Buster Keaton on Blu-ray

[koberulz]

I'm really not sure what the best version of everything is. There are multiple restorations floating around between Kino, Cohen and Eureka, Kino itself has released multiple different versions of some of his films. Some of these are presumably OOP now. What's the best way to get everything, including extras? I'll file answers in this post, and hopefully turn it into a decent resource for Keaton fans. I've tried to order releases of the same film by release date, if I've made any errors let me know.

Silent shorts

The first does not include his shorts working for Roscoe Arbuckle, only the shorts made once he started out on his own. I believe the Eureka edges the Kino for extras, even with the Eureka limited edition being out of print.

There's also this all-inclusive set, which exists in two versions that seem identical:


I'm fairly sure it contains the first-listed Kino for each of his features and the silent shorts, as well as the talkie shorts set mentioned below.

The Saphead

Both contain original and alternate versions, and Bret Wood version comparison. Kino adds a 30-minute audio interview with Keaton, and a one-minute "stunt montage" that is a total waste of your time, nothing more than a handful of pratfalls and absolutely none of his iconic stunts. Eureka goes with three different audio interviews, split across two audio tracks that play over the film: a two-parter with Kevin Brownlow from 1964 and a 1958 Eastman House radio interview. It also includes The Scribe, Keaton's final performance, which is also available on Kino's Blu-ray of The General (with a John Sebert audio commentary the Kino lacks), a 20-minute David Cairns video essay, and a David Kalat audio commentary.

Three Ages

The first three all feature the 1912 Griffith short "Man's Genesis", which inspired the Keaton film. The first Kino shares a location tour with the Eureka, while the second Kino shares a vintage Alka Seltzer commercial with the Eureka. The Cohen is barebones.

Exclusive to the first Kino are separate edits of each "age" presented individually, while exclusive to the second Kino is a 1960 "Candid Camera" clip.

Exclusive to the Eureka are a Kalat commentary, video essays by David Cairns and Fiona Watson, an Ian Lavender interview, featurette "The Six Ages of Comedy" based on a Keaton essay, and Keaton radio appearances from 1936 and 1960 (plus an undated French one that comes in at just under a minute), and a booklet.

Our Hospitality

The first Kino and the Eureka share a 26-minute "Making Comedy Beautiful" featurette and a 50-minute workprint cut of the film titled "Hospitality". The two Kinos share 1925 short "The Iron Mule". No exclusives for the first Kino, while the latter Kino adds a commentary from Farran Smith Nehme and Imogen Sara Smith, 1947 Keaton-starring short "Un duel à mort", 25 minutes on Robert Israel scoring the film, and a five-minute piece by Saul Bromberg. Eureka's only exclusive is a commentary on the workprint by Polly Rose, while the Kino version of it is supplemented by a five-minute introduction. The Cohen is barebones.

Sherlock Jr.

Eureka and Kino share a David Kalat commentary, tour of filming locations, and 22-minute "Movie Magic & Mysteries" featurette. Cohen is entirely exclusive, with a restoration trailer and two ~5 minute featurettes, "The Comedian" and "The Great Stone Face." Eureka's exclusive is a 56-minute documentary "Buster Keaton: The Genius Crushed by Hollywood", and a 60-page book in the limited edition.

The Navigator

Since this shares a disc with the prior film, the Cohen extras are the same. The Kino and Eureka share a commentary by Robert Arkus and Yair Solan as well as "Of Buster, Boats, Other Seacraft, and Working on The Navigator". Eureka's exclusive is a 34-minute David Cairns video essay, and 60-page book in the limited edition.

Seven Chances

Cohen includes nowt but a restoration trailer and four-minute "The Daredevil" featurette. Kino has a Bruce Lawton and Ken Gordon commentary, location tour, six-minute featurette on the two-strip Technicolor sequence at the start of the film, and short films "A Brideless Groom" and "How a French Nobleman Got a Wife Through the New York Herald Personals Columns", perhaps the best-titled film ever to have existed. Eureka has none of these, opting for a different commentary by Joel Goss and Bruce Lawton, a trailer, and comedy short "What! No Spinach?" which riffs on "Seven Chances", with a 60-page book in the limited edition.

Go West

All three include 1923 short "Go West". Kino and Cohen share a one-hour audio interview with Keaton entitled "Screenwriter". Cohen has an exclusive restoration trailer. Eureka adds a commentary by Joel Goss and Bruce Lawton, 28-minute David Cairns video essay, and 16-minute John Bengtson video essay on the film's locations, with a 60-page book in the limited edition.

