Help with 120hz and 24p please! - Blu-ray Forum

crispicazzo · 03-30-2010, 02:49 PM

Hey buddies!

I will get a Samsung 120hz TV and my question is, should I leave the 24p mode "on" in my Blu-Ray player? or I need to turned off the 24p mode?

Don´t will be look funny have a refresh rate of 120hz working with a video in 24p mode?

I´m so confused!!

Any help will be apreciatted.

Thank you!

ChrisV · 03-30-2010, 03:24 PM

If you are a film purist and want to see the film as the "so called directors intentions" put it on 24 fps mode. I don't use the 24p mode because I happen to like the smoother motion of having in 60 fps.

Also don't confuse 120hz with the Motionflow function on the Samsung tv. Many people don't like this function because it makes film look more like video. I happen to LOVE it. It makes Blu-rays and DVD's movies look much more 3D like, less juddery, more life like and in my opinion better than what the director intended something film purists hate. My advice to you would be try all the different modes and see which one you like best.

From my experience if you are a film purist keep the 24p on and the motionflow off. If you are just an average movie watcher it won't matter if 24p is on or off but keep the motionflow feature on medium or high and be amazed at the smoothness and life like picture quality.

crispicazzo · 03-30-2010, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisV

If you are a film purist and want to see the film as the "so called directors intentions" put it on 24 fps mode. I don't use the 24p mode because I happen to like the smoother motion of having in 60 fps.

Also don't confuse 120hz with the Motionflow function on the Samsung tv. Many people don't like this function because it makes film look more like video. I happen to LOVE it. It makes Blu-rays and DVD's movies look much more 3D like, less juddery, more life like and in my opinion better than what the director intended something film purists hate. My advice to you would be try all the different modes and see which one you like best.

From my experience if you are a film purist keep the 24p on and the motionflow off. If you are just an average movie watcher it won't matter if 24p is on or off but keep the motionflow feature on medium or high and be amazed at the smoothness and life like picture quality.

Thank you so much for your advices.
I will try then.

Still, in technical terms, it´s ok to have the 24p on in a 120hz TV?

Thanks.

DJ_NachoMan · 03-30-2010, 05:30 PM

The grand majority of people who watch bluray will tell you it's insane to watch in anything but 24p mode. I have to agree. To address you concern, yes it's absolutely 100% fine to run a 120hz LCD on 24p mode.

Personally i'm running a 240hz set in 24p mode and it looks phenomenal. I have blur reduction at 10 and judder reduction at 5. I feel the "soap opera effect" or the "video effect" mentioned above works well with animated films, but looks a little unrealistic on regular film. Most people will disable judder reduction to 0 or 1 or 2. I find 5 a good balance between maintaining a films original speed yet adding a bit of a smooth edge to it.

It all comes down to personal preference though. Whatever you think looks best, well, go with that!

crispicazzo · 03-30-2010, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ_NachoMan

The grand majority of people who watch bluray will tell you it's insane to watch in anything but 24p mode. I have to agree. To address you concern, yes it's absolutely 100% fine to run a 120hz LCD on 24p mode.

Personally i'm running a 240hz set in 24p mode and it looks phenomenal. I have blur reduction at 10 and judder reduction at 5. I feel the "soap opera effect" or the "video effect" mentioned above works well with animated films, but looks a little unrealistic on regular film. Most people will disable judder reduction to 0 or 1 or 2. I find 5 a good balance between maintaining a films original speed yet adding a bit of a smooth edge to it.

It all comes down to personal preference though. Whatever you think looks best, well, go with that!

Thank you so much!

DJ_NachoMan · 03-30-2010, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crispicazzo

Thank you so much!

I'm glad i could be of service.

crispicazzo · 03-31-2010, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ_NachoMan

I'm glad i could be of service.

connect42 · 03-31-2010, 04:29 PM

For what it is worth, these guys are right.
I have my LG 120Hz with the "TruMotion" set at high and the Sony player set at 24fps. I love it. Some don't.

Yeha-Noha · 04-01-2010, 08:38 PM

It may seem confusing at first. You basically have three choices:

1. Set the player to output 24p. Then set motion flow, motion control, and judder reduction OFF. It's not hard to imagine 24p being shown at 120 Hz. Think of it this way. If you repeat each frame of a 24p movie 5 times, you've in effect fooled your eyes into seeing it displayed as 24p yet at a 120 Hz refresh rate (24 X 5 = 120). The cinema you see is just like the cinema you see at theaters. This is the setting I prefer.

