Why I'll buy discs instead of downloads - Blu-ray Forum

photorebel · 01-13-2008, 06:33 AM

as will many others, if this is the kind of treatment we will get

Link:
http://www.seekingalpha.com/article/...rotect-content

Geech · 01-13-2008, 06:57 AM

J_UNTITLED · 01-13-2008, 08:53 AM

Here's a quote regarding downloads as the "real future of home entertainment" in regards to Apple, Inc. and it's upcoming MacWorld event...

Quote:

"It is going to the movies, likely announcing Tuesday the addition of movies for rent at its online iTunes Store for $3.99 apiece for 24 hours, the common window Hollywood has imposed on other digital movie rental services.

Apple will have lots of competition in this arena, but Apple "is setting the table for the consumer movie experience for the next 25 years," said Piper Jaffray analyst Gene Munster. "Today it doesn't matter but five, 10 years from now, it'll be how everybody will be watching movies."

partridge · 01-13-2008, 09:13 AM

But there is a huge difference between going to the movies and buying a movie to watch whenever you want. A cinema ticket is a bit like a temporary licence to view a movie; once you've seen it that's it all done. But you shouldn't have to worry about licences and DRM when you've paid for something that allows you to watch it whenever you want. This is why physcial discs will be here for a lot longer than the like of MS would like.

Look at what is happening with online music though, DRM being dropped by all the major companies, so there is hope yet. But I won't be buying any movies online until DRM is removed.

181 · 01-13-2008, 09:30 AM

HD Download is going no where, fast. I have 2 Terabytes of storage on my computer. I have an 8Mbps connection (that is 8 Megabits per second which is 1 Megabyte per second, as there are 8 bits to one byte). If I had to download the equivalent of a Blu-ray movie (50 Gigabytes) at full speed (1 Megabyte oer second), it would take me 13 hours to download 1 movie. Of course, if every body was trying to download a movie at the same time, it would come to a screeching halt.

I would also have room for only 40 Movies with my 2 Terabytes of storage. If any of my drives crash, I would lose hundreds of dollars.

Downloading would be a nightmare. Coaxial cable lines running to your house have an inherent physical bandwidth cap of 10Mbps to 14Mbps. In order for downloads to become feasible and deliver you the quality of a Blu-ray movie, ISP's would need to rebuild their entire infrastructure and run uncapped fiber lines to every single household (which isn't happening in the near future).

You want to try and stream it? Blu-ray transfers data at a peak rate of 48MBps for Audio+Video+Subtitles. You think you can get a broadband connection like that? No.

If HD Movie downloads go anywhere, the DRM on it would make it near impossible for the average person to share the movie with a friend, sell it or even seamlessly play it in any device that supports the format, as you would be able to do with a physical medium like a Blu-ray disc.

What makes sense (and this is what they are planning on doing) would be to distribute a portable copy of the movie on a Blu-ray disc. It avoids this mess of HD Downloads.

Joe Redifer · 01-13-2008, 09:35 AM

Microsoft already offers HD movies for download on their Xbox Live service. The file sizes are really small, only a few GB per movie. That means the movies are compressed all to hell. That's what MS wants... digital downloading/streaming of movies. Personally, I'll take a physical disc or even a solid state flash memory cartridge (which is probably where we're really goin') any day.

partridge · 01-13-2008, 01:08 PM

MS have been so short sighted with their console, they had to release a whole new version to make good use of their download service and like you say it is all compressed, so while I'm sure it is perfectly watchable, they can't honestly compare it to what you get on a blu disc.

Zaphod · 01-13-2008, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Redifer

Microsoft already offers HD movies for download on their Xbox Live service. The file sizes are really small, only a few GB per movie...

Also only at 720p, and you have to remember that the Xbox 360 cannot decode the higher resolution audio codecs so they bundle everything with only DD 5.1, which majorly reduces file size.