Battling Butler

Cohen brings nothing new to the table, just the Daredevil featurette mentioned earlier. Kino has a couple of photo galleries. Eureka loads up on audio interviews with Keaton, featuring Irwin Allen, Arthur Friedman, Robert Franklin, Herbert Feinstein, and Studs Terkel, each as separate clips and all but one clocking in at over half an hour. 60-page book in the limited edition, as usual.

The General

This appears to have two different Kino releases and a Cohen release in the US. The solo Kino shares with the Eureka a minute of home movie footage, introductions by Gloria Swanson and Orson Welles, a location tour, and an 18-minute tour of The General. Eureka adds a Peter Kramer interview, while Kino's exclusive is a six-minute featurette "The Buster Express". Book in the LE.

Kino's two-film offering dispenses with all but the introductions, adding "The Return of the General" at 11 minutes and a commentary by Michael Schlesinger and Stan Taffel. Cohen has exclusive featurettes "Reflections on The General" and "Keaton: The Luminary".

College

All three include a tour of filming locations. Both Kinos have "The Scribe", included in Eureka's release of "The Saphead", while the Kino double bill adds introductions by Serge Bromberg and Lillian Gish, a commentary by Rob Farr, and 1928 short "Run, Girl, Run". Eureka adds "The Railrodder" and "Buster Keaton Rides Again", the former with commentary by director Gerald Potterton and cameraman David De Volpi and the latter with an additional audio track featuring a Q&A with the same two men. Book in the limited edition, etc etc.

Steamboat Bill, Jr.

The solo Kino has a video essay comparing the two versions, audio recording of the song "Steamboat Bill", and the stunts montage that's also on "The Saphead". Eureka has a "making of" which may be the same video essay, runtimes are very similar, not sure, and adds an hour-long interview with Keaton. Cohen has the same two featurettes as last time this one came up. The Kino double bill has a commentary by Michael Schlesinger and Stan Taffel, introduction by Serge Bromberg, and an Alka Seltzer commercial, which may be the same one as on Three Ages? Other than the stunts montage and possibly the video essay, no overlap here.

The Cameraman/Spite Marriage

Identical.

Talkie shorts


Sunset Boulevard:

Did the Paramount/WB/Paramount shuffle in the US, but otherwise they're identical. Beware some international editions are barebones.

Limelight:

The UK box set just contains the UK solo release. Different extras, none Keaton-releated.

It's a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World

Alternate version is exclusive to the Criterion, which also loads up on extras while the MGM has only one doco but it is exclusive.

Film/Notfilm

Split across two releases in the US, because screw you that's why. Extras are largely identical, except that Milestone has "Play of the Week" TV episode "Waiting for Godot" while BFI counters with an alternate version of the film from 1979 running an extra four minutes.

The Railrodder/Buster Keaton Rides Again


A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum

Both barebones.

The Scribe


Other

[Akibiyori]

The first Kino Our Hospitality had the 55 minute alternate version as well.

The first Kino editions of Our Hospitality, Three Ages, and the short One Week from the original shorts collection are all in 1080/60i, which means they all play completely smoothly, unlike the 1080/24p versions elsewhere.

[koberulz]

Really? I don't have the alternate cut on my media server, but I may have just not bothered with it.

[M A]

I know for some of them, the Lobster Films blus in France have newer restorations. Can't remember which off the top of my head

[Egbert Souse]

FYI, all films that appear on US Cohen and UK Eureka/MoC discs use the exact same masters, as do the 2016 US Kino and UK Eureka/MoC releases of the short films. Only real difference is that Eureka includes extensive supplements as opposed to be bare-bones US releases.

The short films are a bit much for me to compare properly, but here's my thoughts on the initial Kino releases (pre-Cohen) vs. the Cohen/Eureka releases, as well as two of the Lobster releases I've also seen...

THREE AGES:
Haven't seen the Lobster Films (double feature with The General) edition yet, only the 2010 double feature with Sherlock Jr. No opinion other than Kino's edition was quite nice for the time considering the lack of material.

OUR HOSPITALITY:
This is one of the few titles I've seen via the 2011 Kino Blu-ray, 2019 Kino/Lobster Films Blu-ray, and 2020 Eureka Blu-ray.

