Question about rear speakers.

[tippykitten]

I was wondering if it would be a good idea to use the same speakers that i use as my fronts to be my rears also. I was looking at getting some Polk Monitor 70's and was just wondering whether it would be a good idea to get two pairs (for both front and rear) or if i should get a less powerful speaker for the rears like maybe Monitor 50's?

[Fors*]

Originally Posted by tippykitten

I was wondering if it would be a good idea to use the same speakers that i use as my fronts to be my rears also. I was looking at getting some Polk Monitor 70's and was just wondering whether it would be a good idea to get two pairs (for both front and rear) or if i should get a less powerful speaker for the rears like maybe Monitor 50's?

Good question. You need to be careful that the surrounds don't overpower your front soundstage, as that is about 80-90% of your audio experience. The surrounds and rear surrounds mostly provide only the ambient and background noises you hear in a soundtrack, and should only "compliment" your entire audio sound. I think you may be pushing it a bit with the 70's, unless you can work on placement and in setting it up properly, perhaps with an SPL meter to allow the surround 70's to properly support the front 70's the way they should. Might be a tougher task in my opinion than it is worth. For convenience and money, I think I would go with the 50's, but this does not mean that having the 70's as surrounds would not work. It really comes down to what sounds good to your ears. Good luck!

[Yeha-Noha]

Originally Posted by tippykitten

I was wondering if it would be a good idea to use the same speakers that i use as my fronts to be my rears also. I was looking at getting some Polk Monitor 70's and was just wondering whether it would be a good idea to get two pairs (for both front and rear) or if i should get a less powerful speaker for the rears like maybe Monitor 50's?

I don't recommend using towers like that for rears unless you have a large room. I also don't recommend using the monitor 70s full range because a good subwoofer is going to do a much better job reproducing the louder bass content found in many film soundtracks that can go below 30 Hz.

If you do have a sub, don't waste your money by using towers as surrounds. And as forsberg21 suggested, you may end up with inferior sound if the towers are drawing attention to themselves which may happen rather easily in a smaller room or when the towers are at ear level.

Having said that, believe it or not, there can be a surprisingly good amount of bass mixed into the side and rear surrounds too. Someone who has a large enough HT room might ask: Hey wouldn't it be cool having large speakers running full range for the surrounds. Films that have plenty of loud explosions, bombs, cannon fire (POTC, Master and Commander), sauropod stampedes, and whatever else you can think of or imagine do have plenty of bass mixed into the surround channels. Yet, one needs to ponder, is it worth it? Because most of the time, they'll only be used for ambient environmental noises, car tire squeals and stuff like that. There is a problem too. To get the bass, when it's there, not only must surrounds be large enough to handle it, but they must also be in the proper position for the best bass response. That position might not be the best place for the surrounds or vice versa. Another problem with towers used as surrounds is setting them up so that they are about two feet higher than ear level for the best effect. Easier said than done.

That's why it makes more sense to use bookshelf sized speakers or dipole/bipoles that are designed to be used as surrounds.

[Hammie]

I've seen both suggestions. Usually in the high-end speaker forums they recommend the same exact tower speaker for all 5 or 7 speakers in an HT. Mostly because it puts the tweeter at the same height all around and a lot of users are listening to 5.1 music where this set up sounds better.

In an HT environment, you may not want as much bass going to your surrounds. Therefore, bookshelves or bipoles/dipoles will usually be fine.

In regards to using 70's as your surrounds, I think you would be better off getting 50's if you want towers and saving yourself some money.

[tippykitten]

Thanks for the help everyone. The room is fairly large (about 20 feet by 20 feet and will be primarily for movies). So it should be plenty big and the primary listening area is just about in the center of the room, so if i were to get smaller surrounds i would need to put them on stands because there would be nowhere to mount them. Are surrounds supposed to be that much higher than ear level? I was under the impression that ear level was the optimal height but i am not sure.

[talstarone]

Originally Posted by tippykitten

Thanks for the help everyone. The room is fairly large (about 20 feet by 20 feet and will be primarily for movies). So it should be plenty big and the primary listening area is just about in the center of the room, so if i were to get smaller surrounds i would need to put them on stands because there would be nowhere to mount them. Are surrounds supposed to be that much higher than ear level? I was under the impression that ear level was the optimal height but i am not sure.

Most surround speakers,or most speakers used as surrounds are recommended to be above ear level.(this helps them fill the room with a more indirect sound,instead of locating their position as distinctly as the front and center speakers).

A 20 X 20 is a good sized room and a wonderful room to occupy with a Home Theater(I envy your room size in that respect) .

If you look up at the top of the "Speaker" section,you will see a few threads on Surround Speakers and Bipole/Dipole Speakers.Bipolar speakers are the most highly recommended speakers for surround use.

