Harmon/Kardon AVR-247

[dtr20]

ok, for those of you who dont know my previous posts, i have a Harmon/Kardon AVR247, PS3 60GB for blu-ray, Insignia 42 plasma, and a TivoHD for my main home theater components (plus a mixed brand 5.1 speaker setup {klipsch, polk audio, infinity, and jbl}). I just bought the receiver a couple of weeks ago to take advantage of the hd audio formats that are found on bluray movies.

i just want to make sure that i am not going to regret this receiver in a couple of months, since i still have a couple of weeks to return it. from what i understand the receiver does not have hdmi 1.3. is this feature really necessary? since the ps3 doesnt bitstream the new audio formats, im guessing i dont really need it. and with this, im guessing i dont need a receiver that supports the truehd, dts-hd ma, etc.

[Metalheadisme]

Originally Posted by dtr20

ok, for those of you who dont know my previous posts, i have a Harmon/Kardon AVR247, PS3 60GB for blu-ray, Insignia 42 plasma, and a TivoHD for my main home theater components (plus a mixed brand 5.1 speaker setup {klipsch, polk audio, infinity, and jbl}). I just bought the receiver a couple of weeks ago to take advantage of the hd audio formats that are found on bluray movies.

i just want to make sure that i am not going to regret this receiver in a couple of months, since i still have a couple of weeks to return it. from what i understand the receiver does not have hdmi 1.3. is this feature really necessary? since the ps3 doesnt bitstream the new audio formats, im guessing i dont really need it. and with this, im guessing i dont need a receiver that supports the truehd, dts-hd ma, etc.

The HK will put out great sound like any HK does, but there are some issues with the avr 247 unfortunately, as I would get it as well.

The LFE channel does not receive the proper 10db boost when accepting pcm signals (which is basically what the PS3 will be sending). Supposedly they are working on a firmware fix for this, albeit really slowly.

Many issues reported with video, both in terms of upconversion to 720p and pass-thru at 1080p/1080i/720p. People report "snowing" and apparently this has been found to be a hardware problem related to overheating and shielding.

Then there's the issue of hdmi 1.2... I don't really think it matters in terms of codecs since the ps3 will decode them, but doesn't 1080p/24p require hdmi 1.3?

Then again, I guess some people have no issues with this receiver at all... if it sounds fine to you and the video is working fine, I say run with it.

They really need to come out with new receivers though!

[dtr20]

Originally Posted by Metalheadisme

The LFE channel does not receive the proper 10db boost when accepting pcm signals (which is basically what the PS3 will be sending). Supposedly they are working on a firmware fix for this, albeit really slowly.

thanks for the reply, but can someone ellaborate on what this actually means? and if it a major deal, is there a workaround for it?

[Metalheadisme]

Originally Posted by dtr20

thanks for the reply, but can someone ellaborate on what this actually means? and if it a major deal, is there a workaround for it?

The LFE is the .1 channel, i.e. bass/sub. On pcm tracks it will be very low (though I'm not sure everyone has this problem. It's not a problem if you use bitstream mode for the HDMI/optical audio, but then you are limited to the lossy codecs since the ps3 cannot bitstream Dolby TrueHD or DTS HD MA. You most likely want to make use of the ps3's ability to internally decode TrueHD (and soon DTS HD MA hopefully) and send that data via LPCM to the receiver.

There is a workaround- manually apply the 10db boost to the subwoofer in the speaker level menu on the receiver - but the problem is that for non-pcm sources, you will have to change that setting back or you will have ridiculous bass, so you will be switching back and forth.

[BStecke]

I had one of these and returned it. The sound was great, but it wasn't passing 1080p properly and I had what looked like HDMI snow.

The other issue I have with it is the (maybe I'm wrong here) inability to disable the video processing for non-1080p signals. My mother in law actually bought one of these for Christmas, but I was setting it up with their DVD player (no HDM) and, since it applies video processing to any signal that is non-1080p, it was hard as hell to calibrate their set since there are adjustments on both the TV and the receiver. I really wish they would've allowed that to be disabled.