The 2019 Kino/Lobster Blu wins by a long shot, but I find the Carl Davis orchestral score on the other discs to be my favorite. The Lobster Films restoration uses a gorgeous film element and has had careful attention to cleanup.

SHERLOCK JR:
The Cohen 4K restoration looks best by a very long shot and I like Timothy Brock's score the most, even if the Mont Alto/Rodney Sauer one for Kino's first Blu-ray is equally excellent. This had the absolute worst score out of any of the films on Kino's old DVD.

THE NAVIGATOR:
Cohen 4K restoration looks better, but I don't get Cohen's insistence on not using tinting on Keaton's films, which is accurate on the earlier Kino edition. Same score, usually anything by Robert Israel works beautifully.

SEVEN CHANCES:
The bulk of the film on Cohen's 4K restoration looks significantly improved and they even kept the tinting this time. However, the Technicolor opening scene has disappointing color compared to the version on Kino's.

GO WEST:
Both the original Kino and Cohen seem to use the same source element, just with way more cleanup this time. No preference on score.

BATTLING BUTLER:
Same as Go West, both are good, but Cohen is cleaner.

THE GENERAL:
This is the one title I've seen the most editions of, so I'll break them down.
Kino 2009: Looked pretty amazing for its time and still looks decent, just a little more "digital" looking. Gorgeous tinting, plus it has Carl Davis' wonderful orchestral score as the primary track (plus Robert Israel's track recorded for laserdisc and an organ score by Lee Erwin).
Cohen/Eureka: Gorgeous, would be a frontrunner for the next silent film to get a UHD. Only negative would be the lack of tinting. Davis score maintained, but no alternates.
Lobster/Kino: While it doesn't look quite a lovely as the Cohen/Eureka version, I'd put this on par with the original Kino. No Davis score, but in its place is Joe Hisiashi's score that previously only appeared on a French DVD.

COLLEGE:
Cohen looks better, but even the Kino looks rough. Haven't seen the Lobster version, which may look better. No preference.

STEAMBOAT BILL JR:
Cohen by a long shot, Kino's original Blu is a bit too bright. The new score by Carl Davis is wonderful.

THE CAMERAMAN:
Criterion's disc is fantastic, but I really wish they had contacted Ben Model about his transcribed recording of the piano track that was on the VHS and laserdisc, as it's quite lovely despite its terrible audio quality. I found the DVD version by TCM Archives had a quite forgettable score by Arthur Barrow, but the new orchestral score by Timothy Brock is superb, as is the rest of his silent film work.

Other thoughts:
As there hasn't been a reissue of the Educational Picture shorts ("Lost Keaton") it would be a good idea if Kino somehow got the Columbia shorts Keaton made and perhaps put the two series together, plus maybe there's a way to clean up the utterly unlistenable audio.

Now that Kino is distributor for Cohen, perhaps they could do a UHD of The General and include the scores from both the Lobster and Cohen versions, as well as offer a second angle with the tinting intact.

[biglou114]

I need to point out that the version of Hard Luck on the original Kino release is incomplete and does not have the recovered ending that was found on a Russian print.

[bigshot]

Originally Posted by Egbert Souse

THE GENERAL:
This is the one title I've seen the most editions of, so I'll break them down.
Kino 2009: Looked pretty amazing for its time and still looks decent, just a little more "digital" looking. Gorgeous tinting, plus it has Carl Davis' wonderful orchestral score as the primary track (plus Robert Israel's track recorded for laserdisc and an organ score by Lee Erwin).
Cohen/Eureka: Gorgeous, would be a frontrunner for the next silent film to get a UHD. Only negative would be the lack of tinting. Davis score maintained, but no alternates.
Lobster/Kino: While it doesn't look quite a lovely as the Cohen/Eureka version, I'd put this on par with the original Kino. No Davis score, but in its place is Joe Hisiashi's score that previously only appeared on a French DVD.

My favorite is the Spanish release which runs at a faster, more natural frame rate than the other releases (25 fps?) It plays very well that way.

[koberulz]

Originally Posted by Akibiyori

The first Kino Our Hospitality had the 55 minute alternate version as well.

Fixed.

Originally Posted by Egbert Souse

FYI, all films that appear on US Cohen and UK Eureka/MoC discs use the exact same masters, as do the 2016 US Kino and UK Eureka/MoC releases of the short films. Only real difference is that Eureka includes extensive supplements as opposed to be bare-bones US releases.

