Denon x2100W Turns off Randomly ?

[Milano]

Hey guys, I made a post over at avsforum, and I thought I'd reach out here to see if there's any more ideas..


I'll try to be brief, this has been going on for a while.


January I had a power surge that took out my Denon 1610. Replaced with x1100w in March. The 1610 had been working fine with this exact same setup since July 2012. (and before that in a different house when I got it in January 2011).

Landlord only changed the wall receptacle. (which had melted and caught fire). I bought a Furman M-8x2 to plug everything into.

Come late May, the x1100w was randomly turning off and then coming back on. (it will power off for 2-3 seconds or so and then go back to playing whatever it was playing - and it may only happen once every 4 days.. or once every 4 hours - Random and I can't reproduce it!)

Checked all connections, did a reset, and bypassed all power strips and went straight to the wall.. all to no avail.

Called Crutchfield, they replaced it with an x2100w. (before I even had to return the x1100w - great service)

Few days after setup, same thing began happening.

Plugged directly into wall, bought some fans to cool it better, changed all my speaker wire with brand new stuff (and eliminated some loose fitting banana plugs), landlord had an electrician upgrade home service to 200 amps, all new panel and new breakers, and he found some ground issues and circuit issues (2 circuits on 1 breaker) that were rectified. Added grounding rods outside, etc.

I performed a microprocessor reset twice on the 2100. I unplugged it and everything else for 1 hour last night (static discharge maybe?)

I relocated the Furman which was near the AVR to behind the media console away from everything. I added some Ferrite cores. I changed out some cheapo HDMI cables for better shielded stuff.

Plugged it back in. Same thing about half-way into an episode of True Detective - but then it's been fine since last night again.

Crutchfield tech said it seems highly unlikely that it would be the unit twice, but they'd exchange it again if I wanted to. (I have about 20 something days left in return period) AND that if the 3rd unit does it, the probability of that happening is exponential. (I don't think so, various Denon models in this lineup have had issues)

I'm thinking I'm gonna try a different wall outlet, and do some continuity testing on the speakers next. And if this all doesn't work then I'm leaning towards a Yamaha RX-v677... because they get a great reliability rating and I although I love Denon and Audyssey, I JUST WANT IT TO WORK !

And then I'm also wondering if you guys have any ideas? Maybe something stupid I overlooked, or maybe had a similar experience?

THANKS for reading

[100pr00f]

Def try a Different wall outlet.

I know when it turns off you could have speakers that need more juice to power them but if its coming back on ...thats weird

[timcat4843]

Denon receivers have a history of randomly turning themselves off.
It's a known issue, that Denon is well aware of.
My X4000 does the same thing.
I just do a soft reset and the problem is solved.
That is, until it decides to turn itself off again.
So, I have to unplug it for about 15 minutes and then plug it back in.

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by 100pr00f

I know when it turns off you could have speakers that need more juice to power them but if its coming back on ...thats weird

not sure Ive ever heard this theory before. Speakers are passive, the amp merely provides the "juice" and as long as the resistance (ohm) matches/agrees with the receiver there should be no problems. The speaker takes what it gets. Sure an underpowered speaker may not reach its full potential (cone excursion etc) and Overpowering a speaker can lead to thermal/mechanical death of the speaker but dont believe underpowering a speaker should cause an amp/receiver to shut off.

Now, a speaker wire touching something it shouldn't can shut a receiver down real quick. But as Timcat mentioned it could be a design flaw or something loose internally?

Either way I'd hate to have to continually unplug to reset the receiver...Id probably try to request a change in brand/model at this point.

My $.02

[100pr00f]

some speakers need a certain amount of power to be powered. so the receiver will max its power to power them, hence its turning off as its a safety feature so the receiver doesn't harm it self. This happens when there is a spike in watts during lets gun shots in a movie.

The amp should have higher wattage than speaker.

another thing to do is check for a wire shortage....plug in one speaker at a time to what speaker or speaker wire could have a short in it

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by 100pr00f

some speakers need a certain amount of power to be powered. so the receiver will max its power to power them

this makes little to no sense. A speaker is simply completing a circuit. It accepts whatever power it is given. If the resistance is not kosher with the amplifier, then problems arise. Sure you would need a certain amount of power to physically move the cone to reach a speakers full potential (mechanical limits), but what do you think happens when you turn the volume down to zero? No power.No cone movement. Hence, no sound. The amp/receiver does not shut itself down into protect mode.

Turning your amp/receiver to max regardless of speaker could be bad for anyone. But its not directly related to underpowering the speaker

[crackinhedz]

Technically speaking, EVERY speaker needs power to be powered.

[crackinhedz]

I think what you are trying to get at is amplifier clipping (and headroom). Just applying it to the wrong situation here.

[crackinhedz]

Milano, I notice you have both 6ohm & 8ohm speakers, did you select 6ohm in receiver settings (pg. 28)?

I know this should be obvious, but can be a problem causing you issues if not set correct.

[Dwayne]

Originally Posted by timcat4843

Denon receivers have a history of randomly turning themselves off.
It's a known issue, that Denon is well aware of.
My X4000 does the same thing.
I just do a soft reset and the problem is solved.
That is, until it decides to turn itself off again.
So, I have to unplug it for about 15 minutes and then plug it back in.

