Anime on 4K UHD BD?

[4kUltraBD]

Hello anime fans.

I have a question that may seem a bit silly on here, but I am not very familiar with anime in general, having seen very little. In fact, the entirety of my anime is only a hanful of stuff (if you count dvd and bd).

Anyway, I'm not current on anime news or release information (recommended websites would be great), but I have recently started collecting 4k UHD discs, and I am wondering if there has been any anime released on the format, or any news of forthcoming releases?

Perhaps you can (possibly) count Ghost in the Shell (Scarlett Johansson) although it is technically a live action film based on anime. I don't know if it's a popular opinion on this forum, but personally, I loved the movie and have watched it a few times now.

I also have the original anime version on BD and think it's great as well. The first time I watched it, I was shocked to see how much The Matrix owes to this now classic anime. As in, I felt it borrowed so many ideas from GitS, that I was a bit shocked, to be honest.

Admittedly, I like The Matrix, but in full disclosure, I prefer either the original anime or live action film of GitS to it.

As for other stuff, I absolutely love Akira and have watched it many, many times. In fact, I like it so much that it makes me want to buy the manga box set when I can afford to do so.

I also watched nearly all of the Death Note anime series on Netflix. I no longer have my subscription, but that series is seriously SO mind blowing that I can imagine it being an excellent introduction to anime, for the uninitiated. Kind of what it was for me, to be honest. Heck, I even liked the (seemingly) much derided live action film that Netflix produced.

I like Cowboy Bebop as well, and I bought the BD of the movie, but I have not watched through the whole series. Only seeing a handful of episodes on cartoon network years ago, but remember liking it.

Anyway, enough babbling about my miniscule anime experience. I'm looking to expand my anime collection on the latest format, and simply wondered what was available at this time, if anything.

Thanks.

[themp3000]

The only English-friendly 4K UHD release I can think of is the Japanese release of Makoto Shinkai’s Your Name. I think the Japanese releases of Ghost in the Shell (the original, not LA) and it’s sequel are English friendly as well. But it will set you back a little dough though. They aren’t cheap.

There’s been a few 4K UHD releases in Japan and it’s been a mixed bag of quality. Nothing in the US and probably not for several more years since costs to license those 4K UHD rights and then to replicate and press the discs makes it impossible right now. It would be an astronomical investment to do it. Lack of region locking certainly won’t help matters.

Of course, the market could turn to digital/streaming platforms instead. That’s an alternative that nobody really wants. But it’s an alternative that seems to grow day by day. Personally, I watch everything streaming and then just buy what I really like. With an occasional blind buy here and there.

There’s not much on the new format and I suspect that will be the case for some time. Blu-ray is probably going to be the end of the (physical) line for a lot of anime.

[BigOnAnime]

So far there's only been a small handful, and IIRC only Japan has gotten anything, nowhere else (save for Hong Kong with Your Name.). It'll be quite a while before we see anyone here possibly put anything on the format. Keep in mind, there are downsides.

Originally Posted by Schmullus (Logan)

This is the same problem I saw with the recent 4K releases for Gundam F91 and CCA. The HDR looks great, but Sunrise scrubbed most of the grain away. At least the 00 movie was digital to begin with, so it fared much better in 4K. https://twitter.com/worldofcrap/stat...84856531513346

https://twitter.com/Schmullus1/statu...20397340131329

Anyway, all that comes to mind in addition to what was listed above, is Your Name., Accel World: Infinite Burst, Mobile Suit Gundam Thunderbolt: December Sky, Mobile Suit Gundam Thunderbolt: Bandit Flower, Mobile Suit Gundam 00 The Movie: A Wakening of the Trailblazer, Mary and The Witch's Flower, Ghost in the Shell, and Ghost in the Shell: Innocence.

One reference I used for this list as I haven't been keeping track.
https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&...3AWTK&src=typd
(BTW, if you regularly use Twitter, highly recommend following WTK (he also posts on Fandom Post and ANN) if you want to keep up with news on releases and such.)

I could probably find more here, but this shows everything that has gotten a 4K Ultra HD release in Japan whether it's anime or not.
http://www.allcinema.net/prog/search...t=%B1%C7%B2%E8

Something else to note, while with 4K UHD Blu-rays the main benefit is HDR and not resolution, even today, lots of anime are still not animated at 1080P. Even in the late 2000s, there were still anime not animated in HD, Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood was reportedly animated in 540P. Heck, many shows were still being released DVD-only even if they had HD broadcasts such as Durarara!!. Anime being regularly released on Blu-ray is still a bit of a recent thing. There were some releases early on though before releases became common, such as Air.