What's the story with the films that got multiple Kino releases? Especially the ones that got multiple Kinos and a Cohen?

OUR HOSPITALITY:
The 2019 Kino/Lobster Blu wins by a long shot, but I find the Carl Davis orchestral score on the other discs to be my favorite. The Lobster Films restoration uses a gorgeous film element and has had careful attention to cleanup.

So this is a different resto than the Eureka?

THE NAVIGATOR:
Cohen 4K restoration looks better, but I don't get Cohen's insistence on not using tinting on Keaton's films, which is accurate on the earlier Kino edition. Same score, usually anything by Robert Israel works beautifully.

Is the Eureka tinted?

[Jim Pez]

Would love to see all his mgm talking films on Blu-ray.

[Egbert Souse]

Originally Posted by koberulz

What's the story with the films that got multiple Kino releases? Especially the ones that got multiple Kinos and a Cohen?

Kino handled North American home video of the "Raymond Rohauer" library, which was owned by a company Douris UK. This library was purchased by Cohen Media in the mid-2010s, so all of Kino's releases on DVD and Blu-ray eventually went out of print. I think the only non-Keaton release was Pandora and the Flying Dutchman.

Cohen was initially distributed by eOne in North America, while their titles have ended up at BFI, Eureka, and Arrow in the UK. After the Cohen purchase, a lot of restorations were finally underway. Pandora was initially a photochemical restoration, while the current Cohen Blu is a full digital one. They do also license films from Gaumont, TFI, Pathe, and others, but the core catalog is the old Rohauer library.

Is the Eureka tinted?

Nope, only Cohen restorations that have tinting are Battling Butler and Seven Chances. Worth noting that any films that appear as US Cohen and UK Eureka discs use identical restorations. For now, UK has exclusives for the Cohen restorations of The Saphead and Three Ages, but perhaps they'll turn up as the fifth Cohen Blu-ray.

For that matter, Cohen has been sitting on a 2K restoration of Broken Blossoms for at least five years.

[Egbert Souse]

Here's a breakdown of scores available on various releases...

K = First run of Kino Classics Blu-rays
C = Cohen Media (and also Eureka)
L = Lobster Films edition

THE SAPHEAD:
Andrew Earle Simpson [unknown] C
Robert Israel [small orchestra] K
Ben Model [organ/piano] K

THREE AGES:
Robert Israel [small orchestra, 2.0 stereo] K
Lee Erwin [organ, 2.0 mono] K
Uncredited [piano, 2.0 mono] K
Mont Alto Motion Picture Orchestra (2.0 stereo) L
(Note: Eureka's upcoming edition has no score information yet, but will probably use the Mont Alto or Robert Israel track]

OUR HOSPITALITY:
Carl Davis [Orchestral, 5.1 and 2.0] K/C
Donald Hunsberger [Small orchestra, 2.0] K
Robert Israel [small orchestra, 2.0] L

THE NAVIGATOR:
All releases use Robert Israel's small orchestra score.

SHERLOCK JR:
Timothy Brock [orchestral, 5.1] C
Mont Alto Motion Picture Orchestra [5.1/2.0] K
Club Foot Orchestra [electronic, 2.0] K
Compiled Jazz Score [2.0 mono] K

SEVEN CHANCES:
All releases use Robert Israel's small orchestra score.

GO WEST:
Mont Alto Motion Picture Orchestra C
Eric Beheim [electronic, 2.0 stereo] K

BATTLING BUTLER:
All releases use Robert Israel's small orchestra score.

THE GENERAL:
Carl Davis [Orchestral, 5.1/2.0 stereo] K/C
Robert Israel [small orchestra] K/L
Lee Erwin [organ] K
Joe Hisiashi [orchestral] L

COLLEGE:
Mont Alto Motion Picture Orchestra [2.0] L/C
John Muri [electronic] K

STEAMBOAT BILL JR:
Carl Davis [orchestral, 2.0] C
The Biograph Players [small orchestra] K
Timothy Brock [orchestral] K/L
Lee Erwin [organ] K/L
William Perry [piano] K

[Rzzzz]

More Buster on Blu...

[koberulz]

Originally Posted by Akibiyori

The first Kino editions of Our Hospitality, Three Ages, and the short One Week from the original shorts collection are all in 1080/60i, which means they all play completely smoothly, unlike the 1080/24p versions elsewhere.

