Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Coov

OK... simple. Star Wars used to be remembered as setting a new standard to the motion picture industry. As a child the effects were bar none the COOLEST THING EVER! Sure NOW the effects are quite dated, but that is what makes it a classic. You don't see CGI thrown into the classic King Kong, or the original Clash of the Titans. Could you imagine the response if such classics were "fixed" and trashed the originals?

Seeing as the original filmmakers of King Kong are dead...

I don't mind Georgie boy fondling his own creation until it is no longer recognizable at to what it was... but PLEASE offer the classics that we grew up with!

Help me out here, what's unrecognizable now in the original Star Wars Trilogy?

[KubrickFan]

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

Watch the 'making of' on the DVDs, where he clearly states that he thought of a cool way to celebrate the 20th Anniversary of 'A New Hope', so he decided to re-release them in the theaters, have some of the special/visual effects fixed that had really made him sick ever since its release, and also to see whether the things he had in mind for the PT were actually feasible, and to bring them more up to date for modern audiences...many reasons as usual.

The problem with that is, that many directors probably feel the same way about movies they made, yet they don't add in unnecessary CG. Not to mention that most of the effects really didn't need replacement anyway. And what's going to happen when the CG looks out dated? Is he going to replace those shots again?
Lucas himself said that 'movies aren't released, they're taken from the director's hands.' He needs to realize that, and come to grips with it.

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

It makes perfect sense. Just read my posts above.

He is a member of the Film Foundation, because he doesn't want any darn studio executives tinker with the classics, like turning them into a 3-D theme park ride, coloring them, or something like that, but every creator has the right to tinker with HIS OWN movies for crying out loud!!

Why is that so hard to understand for some of you???

Again, they are HIS movies, so even if he is a member of the Film Foundation, he has EVERY RIGHT to improve HIS movies, because HE created them, they are his vision, his composition, his work, his legacy.

This is the very last time I respond to such a post. Some people simply cannot be helped!

Okay, easy there.
So, studio executives have no right to screw around with a movie they have the rights to, but the creator (who, in this case owns the rights to his movie) does? It's just plain hypocritical of him. He wanted control of his own movies so that studios wouldn't screw around with them, and instead he does it himself. You might not like it that the debate over original versions vs. special editions is on again, but if he'd just preserve the original versions before it's too late, then there'd be no complaints about it. I can't understand why anyone would be against that and rants like we're the bad guys.

[Bluyoda]

Originally Posted by Coov

OK... simple. Star Wars used to be remembered as setting a new standard to the motion picture industry. As a child the effects were bar none the COOLEST THING EVER! Sure NOW the effects are quite dated, but that is what makes it a classic. You don't see CGI thrown into the classic King Kong, or the original Clash of the Titans. Could you imagine the response if such classics were "fixed" and trashed the originals?

I don't mind Georgie boy fondling his own creation until it is no longer recognizable at to what it was... but PLEASE offer the classics that we grew up with!

Those movies were all about the special effects, which were ground-breaking then, but SW is about the story, not its effects, so it makes perfect sense to upgrade, and fix the really ugly ones.

Also, those movies are now loved for their old-fashioned effects and cheesy story, simply for nostalgic reasons, whereas SW is loved for having universally appealing themes that are timeless.

Furthermore, I think the makers of those movies might already be that, and if they weren't, I doubt it'd make a difference, since they are not their films, as SW are George's movies.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by KubrickFan

So, studio executives have no right to screw around with a movie they have the rights to, but the creator (who, in this case owns the rights to his movie) does? It's just plain hypocritical of him. He wanted control of his own movies so that studios wouldn't screw around with them, and instead he does it himself. You might not like it that the debate over original versions vs. special editions is on again, but if he'd just preserve the original versions before it's too late, then there'd be no complaints about it. I can't understand why anyone would be against that and rants like we're the bad guys.

Yes, he CREATED it. It's HIS creation. The fact that you watched it doesn't give you control.

So you trying to force someone to adhere to your rules about his creation makes you the "bad guys" as you said.

[Coov]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Seeing as the original filmmakers of King Kong are dead...

...and when that happens to Georgie he will finally stop tweaking his movies for the almighty buck!

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Help me out here, what's unrecognizable now in the original Star Wars Trilogy?

Sebastian Shaw was unrecognizable with Hayden's floating head.
The Star Wars universe sure got cyan!
The character rape of Han Solo. (He used to be cool, shooting first and all)
Jedi Rocks
Pink lightsabers
Walking all over Jabba
Boba Fett was not Australian
Stormtroopers... copy, paste, copy, paste, copy, paste, copy, paste...

Star Wars was a classic, now it is a giant heap of poo-doo! That is all I am saying.