I agree that downloading HD content will go nowhere, and I think once Microsoft and the like realize this will never become mainstream, they will shift their focus for wireless streaming of HD content in it's raw disc form. I believe the physical medium will always be primary and then backing up that physical medium to the likes of a file server for wireless streaming would be secondary.

snoupee · 01-13-2008, 01:28 PM

i'm not sure about you guys, but in southern ontario we have monthly bandwith, which we would exceed if we wanted to dl more than one blu ray disc.

d_rob1031 · 01-13-2008, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snoupee

i'm not sure about you guys, but in southern ontario we have monthly bandwith, which we would exceed if we wanted to dl more than one blu ray disc.

I was about to post that. I thankfully don't have a cap but I know a lot of people around the world do. The consumer is already having to buy a blu-ray box, they dont want another one to take a shelf-space, another remote and the learning curve that goes along with it. Plus the fact that the internet is not the most reliable on service in many parts of the world.

Kairav · 01-13-2008, 01:37 PM

I have go blu completely. I have a PS3 and a Vaio AR series with Blu Playback. I would love to carry all of my movies with me wherever I go and would also like to play them in any Blu player I have.

xtop · 01-13-2008, 01:38 PM

you guys have redbox around you? rent movies out of a vending machine for a buck. why would i want to spend the time downloading a movie and still pay 4 bucks?

Kairav · 01-13-2008, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xtop

you guys have redbox around you? rent movies out of a vending machine for a buck. why would i want to spend the time downloading a movie and still pay 4 bucks?

+1. And they would have an exp. date.

Paden · 01-13-2008, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairav

+1. And they would have an exp. date.

Didn't people lose the movies they bought from Walmart's movie service or something like that already? I simply don't understand the logic behind using downloads. Quality and access are very limited at this time.

greekjgg · 01-13-2008, 02:26 PM

I think some folks need to lighten up here. Some of you are acting just as closed minded as HD Dud folks have been regarding Blu ray.

It's obvious that DL's are not on par TODAY with blu specs. That doesn't mean it won't in the next few years. Regular DVD's themselves took a few years to get good (Remember, widescreen discs were rare, dual layer, etc)

1. HD space ONLY gets cheaper, 2 Terabit drives will be small for a pc in a couple of years. Heck, today you can get a terabit for less then $100
2. Compression will only get better as time goes on
3. There is room for both to survive. I don't always need to buy a blu disc, sometimes I just want to rent a movie. I would NEVER want to own Rush Hour 3, but I did want to see it. Sometihng like Pirates, I do want to own and bought it.

As early adopters we don't reflect the avg customer who may be fine and dandy with a download where we get SO arrogant that we can only watch movies in the BEST circumstance?

xtop · 01-13-2008, 02:33 PM

you must not see the problems with digital downloads then

a lot of america can't get broadband still today
if your download is corrupted how do you get a new copy, a physical copy can be taken back to the store
what happens when your hard drive dies
where are the movie extra's
how do i let my friend borrow my copy

we could go on for days....

dadkins · 01-13-2008, 02:35 PM

Time limited?
DRM?
Hours at full speed just to get a single video?
Comcast and their famous "Inviso-Caps" that hover in the 200-300GB per month range?

Not happening!

What about people with one of the slower broadband connections - or no broadband whatsoever.
Some friends I have are dialup only.
They can still BUY a BD and play it fine, download ~20+GB? I don't think so!

ezcobar411 · 01-13-2008, 02:38 PM

I personally won't be downloading movies until that becomes as dependable as owning a physical format. I wonder how long that will take

dadkins · 01-13-2008, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greekjgg

I think some folks need to lighten up here. Some of you are acting just as closed minded as HD Dud folks have been regarding Blu ray.