2. Set your player to output 24p. Then set motion control or motion flow to Medium (Standard) or High. I have a Sony. So I have to set CineMotion to Cinema 1 (Cinema 2 doesn't do anything). I don't know what you have to do to the Samsung. Those settings give me the 3D effect. The motion can also look exaggerated especially if motion flow is set to High. The downside is that you loose some detail or resolution. Those that like this effect don't seem to be bothered by that. It's a trade off.

3. Set your player to output video. Now you still have to deal with converting 24p to 60 hz and then double it to the 120 Hz refresh rate of your TV. The process or algorithm that does this is called a telecine. If you did read the linked article, you'll discover that the process of going from 24p to 60 Hz is not flawless. You may get judder, and perhaps some other artifacts. Motion flow, motion control, and judder reduction (or whatever Samsung calls it) should be set to ON. It will help to smooth out the motion. After doing that your movie will indeed no longer look like cinema (24p) and will have that video look, AKA soap opera, cartoonish, and other appellations that people apply to describe the effect. If you like video, this setting is for you.

To me, nothing beats the original 24p cinema (#1 above). That's the only reason I bought a 120 Hz TV so I could see 24p the way it was meant to be seen. Call me a purist if you like. But that's what I want. HTH!

Bear28 · 04-04-2010, 04:07 AM

I hadn't watched any blu rays on my new tv (120hz) until today. I first watched The Incredible Hulk which looked awesome, like my previous LCD but even better.

Then I put in Iron Man. I really didn't like the picture at all. I am thinking it's because it was displayed in 24fps vs The Incredible Hulk which didn't display that. I went into my PS3 settings and disabled the option to display 24fps and I much preferred the picture shown.

I know everyone has a different opinion but I was really surprised that I didn't like the 24fps version.

Thanks

Yeha-Noha · 04-04-2010, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bear28

I hadn't watched any blu rays on my new tv (120hz) until today. I first watched The Incredible Hulk which looked awesome, like my previous LCD but even better.

Then I put in Iron Man. I really didn't like the picture at all. I am thinking it's because it was displayed in 24fps vs The Incredible Hulk which didn't display that. I went into my PS3 settings and disabled the option to display 24fps and I much preferred the picture shown.

I know everyone has a different opinion but I was really surprised that I didn't like the 24fps version.

Thanks

Nope, that's not it. I have the Incredible Hulk and it's definitely 24p. Like you said, the PQ is awesome.

Why Iron Man didn't look as awesome to you while Incredible Hulk did, really makes no sense at all to me. Iron Main's PQ is incredible, simply phenomenal, and it's a tad better than The Incredible Hulk's.

Both are 24p on BD as are most movies. I don't know how you've setup your equipment, but it seems to me something is not right somewhere in either your PS3, your new 120 Hz TV, or both. Since your 120 Hz TV is new, I would start there. Have you calibrated your new TV? If not, then that's where to start. Before you calibrate it, turn off stuff like motion control, noise reduction, judder control, advanced contrast control, live color, and other stuff like that will make the PQ look overly processed and way to vivid.Unfortunately manufacturers often have those set to default settings that will razzle dazzle and attract prospective buyers in brightly light up stores and draw them away from competing TVs.

HTH you find a fix to the problem. Both movies should look awesome, not just the one.

Hawkeye379 · 04-04-2010, 04:35 PM

My understanding was that to properly display 24p content, you have to turn off "TruMotion" or "Auto Motion Plus" on your TV.

Or maybe I am totally wrong.

Yeha-Noha · 04-04-2010, 05:23 PM

That is recommended. But, as always, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder.

Bear28 · 04-04-2010, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rwojtalewicz

Nope, that's not it. I have the Incredible Hulk and it's definitely 24p. Like you said, the PQ is awesome.

Why Iron Man didn't look as awesome to you while Incredible Hulk did, really makes no sense at all to me. Iron Main's PQ is incredible, simply phenomenal, and it's a tad better than The Incredible Hulk's.

Both are 24p on BD as are most movies. I don't know how you've setup your equipment, but it seems to me something is not right somewhere in either your PS3, your new 120 Hz TV, or both. Since your 120 Hz TV is new, I would start there. Have you calibrated your new TV? If not, then that's where to start. Before you calibrate it, turn off stuff like motion control, noise reduction, judder control, advanced contrast control, live color, and other stuff like that will make the PQ look overly processed and way to vivid.Unfortunately manufacturers often have those set to default settings that will razzle dazzle and attract prospective buyers in brightly light up stores and draw them away from competing TVs.