What's wrong with the 24p versions? Sounds like they're far better restorations at source, not ideal if they each suck for different reasons.

[Diorm]

Why cant I find Lost Keaton anywere? Is it OOP? Is there a way to buy it anywhere?

[Akibiyori]

Originally Posted by koberulz

What's wrong with the 24p versions? Sounds like they're far better restorations at source, not ideal if they each suck for different reasons.

Sorry for the late response. They’re not 24 FPS films, so making them fit within a progressive 24 frame package means that repeat frames are added to do so. It creates a visible stutter to the motion several times each second. Interlacing allows the film’s frame rate to be handled differently, spreading out the frame rate within the fields of video. It lets the film be presented at the correct speed without any visible repeat frames in playback.

Back in the day, a certain review site would always harp on interlacing because of “combing artifacts” - the image breaking up into visible lines on screen - because they used computers to take raw screen caps from the discs which were meant to undergo some final processing when you actually watch the things under ordinary conditions. Combing isn’t necessarily visible on proper equipment - good players deinterlace properly. Some labels jumped on that site’s bandwagon for the good press and interlacing became a bad word even though it’s not bad at all…it’s good (interlacing also got conflated with the entirely different issue of PAL to NTSC conversion, which didn’t help.)

Most people don’t seem to notice or haven’t experienced the difference and so aren’t aware of it but the Kino Keatons I mentioned plus some other discs out there (Criterion’s Safety Last and their 20 FPS version of Passion of Joan of Arc, Milestone’s Mary Pickford set) are all interlaced and all completely smooth in playback for it versus other versions out there in 1080/24p. Other Keaton discs may have more recent restoration work but a lot of those films are in such condition that I find they’re not that superior to give up smooth motion over (these are “motion pictures” after all - the way they move is important.)

It’s not a battle I’m ever going to win, the issue is too far gone at this point, but I like to point it out whenever I can.

[Egbert Souse]

Originally Posted by Diorm

Why cant I find Lost Keaton anywere? Is it OOP? Is there a way to buy it anywhere?

It's been OOP for quite a while. The Kino release had good transfers, despite the rough state of the Educational Pictures library, but the sound really needed some work. It's borderline unlistenable on a few shorts.

One idea would be for Kino to work out something with both Cohen Media and Sony to package the Educational Pictures and Columbia Pictures shorts in one collection.

[Trekkie313]

Will the content here ever make it's way to HD?

[Areyakiddin]

Originally Posted by Trekkie313

Will the content here ever make it's way to HD?

Some of Buster Keaton's Alka Seltzer commercials are available in this collection:

[koberulz]

Originally Posted by Akibiyori

Sorry for the late response. They’re not 24 FPS films, so making them fit within a progressive 24 frame package means that repeat frames are added to do so. It creates a visible stutter to the motion several times each second. Interlacing allows the film’s frame rate to be handled differently, spreading out the frame rate within the fields of video. It lets the film be presented at the correct speed without any visible repeat frames in playback.

Back in the day, a certain review site would always harp on interlacing because of “combing artifacts” - the image breaking up into visible lines on screen - because they used computers to take raw screen caps from the discs which were meant to undergo some final processing when you actually watch the things under ordinary conditions. Combing isn’t necessarily visible on proper equipment - good players deinterlace properly. Some labels jumped on that site’s bandwagon for the good press and interlacing became a bad word even though it’s not bad at all…it’s good (interlacing also got conflated with the entirely different issue of PAL to NTSC conversion, which didn’t help.)

Most people don’t seem to notice or haven’t experienced the difference and so aren’t aware of it but the Kino Keatons I mentioned plus some other discs out there (Criterion’s Safety Last and their 20 FPS version of Passion of Joan of Arc, Milestone’s Mary Pickford set) are all interlaced and all completely smooth in playback for it versus other versions out there in 1080/24p. Other Keaton discs may have more recent restoration work but a lot of those films are in such condition that I find they’re not that superior to give up smooth motion over (these are “motion pictures” after all - the way they move is important.)

It’s not a battle I’m ever going to win, the issue is too far gone at this point, but I like to point it out whenever I can.

So I guess the next question is whether it's possible to take the Eureka discs of those films and reverse-engineer the frame rate conversion.

Is everything else presented correctly, or just equally wrong on all releases?

[Richard--W]

Useful thread, thanks for starting it.