My 4520ci was purchased New and its been 3 months since purchasing, and all mine did was power on/then off with the flashing green light. Mine is on its 3rd trip to a Denon service center. Milano welcome to the super sensitive protection mode from Denon. This is a very known issue as I was told by Denons tech. support team. About all you can do is make sure your electrical breakers are in good shape,use tight fitting banana plugs and make sure your menu is set correctly for different ohms of speakers. My unit has yet to play a single song and I do not care if it sounds like a live orchestra, you can bet I will do everything in my power to sell this pile of junk if they are able to fix it. My first and last Denon. Hell in 2013 my 4520ci was a flagship receiver, Ha Ha Ha.

[timcat4843]

I was going to upgrade to a Marantz receiver. That was until I found out that some of there receivers, turn themselves off too. Geez, does anyone make quality built receivers anymore?

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by timcat4843

Geez, does anyone make quality built receivers anymore?

I have had zero issues from Pioneer receivers. My first Pioneer Elite lasted me several years, then I thought Id give Denon X3000 a try because I needed dual HDMI output..dud on arrival...I did by it new off eBay, but still...went back to Pioneer and cannot speak any higher of them...for me at least.

[schan1269]

Originally Posted by 100pr00f

some speakers need a certain amount of power to be powered. so the receiver will max its power to power them, hence its turning off as its a safety feature so the receiver doesn't harm it self. This happens when there is a spike in watts during lets gun shots in a movie.

The amp should have higher wattage than speaker.

another thing to do is check for a wire shortage....plug in one speaker at a time to what speaker or speaker wire could have a short in it

Speakers work on...

Efficiency
Ohm load

Not..."needs a certain amount of power"

[Dwayne]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

I have had zero issues from Pioneer receivers. My first Pioneer Elite lasted me several years, then I thought Id give Denon X3000 a try because I needed dual HDMI output..dud on arrival...I did by it new off eBay, but still...went back to Pioneer and cannot speak any higher of them...for me at least.

I would love to try a Pioneer Elite or maybe a Yamaha Aventage but I have grown to love the Audessey Room correction and what it brings to the sound. I have an Onkyo 809, and 1008 and both of them have been pushed very hard with no problems at all. Music is what I play 90% of the time. I have in front Polks RTIA 9 and a small Polk Center which is rarely ever used, and JBL ES80s for my rear surrounds, and 2 SVS subs. All of my towers are 8 ohms with lower 90s efficiency levels. When this Denon 4520ci gets fixed I will sell it. I have grown tired of Onkyos sound and want something that will sound great. This Denon will not change the sound much over the Onkyos but the Denon has the Platinum Audessey package. Anyway do the Pioneer Elites really sound as good as I have been told with their room correction. Can you recommend an Elite that has all of the latest processing available. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[crackinhedz]

Unfortunately this time around I had to go for a non-Elite (VSX-1124). But this thing does everything I need, aside from dual HDMI output my wife loves streaming her music through Airplay on the home network.

Pioneer also makes a sweet App (iControlAV5) to control the receiver, and works really well. Though I find it is a better experience on the iPad than the phone app.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Apps


As for the room correction programs, I really have only been accustomed to MCACC so my opinion is limited and very biased, but I enjoy the sound.

To me Pioneer has always ment reliability. Even when they made Plasmas they were cream of the crop.

[timcat4843]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

I have had zero issues from Pioneer receivers. My first Pioneer Elite lasted me several years, then I thought Id give Denon X3000 a try because I needed dual HDMI output..dud on arrival...I did by it new off eBay, but still...went back to Pioneer and cannot speak any higher of them...for me at least.

I would never consider buying a new receiver, that doesn't have Audyssey XT32 with Sub EQ HT.
It's that good.

[Dwayne]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

Unfortunately this time around I had to go for a non-Elite (VSX-1124). But this thing does everything I need, aside from dual HDMI output my wife loves streaming her music through Airplay on the home network.

Pioneer also makes a sweet App (iControlAV5) to control the receiver, and works really well. Though I find it is a better experience on the iPad than the phone app.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Apps


As for the room correction programs, I really have only been accustomed to MCACC so my opinion is limited and very biased, but I enjoy the sound.

To me Pioneer has always ment reliability. Even when they made Plasmas they were cream of the crop.

Pioneer now using the ESS SABRE 32 DAC in the VSX, and the ELITE series: impressive. After reading about both lines I found other features I liked. Thanx.

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by timcat4843

I would never consider buying a new receiver, that doesn't have Audyssey XT32 with Sub EQ HT.
It's that good.

One of the reasons I wanted to try the Denon, but was a dud.

In the end, the room processing wasnt overly important to me...MCACC does a fine job.

[timcat4843]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

In the end, the room processing wasnt overly important to me...

It should be important to you. Because, when done right, it can add immeasurably to your movie watching enjoyment.

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by timcat4843

It should be important to you. Because, when done right, it can add immeasurably to your movie watching enjoyment.

Again, MCACC does a fine job for my needs. Im not gonna lose sleep over the MCACC vs Audyssey vs YPAO etc debate.

Didnt say room correction (itself) isnt important. Just wasnt my main concern during purchase, the price tag was.