I just realized (hardware brands support)

[quexos]

Sometimes something can be so much in front of your nose that you just don't see it, and correct me if i am wrong but:

how many hardware brands out there are releasing an hd-dvd standalone player ? Toshiba ... maybe LG but i'm not sure it's an hd-dvd only player. And that's all, correct ?

as for Blu: there are Sony, Philips, Panasonic, Samsung, Pionneer, LG, and more brands to release players later on ...

Why is this even a format war ???

[DealsR4theDevil]

Originally Posted by quexos

Why is this even a format war ???

Because Toshiba is heavily subsidizing it's players and, with the help of Microsoft, bribing studios to support them exclusive. Not to mention there is no shortage of cheap bargain bin shoppers out there who will buy w/e is for sale as long as its a cheap price.

[The Don]

Originally Posted by quexos

Sometimes something can be so much in front of your nose that you just don't see it, and correct me if i am wrong but:

how many hardware brands out there are releasing an hd-dvd standalone player ? Toshiba ... maybe LG but i'm not sure it's an hd-dvd only player. And that's all, correct ?

as for Blu: there are Sony, Philips, Panasonic, Samsung, Pionneer, LG, and more brands to release players later on ...

Why is this even a format war ???

LG and Samsung support combo players....

actually I haven't seen the samsung combo player, but have heard about it....it may have been pulled, but I doubt it...

but neither companies have a standalone HD-DVD player...

[Zaphod]

Onkyo has announced an HD-DVD stand alone...I don't know any others that have been announced (other than the other two already mentioned here).

[Innerloop]

I agree with you, but not even necessarily for the same reasons.

If I don't know all the details of the format war and I go into a store like Best Buy, what am I going to see?

I'll see one brand of player only for HD-DVD (maybe 1-2 models that look identical, basically) and for Blu-ray I am going to probably see models from 3-4 brands that I recognize; Sony, Panasonic, Samsung, etc.

Even though I only need one brand to buy a player, just the FACT that there are multiple brands there makes it obvious to the consumer that Blu-ray has broad support.

So in a weird way, the fact that those other players EXIST is more important than whether anyone or not buys them.

Whenever I see some new consumer electronics item and I only see it from one brand, it makes me think that it hasn't got a secure future.

[sj001]

Originally Posted by Zaphod

Onkyo has announced an HD-DVD stand alone...I don't know any others that have been announced (other than the other two already mentioned here).

Have you heard anything about this recently? That was a bit ago, and maybe they decided to shelve the idea...

[The Guardian]

Wasn't the Onkyo going to be an XA2 in a fancy case?

And there was always the venturer hehe.

Oh and they still have piles of the RCA HD DVD player at Costcos around here hehe.

I wish LG would produce a standalone Blu player though. Not that I'd buy it, but a lot of people seem to be LG fans.

It goes beyond number of items for sale though... each of these companies is busy buying endcaps for their products, not to mention bundling with their TVs etc... Toshiba TVs are most likely not in the top 5 for popularity around here (Sony, Sharp, Samsung, LG, Panasonic) so they would lose the bundling battle, badly.

[Patranus]

Originally Posted by Zaphod

Onkyo has announced.......

Until I can buy it from several stores, it does not exist as a consumer electronic.

This is the line that many HD-DVD supporters used when trying to state their argument. Announced MEANS NOTHING. I could announce a HD-DVD player for $~150 MSPR but until it is in production and being sold, it does not exist.- - venture anyone?

Hey, go look at the computer sector and see what support HD-DVD has on that side of the market. NONE. Where are the HD-DVD R/RW drives? Blu-Ray had it on day 1 and that is why BD is going to win, it is the complete package.

[joeorc]

Originally Posted by Patranus

Until I can buy it from several stores, it does not exist as a consumer electronic.

This is the line that many HD-DVD supporters used when trying to state their argument. Announced MEANS NOTHING. I could announce a HD-DVD player for $~150 MSPR but until it is in production and being sold, it does not exist.- - venture anyone?

Hey, go look at the computer sector and see what support HD-DVD has on that side of the market. NONE. Where are the HD-DVD R/RW drives? Blu-Ray had it on day 1 and that is why BD is going to win, it is the complete package.

exactly..