It's obvious that DL's are not on par TODAY with blu specs. That doesn't mean it won't in the next few years. Regular DVD's themselves took a few years to get good (Remember, widescreen discs were rare, dual layer, etc)

1. HD space ONLY gets cheaper, 2 Terabit drives will be small for a pc in a couple of years. Heck, today you can get a terabit for less then $100
2. Compression will only get better as time goes on
3. There is room for both to survive. I don't always need to buy a blu disc, sometimes I just want to rent a movie. I would NEVER want to own Rush Hour 3, but I did want to see it. Sometihng like Pirates, I do want to own and bought it.

As early adopters we don't reflect the avg customer who may be fine and dandy with a download where we get SO arrogant that we can only watch movies in the BEST circumstance?

Ponder this:
A DVD rip encoded in XviD @ 700MB.
Do a little math here... dialup is roughly 3 minutes per MegaByte.

3 x 700 - 2100 minutes - 35 hours.

Care to try and imagine an actual DVD @ 7-9GB?
Let's think about HD at... 12? 17? 25GB.

Yeah, that'll fly, huh?

mystiksuicide · 01-13-2008, 02:43 PM

If both where available today download and Blu-Ray id still buy my movies on blu. When i look for a movie to take to a friends house i want a case not a hard drive.

Here is a dumb question but are downloaded movies going to come with all the extra features we now get with blu-ray?

01-13-2008, 06:33 AM	#1
photorebel Active Member Member since:Dec 2007	Why I'll buy discs instead of downloads as will many others, if this is the kind of treatment we will get Link: http://www.seekingalpha.com/article/...rotect-content

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01-13-2008, 06:57 AM	#2
Geech Active Member Member since:Nov 2007 Location:Reading, PA Blu-ray reviews:2

01-13-2008, 09:13 AM	#4
partridge Blu-ray Ninja Member since:Oct 2005 Location:England	But there is a huge difference between going to the movies and buying a movie to watch whenever you want. A cinema ticket is a bit like a temporary licence to view a movie; once you've seen it that's it all done. But you shouldn't have to worry about licences and DRM when you've paid for something that allows you to watch it whenever you want. This is why physcial discs will be here for a lot longer than the like of MS would like. Look at what is happening with online music though, DRM being dropped by all the major companies, so there is hope yet. But I won't be buying any movies online until DRM is removed.

01-13-2008, 09:30 AM	#5
181 Active Member Member since:Dec 2007	HD Download is going no where, fast. I have 2 Terabytes of storage on my computer. I have an 8Mbps connection (that is 8 Megabits per second which is 1 Megabyte per second, as there are 8 bits to one byte). If I had to download the equivalent of a Blu-ray movie (50 Gigabytes) at full speed (1 Megabyte oer second), it would take me 13 hours to download 1 movie. Of course, if every body was trying to download a movie at the same time, it would come to a screeching halt. I would also have room for only 40 Movies with my 2 Terabytes of storage. If any of my drives crash, I would lose hundreds of dollars. Downloading would be a nightmare. Coaxial cable lines running to your house have an inherent physical bandwidth cap of 10Mbps to 14Mbps. In order for downloads to become feasible and deliver you the quality of a Blu-ray movie, ISP's would need to rebuild their entire infrastructure and run uncapped fiber lines to every single household (which isn't happening in the near future). You want to try and stream it? Blu-ray transfers data at a peak rate of 48MBps for Audio+Video+Subtitles. You think you can get a broadband connection like that? No. If HD Movie downloads go anywhere, the DRM on it would make it near impossible for the average person to share the movie with a friend, sell it or even seamlessly play it in any device that supports the format, as you would be able to do with a physical medium like a Blu-ray disc. What makes sense (and this is what they are planning on doing) would be to distribute a portable copy of the movie on a Blu-ray disc. It avoids this mess of HD Downloads.

01-13-2008, 09:35 AM	#6
Joe Redifer Member Member since:Jan 2008 Location:Denver, CO USA Blu-ray collection:63 Blu-ray reviews:9	Microsoft already offers HD movies for download on their Xbox Live service. The file sizes are really small, only a few GB per movie. That means the movies are compressed all to hell. That's what MS wants... digital downloading/streaming of movies. Personally, I'll take a physical disc or even a solid state flash memory cartridge (which is probably where we're really goin') any day.

