-gold sitting in my front cabinet now. i suppose the different colours depend on your setup and how you want the 'look' of your HT to be like. but i realised mine fits my HT setup perfectly and i feel a sense of exclusivity knowing i'm one of the rare few marantz owners who got the silver-gold instead. heh