For Once and For All...Can Someone Tell Me If This Is Connected Right?

[Linksys2.4]

Okay. Exhaustively, I have attempted to get the clear answer on whether all this gear is connected correctly, and if my settings have been made right based on my specific setup...unfortunately, the replies are usually riddled in confusion and speculation without any definitive answers, most notably in the area dealing with the speaker setup menu of my BD player and how decoded TrueHD tracks are being sent over HDMI to my receiver...I would appreciate the time anyone would take to try and figure this all out for me and lend some insight or information.

While I am planning to replace my Panasonic DMP-BD10A with possibly the new OPPO, I am still having issues with the configuration of this player and how it handles internal operations, and I need to confirm these as I suspect I still have awhile to use this player before dropping some coin on the OPPO.

That said, let me first explain how the physical hardware is connected in the system, to be sure THAT'S at least connected right:

The Panasonic DMP-BD10A is going HDMI OUT -- for ALL audio AND video -- to an Onkyo TX-SR605's HDMI IN (1). From there, a second HDMI cable is going from the Onkyo's HDMI OUT to an HDMI IN on my Sony SXRD rear projection HDTV. THAT'S IT -- no other connections are being made from the player...no analog, no coax or optical audio...DVD upconversion and 1080p Blu-ray playback AS WELL AS all audio codecs are being sent over this ONE HDMI cable from the player to the receiver.

Now, first of all, is the above connection correct to send everything to the receiver, and then send the video out to the TV?

Assuming that IS correct, here's the more detailed questions I have...because this player does not bitstream Dolby TrueHD signals, I have set the TrueHD output of the player to PCM, so it decodes it internally and sends it out over HDMI to my receiver for playback. The DIGITAL AUDIO OUTPUT setup menu in the player reads like this:

Dynamic Range Compression: Off
BD Video Function Sound: Off
PCM Down Conversion: Off
Dolby Digital: Bitstream
Dolby Digital Plus/TrueHD: PCM
DTS: Bitstream
DTS-HD: Bitstream

Now, based on that setup, the player sends the TrueHD as decoded multichannel PCM to the receiver, and treats the Master Audio tracks as DTS-HD mixes, and sends the CORE DTS stream as bitstream...so I'm okay there.

The issue comes in under the player's SPEAKER SETUP menu -- under the Panasonic's speaker setup, there are choices for 2 Channel or Multi-Channel. The manual is confusing in this respect, but according to all reports, Multi-Channel should be selected if you're running three or more channels, which I am (5.1). Normally, this speaker setup menu would JUST be for setting and adjusting speakers when you're connected via ANALOG OUT of the player...but I am running HDMI OUT ONLY from the player, which is digital, so I am uncertain what to leave these settings on for correct TrueHD decoding and playback...

I had been told to leave all speakers in this menu to LARGE and set all values and such to ZERO (0dB), this way, the decoded TrueHD tracks would pass to my receiver correctly, where the receiver would process the audio with its own speaker, distance, calibration values, etc. Is this true? Others have told me that no matter what I leave those speaker settings on in the Panasonic's menu, it won't matter because the player will treat all of them as LARGE due to the fact that I am running DIGITALLY via HDMI...is this also true?

I just want to be sure I am getting the TRUE decoded TrueHD tracks from the player via multichannel PCM, and apparently, it matters what those speaker settings are adjusted to in the player because they control the way the decoded signals on TrueHD tracks would be sent out -- can someone confirm this for me, as well as my connections/settings?

[blujacket]

The speaker settings ONLY apply to the ANALOG outputs. You're settings look right to me.

[No-So-Blu]

I too agree that your setup is correct.

The working of your Panasonic player is a moot point really, since your intent is to replace it with the OPPO BDP-83. This player will output bit-stream, so you can allow the Dolby TrueHD decoder in your receiver to handle the heavy lifting, as well as optimizing your speaker arrangement.

If you can, move to a 7.1 setup, so that you get the full benefit of Dolby TrueHD from your BD titles.

[kpkelley]

The speaker setup portion of your player will only come into play when the player is utilizing the Digital to audio converter on the player. When you send the information via hdmi, the digital audio is never converted into an analog signal. Thusly, these settings do not affect audio playback over the hdmi output or any other digital output.

[frieda]

Originally Posted by kpkelley

The speaker setup portion of your player will only come into play when the player is utilizing the Digital to audio converter on the player. When you send the information via hdmi, the digital audio is never converted into an analog signal. Thusly, these settings do not affect audio playback over the hdmi output or any other digital output.

Correction, audio is analog and your receiver converts the PCM signal it receives from your Blu-ray player to analog before sending it to your speakers.

Linksys2.4 our setup looks fine to me aswell.