01-13-2008, 01:08 PM	#7
partridge Blu-ray Ninja Member since:Oct 2005 Location:England	MS have been so short sighted with their console, they had to release a whole new version to make good use of their download service and like you say it is all compressed, so while I'm sure it is perfectly watchable, they can't honestly compare it to what you get on a blu disc.

01-13-2008, 01:28 PM	#9
snoupee Member Member since:Mar 2007 Location:Toronto	i'm not sure about you guys, but in southern ontario we have monthly bandwith, which we would exceed if we wanted to dl more than one blu ray disc.

01-13-2008, 01:37 PM	#11
Kairav Expert Member Member since:Nov 2007 Location:Atlanta Blu-ray reviews:9 Trading Score:5	I have go blu completely. I have a PS3 and a Vaio AR series with Blu Playback. I would love to carry all of my movies with me wherever I go and would also like to play them in any Blu player I have.

01-13-2008, 01:38 PM	#12
xtop Blu-ray Count Member since:Oct 2007 Blu-ray collection:- DVD collection:- Digital collection:- Trading Score:3	you guys have redbox around you? rent movies out of a vending machine for a buck. why would i want to spend the time downloading a movie and still pay 4 bucks?

01-13-2008, 02:26 PM	#15
greekjgg Expert Member Member since:Jun 2007 Trading Score:1	I think some folks need to lighten up here. Some of you are acting just as closed minded as HD Dud folks have been regarding Blu ray. It's obvious that DL's are not on par TODAY with blu specs. That doesn't mean it won't in the next few years. Regular DVD's themselves took a few years to get good (Remember, widescreen discs were rare, dual layer, etc) 1. HD space ONLY gets cheaper, 2 Terabit drives will be small for a pc in a couple of years. Heck, today you can get a terabit for less then $100 2. Compression will only get better as time goes on 3. There is room for both to survive. I don't always need to buy a blu disc, sometimes I just want to rent a movie. I would NEVER want to own Rush Hour 3, but I did want to see it. Sometihng like Pirates, I do want to own and bought it. As early adopters we don't reflect the avg customer who may be fine and dandy with a download where we get SO arrogant that we can only watch movies in the BEST circumstance?

01-13-2008, 02:33 PM	#16
xtop Blu-ray Count Member since:Oct 2007 Blu-ray collection:- DVD collection:- Digital collection:- Trading Score:3	you must not see the problems with digital downloads then a lot of america can't get broadband still today if your download is corrupted how do you get a new copy, a physical copy can be taken back to the store what happens when your hard drive dies where are the movie extra's how do i let my friend borrow my copy we could go on for days....

01-13-2008, 02:35 PM	#17
dadkins Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Jan 2007 Location:Hercules, CA Blu-ray collection:35 Blu-ray reviews:2	Time limited? DRM? Hours at full speed just to get a single video? Comcast and their famous "Inviso-Caps" that hover in the 200-300GB per month range? Not happening! What about people with one of the slower broadband connections - or no broadband whatsoever. Some friends I have are dialup only. They can still BUY a BD and play it fine, download ~20+GB? I don't think so!

01-13-2008, 02:38 PM	#18
ezcobar411 Special Member Member since:Dec 2007	I personally won't be downloading movies until that becomes as dependable as owning a physical format. I wonder how long that will take

01-13-2008, 02:43 PM	#20
mystiksuicide Blu-ray Guru Member since:Sep 2007 Location:Miami Blu-ray collection:305 Blu-ray reviews:27	If both where available today download and Blu-Ray id still buy my movies on blu. When i look for a movie to take to a friends house i want a case not a hard drive. Here is a dumb question but are downloaded movies going to come with all the extra features we now get with blu-ray?

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