Amplifiers

[BStecke]

The next logical step in my home theater would be to add an amplifier, which I really know nothing about, as far as the home theater environment goes. Car audio, yes.

In looking at some of the major brands (Yamaha, Denon, Pioneer) I'm seeing that most amplifiers are mono or two channel. In my mind, I would need a 5 channel amp, one channel each for F, L, Center, and Surround. I really don't know why they even make a mono amp for a home theater application, unless it would be for an unamplified subwoofer. Maybe I'm incorrect, which, from what I'm seeing in amp selection, I would believe.

Anyway . . . school me on amplifiers! I'm familiar with RMS, Dynamic, etc, etc, so I don't need much info on that. I'm sure there are brands for amps I've never even heard of, which I'm hoping to gain more familiarity with as well.

[Marcusarilius]

Originally Posted by BStecke

The next logical step in my home theater would be to add an amplifier, which I really know nothing about, as far as the home theater environment goes. Car audio, yes.

In looking at some of the major brands (Yamaha, Denon, Pioneer) I'm seeing that most amplifiers are mono or two channel. In my mind, I would need a 5 channel amp, one channel each for F, L, Center, and Surround. I really don't know why they even make a mono amp for a home theater application, unless it would be for an unamplified subwoofer. Maybe I'm incorrect, which, from what I'm seeing in amp selection, I would believe.

Anyway . . . school me on amplifiers! I'm familiar with RMS, Dynamic, etc, etc, so I don't need much info on that. I'm sure there are brands for amps I've never even heard of, which I'm hoping to gain more familiarity with as well.

There should still be good mono block amps out there. 500 WPC. Check the higher end websites.

[JohnGalt]

I have no personal experience with them but lots of folks seem to like Emotiva amps and they're relatively affordable.

[guitarist155]

Originally Posted by BStecke

I really don't know why they even make a mono amp for a home theater application, unless it would be for an unamplified subwoofer. Maybe I'm incorrect, which, from what I'm seeing in amp selection, I would believe.

mono amps are for people who want to use one amp for each channel, by keeping the channels separate with different amps it helps to prevent cross talk from one channel to another and for more overall isolation. there are also other benefits to having mono amps like if one channel goes bad you only have to replace that channel. mono amps will also usually be able to provide more power per speaker than a 5.1/7.1 amp

[ManUtd]

If you are okay with mail order companies check out Outlaw 7500, if not, my favorite relatively inexpensive brands are Rotel and B&K.

[Marcusarilius]

Originally Posted by Art Vandelay

If you are okay with mail order companies check out Outlaw 7500, if not, my favorite relatively inexpensive brands are Rotel and B&K.

B&Ks are excellent.

[Todd]

Originally Posted by BStecke

The next logical step in my home theater would be to add an amplifier, which I really know nothing about, as far as the home theater environment goes. Car audio, yes.

In looking at some of the major brands (Yamaha, Denon, Pioneer) I'm seeing that most amplifiers are mono or two channel. In my mind, I would need a 5 channel amp, one channel each for F, L, Center, and Surround. I really don't know why they even make a mono amp for a home theater application, unless it would be for an unamplified subwoofer. Maybe I'm incorrect, which, from what I'm seeing in amp selection, I would believe.

Anyway . . . school me on amplifiers! I'm familiar with RMS, Dynamic, etc, etc, so I don't need much info on that. I'm sure there are brands for amps I've never even heard of, which I'm hoping to gain more familiarity with as well.

Mono block amps typically yield better power output, better dynamic range. less distortion, and no cross talk between channels. Great speakers that need high power. Mono blocks are hands down the best quality but are very high price! So what is your budget in dollars, if you want a really great 5 channel amp look at ADA, CINEPRO, or KRELL these companies make Mono block, and multi channel amps. If your budget isn't up to this level you might seach on ebay for used amps, SAE was american made when that was actually a good thing. I use an SAE model A501 to drive my boston acoustics G5 subwoofer in my home theater this amp outputs 250wpc@8ohm and is very low distortion. want more power get a SAE model A1001 500wpc@8ohm also will drive loads down to 2ohms.
If that doesn't help you could just get a Denon receiver like the avr 5308 150wpc@8ohms. good luck.