Originally Posted by themp3000

Lack of region locking certainly won’t help matters.

To point out why this is a problem for those not in the know, anime releases in Japan are significantly more expensive than in America (this is one reason why), and when it comes to regular Blu-rays, Japan and America are in the same region, Region A. This leads to reverse-importation fears, fear of Japanese consumers importing the cheaper American release instead and thus leading to lower profits. As a result, American releases come out much later (usually around 6 months to a year after the final JP Blu-ray comes out), and will also usually have locked subs (the subtitles can't be turned off when playing the Japanese audio), here's an entire thread on them.

[NLScavenger]

Tomorrow's Joe 2 4K UHD BD apparently has the same problems as Space Adventure Cobra, but not very surprising since they were both shat out by the same studio.

The Hong Kong Your Name 4K UHD BD has scaling issues and wrong HDR metadata.

Originally Posted by BigOnAnime

So far there's only been a small handful, and IIRC only Japan has gotten anything, nowhere else (save for Hong Kong with Your Name.).

Your Name has also received a 4K UHD BD release in Germany.

[4kUltraBD]

Wow! Thanks for the info all.

This is quite fascinating and sad at the same time. I had no idea of why anime discs always seem to cost so much, nor why they are sometimes so hard to find. It's weird because I've always been under the impression that anime was hugely popular in Japan. As in a huge pop culture type thing that nearly everyone enjoyed. I'm seeing now that this doesn't seem to be the case at all.

I figured anime was so expensive here, due to things going out of print and being a niche market in the USA. Sort of similar to Criterion releases in that regard. Serious collectors who simply must complete their collections. I'm sure there's some of that involved, but these articles suggest that's simply the anime market at work.

As someone new to anime, I find this news to be disheartening. At least we have things like Crunchyroll, but I would rather collect physical discs than stream.

Hopefully, we'll see some anime releases on 4k in the USA. I'm especially hoping for Akira, as it's my favorite anime, and has already seen US releases on VHS, DVD, and BD.

[BigOnAnime]

Anime has always been a niche thing, even in Japan though of course some stuff breaks out in the mainstream. Most of the TV series air late at night, like around 11PM-3AM. Like you mentioned Death Note, its initial airing on NTV was at around 1 AM.
http://cal.syoboi.jp/tid/945/time?Filter=4

Also anime has actually gotten cheaper in North America over time. $25-$35 used to get you a 2 episode VHS tape with one audio track, later it gave you 3-4 episodes with both audio tracks (https://i.imgur.com/hCgLi8P.jpg https://i.imgur.com/u6HenEh.jpg). Now for around $50 or so (this is not MSRP), you can get 13 episodes, and if you wait for a complete re-release, $30 or so can get you the entire show. Anime is just stupidly cheap here, it's actually easier to argue it's underpriced rather than overpriced. The market is trending back towards things being more expensive though, it's becoming more of a collector's market as streaming takes over more and the casuals stop buying the cheap discs. Most anime releases tend to sell under 10,000 units in their lifetime anyway. It's smarter to target those that have an inelastic demand for this stuff. Like Geneon (RIP) found out way back in the day, changing the price of their stuff did not change sales much.
http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1snsi4f

With Akira, that's definitely bound for a 4K UHD release. I'd be shocked if it doesn't get that sort of release.

[Naiera]

Originally Posted by 4kUltraBD

Perhaps you can (possibly) count Ghost in the Shell (Scarlett Johansson) although it is technically a live action film based on anime. I don't know if it's a popular opinion on this forum, but personally, I loved the movie and have watched it a few times now.

Don't. Ever. Say. Something. Like. That. Ever. Again.

[Naiera]

With regards to Your Name it's also important to remember that it was "upscaled" for HDR, by an arbitrary third party. Shinkai had little or nothing to do with it.

[professorwho]

Still to this day, virtually no anime are made at native 1080p, except for films. That is because of the production schedule. Each episode has a 4 to 6 week schedule after the scripts are written, that includes:

Animation production (key animation- the most important frames), animation being checked by a higher up (chief animation director), 2nd key animation, inbetween animation, scanning, digital colouring, compositing, voice acting (the Japanese voice actors dub over the completed animation), music recording, sound mixing, and then it’s all edited into a stereo track and then put on an HDCam for Television broadcast.