[prerich]

Originally Posted by frieda

Correction, audio is analog and your receiver converts the PCM signal it receives from your Blu-ray player to analog before sending it to your speakers.

+1 hence the term Digital to Analog converters we will never be able to hear digital - we aren't built for it

[Linksys2.4]

Originally Posted by blujacket

The speaker settings ONLY apply to the ANALOG outputs. You're settings look right to me.

Thank you for getting back to me regarding this inquiry, Blujacket and everyone...

Blujacket, I'll reply to you first:

Are you SURE this only applies to ANALOG out? From what I am hearing, these settings DO affect the DECODED multichannel PCM TrueHD signals,too, so it appears these settings must be made right...

[Linksys2.4]

Originally Posted by No-So-Blu

I too agree that your setup is correct.

The working of your Panasonic player is a moot point really, since your intent is to replace it with the OPPO BDP-83. This player will output bit-stream, so you can allow the Dolby TrueHD decoder in your receiver to handle the heavy lifting, as well as optimizing your speaker arrangement.

If you can, move to a 7.1 setup, so that you get the full benefit of Dolby TrueHD from your BD titles.

Not really "moot point" if you read this part of my original post:

"While I am planning to replace my Panasonic DMP-BD10A with possibly the new OPPO, I am still having issues with the configuration of this player and how it handles internal operations, and I need to confirm these as I suspect I still have awhile to use this player before dropping some coin on the OPPO."

But thank you for keeping my mind at ease regarding the Oppo's bitstreaming...

Are there bugs that need to be worked out of the TrueHD performance of the Oppo, as I have been reading?

[Linksys2.4]

Frieda, Kelley and others:

There must be SOMETHING that is being "controlled" by this speaker setup menu when TrueHD signals are being converted to PCM for output over HDMI...

Once again, my setup is as follows: I have the "TrueHD" output of the player set to "PCM" and it's being sent over HDMI only from the Panasonic -- are you SURE no settings in that Speaker Settings menu of the player make a difference in this setup? NO settings here are affecting the decoded TrueHD signals, or in the passing of Uncompressed PCM tracks?

On the other end of the equation and system, my Onkyo 605 is reading "MULTICH" for listening mode when playing these TrueHD tracks from the Panasonic, with "PCM/HDMI/MULTICHANNEL" illuminated in small lettering above it...is this correct? Am I hearing the ACTUAL TrueHD audio decoded by the Panasonic through the Onkyo? Is the Onkyo handling bass management, distances, calibration, etc. at this point?

Thank you again everyone for all your help...

[Linksys2.4]

Originally Posted by blujacket

The speaker settings ONLY apply to the ANALOG outputs. You're settings look right to me.

BTW, Jacket, I have the exact Bell'O rack that's a knockoff made by your family member -- I have the powdered silver finish rack though; do you like the stand?

[blujacket]

Originally Posted by Linksys2.4

Are you SURE this only applies to ANALOG out? From what I am hearing, these settings DO affect the DECODED multichannel PCM TrueHD signals,too, so it appears these settings must be made right...

Yes.

[blujacket]

Originally Posted by Linksys2.4

BTW, Jacket, I have the exact Bell'O rack that's a knockoff made by your family member -- I have the powdered silver finish rack though; do you like the stand?

Yes, I love it. My dad did great.

[blujacket]

Originally Posted by Linksys2.4

On the other end of the equation and system, my Onkyo 605 is reading "MULTICH" for listening mode when playing these TrueHD tracks from the Panasonic, with "PCM/HDMI/MULTICHANNEL" illuminated in small lettering above it...is this correct? Am I hearing the ACTUAL TrueHD audio decoded by the Panasonic through the Onkyo? Is the Onkyo handling bass management, distances, calibration, etc. at this point?

That's correct

[BIslander]

Originally Posted by Linksys2.4

Are you SURE this only applies to ANALOG out? From what I am hearing, these settings DO affect the DECODED multichannel PCM TrueHD signals,too, so it appears these settings must be made right...

Peter, you have been making the same claim/inquiry about the BD10A on several forums for a couple of years. Every response to you has been the same - that speaker setups in the player only affect the analog outputs, which you are not using. So, where are you hearing this, if not here, at AVS, or at highdefforum?

But, why does this even matter? Since you seem unwilling to accept what everyone tells you about how players work, just set the outputs completely flat - 5.1, large speakers, all distances equal, and levels at 0. That prevents the player from making any adjustments. Problem solved , non-existent though it may be.