HTH you find a fix to the problem. Both movies should look awesome, not just the one.

Hmm...well shoot. You know what I just put TIH back in and you are right, it is 24p as well. I'm 100% yesterday though that it wasn't showing in 24p because this looks like Iron Man did and I would of noticed that right away. So maybe my PS3 didn't switch for some reason and I was just watching in regular 1080p.

I have the motion control and film mode both set to off. I even tried turning them on with Iron Man and I think it made it worse.

Weird...I guess I'm just one of the people who prefer 24p off.

Thanks for the feedback!

Yeha-Noha · 04-04-2010, 07:20 PM

It's not weird really. Everyone has different tastes. That's why BD players and HD TVs have different settings so you can view it the way you like it.

I like film. So for me 24p Blu-ray brings back the cinema experience. I still go to the theaters often and certainly every time a blockbuster movie comes out. I only collect blu-rays so I can watch my favorite films again and again whenever I want. It's the next best thing to big screen theater.

raygendreau · 04-04-2010, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crispicazzo

Hey buddies!

I will get a Samsung 120hz TV and my question is, should I leave the 24p mode "on" in my Blu-Ray player? or I need to turned off the 24p mode?

Don´t will be look funny have a refresh rate of 120hz working with a video in 24p mode?

I´m so confused!!

Any help will be apreciatted.

Thank you!

You didn't mention which Samsung model you have, but the way I got the best picture quality on my Samsung UN40B6000 with my PS3 as a source was to set it up using this CNET info:

http://forums.cnet.com/5208-19410_10...hreadID=341085

I use the auto setting for the 24FPS on the PS3 and use the MOVIE Mode on my Samsung.

04-01-2010, 08:38 PM	#9
Yeha-Noha Power Member Member since:Jan 2008 Blu-ray reviews: 43	It may seem confusing at first. You basically have three choices: 1. Set the player to output 24p. Then set motion flow, motion control, and judder reduction OFF. It's not hard to imagine 24p being shown at 120 Hz. Think of it this way. If you repeat each frame of a 24p movie 5 times, you've in effect fooled your eyes into seeing it displayed as 24p yet at a 120 Hz refresh rate (24 X 5 = 120). The cinema you see is just like the cinema you see at theaters. This is the setting I prefer. 2. Set your player to output 24p. Then set motion control or motion flow to Medium (Standard) or High. I have a Sony. So I have to set CineMotion to Cinema 1 (Cinema 2 doesn't do anything). I don't know what you have to do to the Samsung. Those settings give me the 3D effect. The motion can also look exaggerated especially if motion flow is set to High. The downside is that you loose some detail or resolution. Those that like this effect don't seem to be bothered by that. It's a trade off. 3. Set your player to output video. Now you still have to deal with converting 24p to 60 hz and then double it to the 120 Hz refresh rate of your TV. The process or algorithm that does this is called a telecine. If you did read the linked article, you'll discover that the process of going from 24p to 60 Hz is not flawless. You may get judder, and perhaps some other artifacts. Motion flow, motion control, and judder reduction (or whatever Samsung calls it) should be set to ON. It will help to smooth out the motion. After doing that your movie will indeed no longer look like cinema (24p) and will have that video look, AKA soap opera, cartoonish, and other appellations that people apply to describe the effect. If you like video, this setting is for you. To me, nothing beats the original 24p cinema (#1 above). That's the only reason I bought a 120 Hz TV so I could see 24p the way it was meant to be seen. Call me a purist if you like. But that's what I want. HTH! Last edited by Yeha-Noha; 04-01-2010 at 08:40 PM.