[Bluyoda]

Originally Posted by Alpha

Someone forgot to take their meds.

Originally Posted by MarkWM

Somebody needs to monitor his caffiene...

I don't take meds, nor do I drink coffee, but thanks for your concern.

I was just saying....

Whatever, if he did restore the OT and put it on BD, I wouldn't mind.

Why should I?

If it makes people happy to make unrealistic demands then go for it!

I really couldn't care less.

I am going to have the time of my life with those BDs regardless!

[Roonil Wazlib]

We can all say we want one version or the other, but when it comes right down to it, we are all going to buy whatever comes out... And probably every version that comes out after that... lol

That said, in a perfect world we would get to see both versions on blu at some point... As for me, I want an all new special edition set to completely overhaul all the special effects on all 6 movies, which would include:

Everything redone on ANH... Yes... Everything

A completely new death star battle scene from ANH and ROTJ, and better looking death star explosions (think of how good the asteroid scene from AOTC looked)

Get rid of all the cloudy boxes around the ships in ESB... Or complete CGI

Keep the original fat Millenium Falcon (Not the skinny CGI one from the SE's)

Redo the battle in the arena at the end of AOTC... Honestly, that looks terrible..

I could go on with this list forever, but these are the big ones for me. If they were to do this, at least all of the effects would look more consistent between all of the movies.. Just an opinion though

[aggienader08]

Originally Posted by Coov

OK... simple. Star Wars used to be remembered as setting a new standard to the motion picture industry. As a child the effects were bar none the COOLEST THING EVER! Sure NOW the effects are quite dated, but that is what makes it a classic. You don't see CGI thrown into the classic King Kong, or the original Clash of the Titans. Could you imagine the response if such classics were "fixed" and trashed the originals?

I don't mind Georgie boy fondling his own creation until it is no longer recognizable at to what it was... but PLEASE offer the classics that we grew up with!

I agree with you about offering us the classics we grew up on, but we don't see CGI thrown into King Kong because it's really really old, and Clash of the Titans is just a terrible movie. Plus, your argument kinda went out the window when they made remakes for those two, I mean the effects for those two movies are SO BAD that the only thing they could do is remake it. I'm not questioning your opinion about King Kong being a classic, but Clash of the Titans? can hardly go in the category of a classic on the scale of Star Wars Ep. VI, V, & IV

[KubrickFan]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Yes, he CREATED it. It's HIS creation. The fact that you watched it doesn't give you control.

So you trying to force someone to adhere to your rules about his creation makes you the "bad guys" as you said.

I thought film making was always a collaboration. Guess I must be wrong .

[Coov]

Originally Posted by aggienader08

I agree with you about offering us the classics we grew up on, but we don't see CGI thrown into King Kong because it's really really old, and Clash of the Titans is just a terrible movie. Plus, your argument kinda went out the window when they made remakes for those two, I mean the effects for those two movies are SO BAD that the only thing they could do is remake it. I'm not questioning your opinion about King Kong being a classic, but Clash of the Titans? can hardly go in the category of a classic on the scale of Star Wars Ep. VI, V, & IV

Thanks for the maturity of your post.

I am simply referring to what I grew up with and memories as a child. You know, waking up early on Saturday morning to watch cartoons, jumping toy cars off the curb in the driveway, and the General Lee was the coolest car ever... That is classic to me in this case. I want to watch movies from my childhood and remember what it was like to be a kid... no matter how cheesy and fake it looks now. Star Wars was HUGE when I was growing up... now to go back I have to refer to a DVD bootleg from a laserdisc.

[kpkelley]

Originally Posted by Coov

Boba Fett was not Australian

They're both from New Zealand.

[Bluyoda]

Originally Posted by Roonil Wazlib

We can all say we want one version or the other, but when it comes right down to it, we are all going to buy whatever comes out... And probably every version that comes out after that... lol

That said, in a perfect world we would get to see both versions on blu at some point... As for me, I want an all new special edition set to completely overhaul all the special effects on all 6 movies, which would include:

Everything redone on ANH... Yes... Everything

A completely new death star battle scene from ANH and ROTJ, and better looking death star explosions (think of how good the asteroid scene from AOTC looked)

Get rid of all the cloudy boxes around the ships in ESB... Or complete CGI

Keep the original fat Millenium Falcon (Not the skinny CGI one from the SE's)

Redo the battle in the arena at the end of AOTC... Honestly, that looks terrible..

I could go on with this list forever, but these are the big ones for me. If they were to do this, at least all of the effects would look more consistent between all of the movies.. Just an opinion though

Well, THAT's a little extreme, isn't it!?