I personally use a Hybrid Bipolar Speaker for ALL 4 of my Surrounds and it is,perhaps,the best addition and change I have made to my Home Theater.

Direct radiating speakers can be used effectively as well,but once you listen to the difference bipolar speakers make in filling out your surround sound field,you may think somewhat differently.
Also,using bipolars as surrounds,truly make it sound as if it your Surround Sound is coming from All directions.
I would suggest you try having at least 2 of your surround speakers as Bipolars,and going from there.

If you can go somewhere to audition some Bipolar speakers,Please do so.Listening first hand will truly let you be the best judge for what sounds best to your ears.

So,like all Home Theater topics,opinions will vary,and no one opinion is Absolutely Right.

But I do advise you to read some of Big Daddys threads on Surround Speakers and Bipolar speakers to get the best information and facts on this topic.

[FSUGeoff]

As far as timbre matching goes, anything in the monitor series will work. I have the 50's up front and the 30's for the rears, and it works beautifully.

As far as having the 50's in the back because the tweeters are at the same level, well thats just not true. The 70's are much larger towers than the 50's and as such the tweeters arn't at the same level. You would be better suited with getting adjustable stands and just measureing out the Monitor 30's or 40's from the floor so they are the same level as the tweeters in the 70's. As far as Bi-pole/Di-pole speakers they seem to be a pretty big hit around here, give them a listen espically in a large room like yours it will enlarge the rear soundstange which if your major use is HT (which you said it was) would be desirable.

[Yeha-Noha]

Originally Posted by tippykitten

Thanks for the help everyone. The room is fairly large (about 20 feet by 20 feet and will be primarily for movies). So it should be plenty big and the primary listening area is just about in the center of the room, so if i were to get smaller surrounds i would need to put them on stands because there would be nowhere to mount them. Are surrounds supposed to be that much higher than ear level? I was under the impression that ear level was the optimal height but i am not sure.

Wow, that's a question that will get you many conflicting answers.

Dobly Digital recommends 2 to 3 feet above ear level for HT use. Yet dts isn't specific as such. What they might be suggesting is having the surrounds at or near ear level from what I can tell from their HT speaker placement diagrams.

What it actually boils down to is your listening preferences. Do listen to mostly HT or like to critically listen to music? If the former, then I would mount them higher than ear level for the best surround effect. If you can't do that, and they end up being at ear level, then don't aim them at the listening position. Angle them off or have them tilted upward so as not to beam them directly at the listening position. If, OTOH, you do listen mostly to music like SACD, DVD-Audio, or BDs that have live concert recordings, then the surrounds should be at ear level.

[Fors*]

Originally Posted by rwojtalewicz

Wow, that's a question that will get you many conflicting answers.

Dobly Digital recommends 2 to 3 feet above ear level for HT use. Yet dts isn't specific as such. What they might be suggesting is having the surrounds at or near ear level from what I can tell from their HT speaker placement diagrams.

What it actually boils down to is your listening preferences. Do listen to mostly HT or like to critically listen to music? If the former, then I would mount them higher than ear level for the best surround effect. If you can't do that, and they end up being at ear level, then don't aim them at the listening position. Angle them off or have them tilted upward so as not to beam them directly at the listening position. If, OTOH, you do listen mostly to music like SACD, DVD-Audio, or BDs that have live concert recordings, then the surrounds should be at ear level.

I agree completely, angle them off if the surrounds are at ear level. It will help to complete a tighter and better balanced surround sound.

[Kirk Out]

i have polk r 150s for my l&r surrounds i have no sub i ran auddussy on my onkyo 606 and it set them at 80hz which to me is kinda loud would be okay to set them to 60 or lower someone out there help me out

[Yeha-Noha]

Originally Posted by cj19791979

i have polk r 150s for my l&r surrounds i have no sub i ran auddussy on my onkyo 606 and it set them at 80hz which to me is kinda loud would be okay to set them to 60 or lower someone out there help me out

I wouldn't recommend setting them even to 60 Hz. Leave them set to small with a 80 Hz crossover. A 60 Hz crossover is too low for those speakers. They have a bass cutoff frequency (f3) in the 60 to 65 Hz range. That's where the bass response is -3 db down and starts rolling off from there. Since you have no subwoofer, let your onkyo redirect the bass below 80 Hz to your main speakers. I hope you have tower speakers that are capable of reproducing the bass frequencies that are being redirected from you surrounds and center, if you have a center.

I highly recommend getting a good subwoofer. You'll get louder bass with less distortion that way. Then you could set your left/right towers or main speakers to 80 Hz or perhaps even to 60 Hz crossover. Even if your towers have good bass response down to f3 = 40 Hz or f10 = 30 Hz, just for an example, I still wouldn't set the crossover lower than 60 Hz. And if you do get a sub, still set the crossover for your surrounds at 80 Hz.