Similar Threads
thread	Forum	Thread Starter	Replies	Last Post
24p 24hz 120hz bah to many numbers	LCD TVs	BLindsay	9	08-20-2009 07:34 PM
24p Help	Display Theory and Discussion	Kieran	26	08-11-2009 09:00 PM
Final 60hz/120hz 24p discussion	LCD TVs	jhuff396	0	01-21-2009 08:23 AM
Does AV receiver affect 120Hz, 24p, or xv color?	Receivers	yyyiiikes	13	12-10-2008 02:05 AM
120Hz vs. 24p	Home Theater General Discussion	slee915	13	06-04-2007 09:29 AM

03-30-2010, 02:49 PM	#1
crispicazzo Active Member Member since:Nov 2007 Location:Mexico City Blu-ray collection:3 Blu-ray reviews:1 Trading Score:1	Help with 120hz and 24p please! Hey buddies! I will get a Samsung 120hz TV and my question is, should I leave the 24p mode "on" in my Blu-Ray player? or I need to turned off the 24p mode? Don´t will be look funny have a refresh rate of 120hz working with a video in 24p mode? I´m so confused!! Any help will be apreciatted. Thank you!

03-30-2010, 03:24 PM	#2
ChrisV Active Member Member since:Oct 2009 Location:Long Island 4K collection:27 Blu-ray collection:636	If you are a film purist and want to see the film as the "so called directors intentions" put it on 24 fps mode. I don't use the 24p mode because I happen to like the smoother motion of having in 60 fps. Also don't confuse 120hz with the Motionflow function on the Samsung tv. Many people don't like this function because it makes film look more like video. I happen to LOVE it. It makes Blu-rays and DVD's movies look much more 3D like, less juddery, more life like and in my opinion better than what the director intended something film purists hate. My advice to you would be try all the different modes and see which one you like best. From my experience if you are a film purist keep the 24p on and the motionflow off. If you are just an average movie watcher it won't matter if 24p is on or off but keep the motionflow feature on medium or high and be amazed at the smoothness and life like picture quality.

03-30-2010, 05:30 PM	#4
DJ_NachoMan Active Member Top ranked HT gallery Member since:Dec 2008 Location:Brampton, Ontario Home Theater Gallery:13 Blu-ray collection:156 Blu-ray reviews:1 Trading Score:1	The grand majority of people who watch bluray will tell you it's insane to watch in anything but 24p mode. I have to agree. To address you concern, yes it's absolutely 100% fine to run a 120hz LCD on 24p mode. Personally i'm running a 240hz set in 24p mode and it looks phenomenal. I have blur reduction at 10 and judder reduction at 5. I feel the "soap opera effect" or the "video effect" mentioned above works well with animated films, but looks a little unrealistic on regular film. Most people will disable judder reduction to 0 or 1 or 2. I find 5 a good balance between maintaining a films original speed yet adding a bit of a smooth edge to it. It all comes down to personal preference though. Whatever you think looks best, well, go with that!

03-31-2010, 04:29 PM	#8
connect42 Expert Member Member since:Jul 2007 Location:Columbus, Georgia Home Theater Gallery:22 Blu-ray collection:103 Trading Score:19	For what it is worth, these guys are right. I have my LG 120Hz with the "TruMotion" set at high and the Sony player set at 24fps. I love it. Some don't.

04-04-2010, 04:07 AM	#10
Bear28 Expert Member Member since:Nov 2008 Location:Surrey, BC Blu-ray collection:48	I hadn't watched any blu rays on my new tv (120hz) until today. I first watched The Incredible Hulk which looked awesome, like my previous LCD but even better. Then I put in Iron Man. I really didn't like the picture at all. I am thinking it's because it was displayed in 24fps vs The Incredible Hulk which didn't display that. I went into my PS3 settings and disabled the option to display 24fps and I much preferred the picture shown. I know everyone has a different opinion but I was really surprised that I didn't like the 24fps version. Thanks

04-04-2010, 04:35 PM	#12
Hawkeye379 Active Member Member since:Apr 2010 Location:Canada Eh?	My understanding was that to properly display 24p content, you have to turn off "TruMotion" or "Auto Motion Plus" on your TV. Or maybe I am totally wrong.

04-04-2010, 05:23 PM	#13
Yeha-Noha Power Member Member since:Jan 2008 Blu-ray reviews: 43	That is recommended. But, as always, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder.

04-04-2010, 07:20 PM	#15
Yeha-Noha Power Member Member since:Jan 2008 Blu-ray reviews: 43	It's not weird really. Everyone has different tastes. That's why BD players and HD TVs have different settings so you can view it the way you like it. I like film. So for me 24p Blu-ray brings back the cinema experience. I still go to the theaters often and certainly every time a blockbuster movie comes out. I only collect blu-rays so I can watch my favorite films again and again whenever I want. It's the next best thing to big screen theater.

Best Blu-ray Movie Deals