That’s a lot to achieve in 4 to 6 weeks, so to save time in compositing and colouring, anime are done at oddball HD resolutions like 810p, or even Standard 720p. Those upscale nicely to 1080p, but at 4K, forget it.

For 35mm films, it could have many benefits. Studio Ghibli did 8K scans of all their films, so I’d expect to eventually see those hit the market. Akira had a 4K scan and restoration so it’s gonna happen, it’s only a matter of time.

Because anime is produced in a way where time is more important than budgeting, most anime aren’t even 1080p. If it was digitally produced before 2007, it was most likely 480p. 16mm and 35mm film are great because you can do a good scan at theoretically any resolution.

[Dailyan]

Originally Posted by professorwho

16mm and 35mm film are great because you can do a good scan at theoretically any resolution.

It also depends on how good condition the elements are in. Of course you can get sub-par upscales from SD masters like Sailor Moon, Saint Seiya, and Lupin the 3rd (The red jacket series at least). Even some shows had to substitute SD from time to time for footage like with Nadia (Thankfully they're few and far between and in mostly filler episodes). I'd say that the best studios that have done generally good jobs with provide HD scans of their film shows are Sunrise, Ghibi, and Tatsunoko. Though with how Cobra turned out I'm a little cautious about how Ghibi's films will turn out on 4K discs.

It makes me nervous about cel animation on 4K in general. The only major studio I could see treating cel animation films on 4K is Sony; their TA films are quite minuscule but I’d be Day 1 for Cowboy Bebop The Movie and Metropolis.

[professorwho]

Exactly. If the source is in poor condition, it doesn't make much of a difference what resolution the scan is, it is still poor condition.

The thing with anime from the 80s onward is there's occasionally some CGI. Char's Counterattack has a surprisingly good looking space station that's in CGI, and that's on UHD. I'm curious how it looks there. Akira has some as well, and Ghibli had some in Mononoke Hime, so there's that. That CGI was typically rendered at a lower resolution, and depending on how much there is, it may be a potential issue.

[musicman1]

Mary and the Witch’s Flower got a 4k release with DTS-X audio in Japan.

[Lionel Horsepackage]

Wasn't Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket supposed to be getting a 4K UHD release at some point, too? Could've sworn I read that awhile back.

[Dailyan]

Originally Posted by professorwho

Exactly. If the source is in poor condition, it doesn't make much of a difference what resolution the scan is, it is still poor condition.

The thing with anime from the 80s onward is there's occasionally some CGI. Char's Counterattack has a surprisingly good looking space station that's in CGI, and that's on UHD. I'm curious how it looks there. Akira has some as well, and Ghibli had some in Mononoke Hime, so there's that. That CGI was typically rendered at a lower resolution, and depending on how much there is, it may be a potential issue.

For CGI scenes they'll most likely use an IP source because digital files do get corrupted not to mention compatibility issues; just hopefully don't degrain too much. I hope "Mononoke" doesn't get the degrain treatment because that's still one of the finest TA films I've seen. I figure for their post-Mononoke stuff it'll be either upscaled (The 8K scans could of only been for their 35mm films), re-rendered (This is incredibly unlikely) or they use a film source which has happened to plenty of digipaint films.

Originally Posted by Lionel Horsepackage

Wasn't Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket supposed to be getting a 4K UHD release at some point, too? Could've sworn I read that awhile back.

I can only find that they scanned it in 4K with no mention of a 4K UHD release.

[professorwho]

War in the Pocket had a 4K scan. I'm sure it'll eventually get a UHD release.

[Robbl]

How was the Card Captor Sakura 4k release?

[professorwho]

It's a 1080p Blu-ray of a 4K scan. I don't have it, but there's this official trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWLYyLFy-2c

[Naiera]

Originally Posted by Lionel Horsepackage

Wasn't Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket supposed to be getting a 4K UHD release at some point, too? Could've sworn I read that awhile back.

A movie getting a 4K scan does not in any way equal a UHD BD release though.

[Lionel Horsepackage]

Originally Posted by Naiera

A movie getting a 4K scan does not in any way equal a UHD BD release though.

Right, but I was referring to initial reports last year which mentioned that an actual physical 4K UHD was probably on the way in Japan, there.

[qw0aszx]

Originally Posted by professorwho

Akira had a 4K scan and restoration so it’s gonna happen, it’s only a matter of time.

Is there any news about this 4K restoration of Akira? Would love to know more about it.