[alphapyro]

Originally Posted by Metalheadisme

The LFE is the .1 channel, i.e. bass/sub. On pcm tracks it will be very low (though I'm not sure everyone has this problem. It's not a problem if you use bitstream mode for the HDMI/optical audio, but then you are limited to the lossy codecs since the ps3 cannot bitstream Dolby TrueHD or DTS HD MA. You most likely want to make use of the ps3's ability to internally decode TrueHD (and soon DTS HD MA hopefully) and send that data via LPCM to the receiver.

There is a workaround- manually apply the 10db boost to the subwoofer in the speaker level menu on the receiver - but the problem is that for non-pcm sources, you will have to change that setting back or you will have ridiculous bass, so you will be switching back and forth.

This sounds worse than it really is.

I also own the same setup as you (except different TV/use PC600 speakers), and have yet to experience issues with the 247. Although it sounds like it just depends on the luck of the draw and how you are setup. The video pass through does not have any snow and the upconversion looks fine on my receiver. The audio decoded from the PS3 and sent LPCM to the receiver sounds great. Although there is this LFE boost issue, the switching back and forth couldn't be so painless as a couple clicks on the remote if you even need to. I typically watch regular cable TV with the logic 7 on, and rarely need to mess with the bass. I leave it at +8dB and notice hardly any difference between blu-ray and regular TV (both have equitable BOOM)

Games sound fantastic (although I now notice that Assassin's Creed in-game voiceovers are nastily compressed and annoying)

I've had the receiver for about 2 weeks now and have read all the problems with it, but since I don't care to use 1080p/24hz or have any desire to turn off the 720p upconversion there's nothing else for me to worry about except a firmware fix for the LFE "issue" which is mild in comparison to the quality.

The HDMI 1.3 stuff is if you are looking for the Deep color, etc... since the PS3 does internal decoding there's really no need for 1.3 on the receiver (remember that the PS3 is 1.3 ready if you change your mind, or decide to upgrade further than this price point of receivers)

[dtr20]

ok cool, so i will probably be keeping the receiver, thanks for the help

[dtr20]

the other thing i noticed, is when there is only a little bass needed, it gives my sub a weird signal (bass cuts in and out), but when there is a lot of bass, signal is fine (ive only noticed this in non pcm signals, like cd, hdtv signals). anyone else noticed something like this?

[GTsmokeya]

Check your crossover settings on the receiver, make sure they are low enough. As well as check what your sub is set to. Not to add more but the lfe option on HK lets you do just lfe or L+R lfe so play around with it.

GTsmokeya

[dtr20]

thanks for the help, my front speakers were set to high, it seems like it fixed the problem.

[Robmx]

Few questions for the people who own this unit:

1. Instead of using HDMI, how does the Optical 2.0 PCM sound through Logic 7 ?

2. Does using the Optical have this Sub issue that is mentioned above ?

Im serious considering this receiver and after making 5 trips before finding a LCD that wouldn't die after 2 weeks... Which ended up being Sony that survived.... I just want to be sure this will sound great and not have any issues.

As for bypassing HDMI I don't want to ruin the signal the PS3 is giving my 1080p/24p LCD... Yes I know its not proper 24p..LOL

Anything is a upgrade compared to the 2.0 analog im running to my HTiB right now...

Thanks in advance for your input..... and yes I know about Onkyo and their models, Im not interested in them.... Especially paying 700 canadian for the 605 model !

[lildawgryan]

2. Does using the Optical have this Sub issue that is mentioned above ?

No issues at all with sub when your a optical cable.

Also Harman Kardon will be coming out with a new line of recievers somtime around spring if you have the extra money and dont mind wating. You will get DTS-MA and HDMI 1.3. Although these specs havent been announced you can only expect it will be available on atleast the high end models. Since you picked the 247 I would guess you are on a budget so maybe these new receivers will be in a too high of a price range.

BTW I have the 147*

*I believe