[mugen302005]

I know that there are knowledgeable people here in the forum, so this post is just perfect I didn't think It 'd be a good idea to open another that noene reads.

Well my question is specific, can the denon avr-1508 with its hdmi compatbility be used with my ps3 to hear the long awaited pcm uncompresed audios of all my blurays? If it is not possible, then any other denon model that does it? or ist tit that the only choice for us ps3 users is the onkyo 605?

Thanks and please respond.

[BStecke]

Originally Posted by Art Vandelay

If you are okay with mail order companies check out Outlaw 7500, if not, my favorite relatively inexpensive brands are Rotel and B&K.

I was looking at that Outlaw, as a matter of fact, but what the HELL type of inputs are those!?

[MatrixS2000]

Those are balanced inputs. Most people are familar with unbalanced RCA connections where the postive signal is on the centre post and the negative is on the sleeve. Balanced connectors have 3 connections. A +, - and ground. It's advantage is that it can carry a higher level signal and that an amp with balanced input should not have any hum.

Amplifiers are a pretty big discussion and all that most people look at is how much power the amp can make.

Here is a good page defining what all the specs mean.

Post back if you have any specific questions.

[RUR]

Originally Posted by BStecke

I was looking at that Outlaw, as a matter of fact, but what the HELL type of inputs are those!?

What model(s) Klipsch' are you running?

[richteer]

Originally Posted by MatrixS2000

Those are balanced inputs. Most people are familar with unbalanced RCA connections where the postive signal is on the centre post and the negative is on the sleeve. Balanced connectors have 3 connections. A +, - and ground. It's advantage is that it can carry a higher level signal and that an amp with balanced input should not have any hum.

Close, but not quite accurate. Single-ended (normal) connections have two signals: +ive and ground. These type of connection can be susceptible to RFI (radio frequency interferance); the longer the cable and/or more electrically noisy the environment, the worse the problem will potentially be.

In a balanced connection, the audio signal mirrored, the original signal using the + connection and its mirror using the - side (the ground is used in the same way it is in single-ended connections). Each of the signal cables is susceptible to RFI in the same manner as single-ended connections, but because the two halves of the signal are 180 degrees out of phase with each other, the induced noise sums to zero. (This is a bit hard to explain with drawing a picture!)

The signal in a balanced connection isn't necessarily a higher level one than that found in single-ended connetions, I guess hum might still be an issue.

[MatrixS2000]

Originally Posted by richteer

Close, but not quite accurate. Single-ended (normal) connections have two signals: +ive and ground. These type of connection can be susceptible to RFI (radio frequency interferance); the longer the cable and/or more electrically noisy the environment, the worse the problem will potentially be.

In a balanced connection, the audio signal mirrored, the original signal using the + connection and its mirror using the - side (the ground is used in the same way it is in single-ended connections). Each of the signal cables is susceptible to RFI in the same manner as single-ended connections, but because the two halves of the signal are 180 degrees out of phase with each other, the induced noise sums to zero. (This is a bit hard to explain with drawing a picture!)

The signal in a balanced connection isn't necessarily a higher level one than that found in single-ended connetions, I guess hum might still be an issue.

How is this any different that what I posted (other than you adding points on interference which wasn't in the discussion)?

And where was I inaccurate?

[TENSE]

do i need an amplifier if my speakers out put more watts than my receiver.?
for example my receiver out puts 660 watts and my speakers need 890 watts
is that ok?