There are still many great shots in ANH, but especially some of the Death Star fight scenes with the model kits should be replaced with more realistic looking vistas of the Death Star's surface. ROTJ is better, but the shot where a huge Star Destroyer flies vertically into something monumentally huge, probably supposed to be the surface of the Death Star, really needs to be replaced by something that actually looks decent at least. That, to me, has always been the worst shot in all of the SW movies.

I don't think the Arena battle in AOTC is bad at all. The compositing could be improved a bit, but that's it.

I agree, that the explosions of Alderaan and the Death Star in ANH are laughable.

The Deat Star explosion in ROTJ OK though.

I say replace msot of the puppets that are seen more then 2 sceonds with CG creatures, most necessary for Lando's co-pilot in ROTJ. That's one awful mask!

There are still many cool looking shots in the OT, so no need to replace them all.

[TheOneWithThePrize]

Originally Posted by Roonil Wazlib

We can all say we want one version or the other, but when it comes right down to it, we are all going to buy whatever comes out... And probably every version that comes out after that... lol

Nope, if the SEs are all we'll ever get then I'm out.

[Batman1980]

Originally Posted by Roonil Wazlib

We can all say we want one version or the other, but when it comes right down to it, we are all going to buy whatever comes out... And probably every version that comes out after that... lol

That said, in a perfect world we would get to see both versions on blu at some point... As for me, I want an all new special edition set to completely overhaul all the special effects on all 6 movies, which would include:

Everything redone on ANH... Yes... Everything

A completely new death star battle scene from ANH and ROTJ, and better looking death star explosions (think of how good the asteroid scene from AOTC looked)

Get rid of all the cloudy boxes around the ships in ESB... Or complete CGI

Keep the original fat Millenium Falcon (Not the skinny CGI one from the SE's)

Redo the battle in the arena at the end of AOTC... Honestly, that looks terrible..

I could go on with this list forever, but these are the big ones for me. If they were to do this, at least all of the effects would look more consistent between all of the movies.. Just an opinion though

As much as I love these movies, as with LoTR, I plan to only get them once so I'll pretty much go for whichever editions come out.

[Cinemaddict]

Originally Posted by bluyoda

every creator has the right to tinker with HIS OWN movies for crying out loud!!

That's not the issue. George Lucas can make as many versions of Star Wars as he wants. The issue is that he refuses to release the originals in the best possible quality.

I'm going to wait for them to be available individually. I have no interest in buying the prequals again. And I will only buy the originals if they are the theatrical versions.

Originally Posted by saprano

Does anybody have a list, or a site i can go to where they show all the changes crazy george made to star wars 4 1 5 2 and 6 3?

Try wikipedia.

The change that always gets overshadowed in discussion is the color palette. The movies looked just AWFUL on DVD. Crushed black levels and ridiculously oversaturated. Check out this comparison video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWRs0ZD8ay4

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by KubrickFan

I thought film making was always a collaboration. Guess I must be wrong .

If you have interviews with objections on the SE changes from his collaborators, please by all means share them.

Lucas wrote them, he directed the first and closely supervised the others. ALL shots and edits were approved by him. The production company s LucasFilm. It's his product.

Being in the audience doesn't make you a collaborator. You're a viewer.

[TheOneWithThePrize]

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

Those movies were all about the special effects, which were ground-breaking then, but SW is about the story, not its effects, so it makes perfect sense to upgrade, and fix the really ugly ones.

Now, this is where you are painting yourself into a corner. If this really was all about the story then the effects would have zero meaning to Lucas. Something that the prequel proves so well where the effects have taken over and the story (and dialogue, oh, the dialogue...) has taken second place.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Cinemaddict

The change that always gets overshadowed in discussion is the color palette. The movies looked just AWFUL on DVD. Crushed black levels and ridiculously oversaturated. Check out this comparison video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWRs0ZD8ay4

Does the comparison video show them as projected? Video comparisons are moot.

The DVDs aren't perfect but they are far from "awful".

[Coov]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Does the comparison video show them as projected? Video comparisons are moot.

The DVDs aren't perfect but they are far from "awful".

We finally agree... awful would be a compliment!

[Cinemaddict]

From a genre perspective, the thing I always found interesting about Star Wars (the original trilogy) was the natural look. It didn't look like a flashy fantasy film. The 2004 DVDs undo that. It now looks like an oversaturated wonderland.

In the case of Empire Strikes Back, the alterations seem like nothing short of Lucas stabbing Kershner in the back. During the production, Lucas kept telling him that ESB would be Kershner's film. Lucas didn't even go to the premiere, because he didn't want to steal the attention from Kershner. "It's your film. You go." Then 20 years later, he becomes the very thing he hated so much. Lucas becomes the studio giant who went in and changed another director's work.