.Blu-Ray is supported by plextor which IMO is a sure fire sign that Blu-Ray is the better choice not just by the consumer's but also the companies that make OPTICAL DRIVES.guess which HD optical format Plextor does not make a drive for...

we know they make a Blu-Ray drive
http://www.plextor.com/english/products/px-B900A.html

[McBain]

Onkyo's web page for the player:

http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=...&class=DVD&p=i

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by The Don

LG and Samsung support combo players....

actually I haven't seen the samsung combo player, but have heard about it....it may have been pulled, but I doubt it...

but neither companies have a standalone HD-DVD player...

LG supports combos, currently.

Samsung has agreed to release one, compared to their three Blu-ray only decks, but I wouldn't expect it to go beyond that unless the sales justify its existence.

[Deane Johnson]

Toshiba has pretty much destroyed the HD-DVD player market with their cheap subsidized players. There isn't any reason for other manufacturers to get involved in a market where players sell below cost.

[itsfatboy]

same thing could be said for the cheapo guerilla marketting of VHS players back in the 80's. JVC and Emerson were pumping out VCR's for under $400 where Sony was still charging $800.

If the Korean / Chinese companies get on board with more cheapo players, the format with the most players in the market will win.

Thats not to say the better format wins.

Rather than competing against each on format, the a-hole manufacturers should have got together and put one format on the street - like the CD.
Its the same "we're better than you" mentality that sank both side of the SACD / DVD-Audio market.

There's still so little support out there for either audio format, they're as good as dead.

I'm hedging my bets, by buying both formats, in individual players.
Combo players = double the problems.

[sj001]

Originally Posted by McBain

Onkyo's web page for the player:

http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=...&class=DVD&p=i

Notice it says shipping soon, with no date of release. I wonder if they are waiting for something, like the death of HD-DVD.

[Sigmar_X]

I'm just totally confused as to why studios are caring so much about player sales. Honestly does it make a difference???

If you sell 50,000 players, but only sell 100,000 movies, that's only 2 movies per player. It should be the movie sales that matter more.

Ya Blu-Ray players cost more, but the movie sales are totally stacked.

I'd be way more impressed if I sold 20,000 players and sold 500,000 movies. Studios are looking at the wrong numbers, and least that my thoughts.

Warner confuses me, they should look at all their Blu/HD-DVD sales, and see how the Blu section is outselling their HD-DVD. Why the war is still on confuses me.

[LordGamer]

Originally Posted by Deane Johnson

Toshiba has pretty much destroyed the HD-DVD player market with their cheap subsidized players. There isn't any reason for other manufacturers to get involved in a market where players sell below cost.

Ditto.

Originally Posted by Sigmar_X

I'm just totally confused as to why studios are caring so much about player sales. Honestly does it make a difference???

If you sell 50,000 players, but only sell 100,000 movies, that's only 2 movies per player. It should be the movie sales that matter more.

Ya Blu-Ray players cost more, but the movie sales are totally stacked.

I'd be way more impressed if I sold 20,000 players and sold 500,000 movies. Studios are looking at the wrong numbers, and least that my thoughts.

Warner confuses me, they should look at all their Blu/HD-DVD sales, and see how the Blu section is outselling their HD-DVD. Why the war is still on confuses me.

Don't believe the hype. Movie sales are what matters more. HD DVD fanboys spew (misleading) attachment rates and standalone players, because what else do they got...nothing.

Well, HD DVD has more standalones and cheaper players.

Blu-ray sells more, period. The HD DVD fanboys are free to wake me when HD DVD starts to outsell or even catch up to BR software sales. Till then, they just keep saying the same ole', same ole' with nothing changing.

[lztp6k]

Originally Posted by Patranus

Hey, go look at the computer sector and see what support HD-DVD has on that side of the market. NONE. Where are the HD-DVD R/RW drives? Blu-Ray had it on day 1 and that is why BD is going to win, it is the complete package.

I thought HD DVD had support from the 1st and 3rd most popular sold computers. Is that wrong? That'd be great if incorrect.