[guitarist155]

those are xlr inputs they are used widely in the pro audio industry, both of the above are very good descriptions. however i would read this for a very in depth on what xlr is and why to use xlr http://www.nullmodem.com/Audio.htm#BalancedLines

however all of the outlaw amps have rca also so you do not have to use xlr if your preamp doesn't have them

[jdc115]

Originally Posted by BStecke

The next logical step in my home theater would be to add an amplifier, which I really know nothing about, as far as the home theater environment goes. Car audio, yes.

In looking at some of the major brands (Yamaha, Denon, Pioneer) I'm seeing that most amplifiers are mono or two channel. In my mind, I would need a 5 channel amp, one channel each for F, L, Center, and Surround. I really don't know why they even make a mono amp for a home theater application, unless it would be for an unamplified subwoofer. Maybe I'm incorrect, which, from what I'm seeing in amp selection, I would believe.

Anyway . . . school me on amplifiers! I'm familiar with RMS, Dynamic, etc, etc, so I don't need much info on that. I'm sure there are brands for amps I've never even heard of, which I'm hoping to gain more familiarity with as well.

Unless you are looking to go very high end, most of the mid end companies make 5 and 7 channel amps:

Rotel
NAD
Adcom
B&K
Parasound
Outlaw

Maybe the B&K and Parasound a bit more expensive but all offer quite a bit of power for a "resonable" price. They will all be quite a bit more then the typical HT receiver though and then you still need a source to feed them.

[MatrixS2000]

Originally Posted by guitarist155

http://www.nullmodem.com/Audio.htm#BalancedLines

That is a very good description of how balanced inputs work. The differentiating circuit is what eliminates things like hum and RFI.

[MatrixS2000]

Originally Posted by TENSE

do i need an amplifier if my speakers out put more watts than my receiver.?
for example my receiver out puts 660 watts and my speakers need 890 watts
is that ok?

Ok couple of things:

1 - speakers do not output anything other than sound. So when you read a wattage spec on speakers, they relate to input wattage (the maximum power they can handle) not output.

2 - To answer your question - no you don't need an amplifier if your receiver puts out less power than your speaker maximum. However, if you run your receiver hard (as in close to maximum volume), it could damage your speakers as the amplifier section in the receiver is most likely be clipping. Clipping is what leads to speaker damage.

Clipping is distortion of the amplified signal when you ask your amplifier to amplify a signal beyond what the power supply can handle. Imagine a nice clean sine wave, when an amplifier is pushed to clipping, the top and bottom of that sine wave are clipped off. The signal is clipped because the power supply section of the amplifier (or receiver) can no longer provide enough power to the amplifier section to cleanly amplify the signal.

That clipped off portion basically represents a dc current (like a battery) to the speaker and creates heat in the voice coil of the speaker. Too much clipping and the voice coil overheats and you damage your speaker.

A good rule of thumb to stick by to somewhat protect yourself from clipping is to never exceed 70% on your volume control.

[btf1980]

I'm very familiar with Classe and Rotel. I have no idea what your budget is, but Classe might be out of reach. In any event, I can wholeheartedly recommend Rotel. Either their RMB-1075 or RMB-1095 is worth their weight in gold. Fantastic amps. I use the 1075 myself. Constant, steady power. Another thing that puts Rotel above the rest is build quality. Many others have cheap looking and feeling amps. Well the Rotel is built like a tank, and weighs like one as well.

Rotel RMB-1075
http://www.rotel.com/NA/products/Pro...tails.htm?Id=3

Rotel RMB-1095
http://www.rotel.com/NA/products/Pro...tails.htm?Id=2

My Rotel RMB-1075

[BStecke]

Originally Posted by RUR

What model(s) Klipsch' are you running?

I'll have all Reference series in a week or so: RC62 center, RF82 fronts, RB61 rears, RW12d sub.


My Pioneer receiver does not have the balanced outputs, at least that I am aware of. I'm assuming both ends of the connector look the same. Is this mainly a feature of standalone processors/preamps, or do "all-in-one" AVR's ever include these?