[Hammie]

Actually, it appears that he is correct. I just read through the user manual and on page 10 in the HDMI setup section is states:

≥From the Setup menu (➡ 23), set “HDMI Video
Mode” and “HDMI Audio Output” to “On”

≥If the speaker setup cannot be completed on
the amplifier/receiver, change multi channel
speaker settings by selecting “Multi -channel” in
“Speaker” of “Connection” tab (➡ 23).

I would turn this last selection to "Off," "Reset," or whatever and bypass the internal speaker processing. It will start to get confusing and possibly counter productive with both the BD player and receiver capable of the same thing.

[solarrdadd]

once you get your oppo, you will be able to have all 3 forms of HD audio either done by the player or bitstreamed to your receiver for decoding via HDMI. this includes DTS-HD-MA, Dolby True HD and Uncompressed PCM. I wouldn't any time worrying about the panny. if you have ordered your oppo then your just waiting for the delivery!

Best of luck, trust me, you are gonna love that Oppo, I've had mine for a while and it is one of the best investments i've made for my HT!

[BIslander]

Originally Posted by louhamilton

Actually, it appears that he is correct. I just read through the user manual and on page 10 in the HDMI setup section is states:

eFrom the Setup menu (¡ 23), set “HDMI Video
Mode” and “HDMI Audio Output” to “On”

eIf the speaker setup cannot be completed on
the amplifier/receiver, change multi channel
speaker settings by selecting “Multi -channel” in
“Speaker” of “Connection” tab (¡ 23).

?? BD10A owners who have responded to the OP elsewhere have all said the player speaker settings don't affect HDMI. (That's the way nearly all players work. The exceptions are higher end players such as the Denoin 3800BDCI, which offers it's own audio processing tools for digital transmission.)

The manual page you are quoting says if HDMI Audio is set to On, the HDMI handshake will determine the number of speakers regardless of what the user enters in the player configuration.

The manual says channel levels are not affected when HDMI audio is set to On.

As for the line in the manual saying "when connecting to an amplifier/receiver to enjoy multi-channel surround sound, use the following settings on this unit if they cannot be set on the amplifier/receiver" - it clearly applies to analog connections. Very few AVRs can process analog audio. The OP has an Onkyo 605 and he can set speaker layouts, crossovers, delays, and levels in his AVR. So, a literal reading of that line in the manual means the player settings do not apply since his AVR has settings that can be used.

This is all quite easy to test, of course. Use an SPL meter and a test disc. Run bass sweeps with speakers to set to large and small in the BD10A and see whether there's any change - do frequencies below the 100Hz crossover get rerouted to the sub when speakers are set to small?.

[Hammie]

I don't disagree with you at all. I just thought the wording in the manual was quite ambiguous and can lead one to think that they do matter.

[BIslander]

Originally Posted by louhamilton

I don't disagree with you at all. I just thought the wording in the manual was quite ambiguous and can lead one to think that they do matter.

Unfortunately, manuals are not always clear on these issues.

Some context. The OP has been posting about this on other forums for a couple of years. And, in the discussions I've seen elsewhere, he's been the only one worried about whether the speaker setups in the player affect the HDMI PCM output. Other owners are satisfied that it works as expected. Now, we get the same post here for yet another try.

All in all, this seems like a non-issue for a long since discontinued player. Also, there are simple ways to test the player and to prevent any unwanted processing.

[Linksys2.4]

Thank you, Lou. What you quoted below from the manual is EXACTLY WHY I HAVE BEEN CONFUSED ABOUT THE SETUP OF THIS PLAYER'S HDMI AND SPEAKER OUTPUT SECTIONS. Regardless of what anyone else says, the manual is making it COMPLTELY and UTTERLY confusing -- and I haven't covered this elsewhere.

Alas:

Originally Posted by louhamilton

Actually, it appears that he is correct. I just read through the user manual and on page 10 in the HDMI setup section is states:

≥From the Setup menu (➡ 23), set “HDMI Video
Mode” and “HDMI Audio Output” to “On”

≥If the speaker setup cannot be completed on
the amplifier/receiver, change multi channel
speaker settings by selecting “Multi -channel” in
“Speaker” of “Connection” tab (➡ 23).

I would turn this last selection to "Off," "Reset," or whatever and bypass the internal speaker processing. It will start to get confusing and possibly counter productive with both the BD player and receiver capable of the same thing.

...and THIS is why I have been so confused, as you see here; according to the MANUAL, if your RECEIVER cannot do speaker settings and such, THEN you should select MULTI CHANNEL in the player -- but our receivers CAN do speaker calibrations and such, of course, so I have ALWAYS been confused as to what to leave that setting on.

Since then, I had been advised to leave MULTI CHANNEL set if you're running THREE OR MORE speakers in the system, so I have done that; I am still wondering if that MULTI CHANNEL setting affects the decoded TrueHD tracks down the HDMI link...