To put this in brutal perspective, physical media is not even two percent of streaming revenue.
If you add all the physical media sales to to 56.2 billion, you get to...wait for it...about 57 billion.
It's a non-entity in the current marketplace.
Which might be in a weird way a good thing. Physical media is like extra paper route money and not seen as a threat to their precious streaming, otherwise they might just shut it down completely.
Disney is more than just a film production company, like many other studios. They have their theme parks, and various TV networks that make their own money. Plus, restoring films and putting them on Disney+ may entice viewers to subscribe.
If Disney needed to sell discs to make a profit we'd get more discs but they don't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlockjr
All the major studios have asset protection programs that have been ongoing for over over a decade. That's to make sure their assets don't physically deteriorate, get lost, burn up in a wildfire, etc so that they're available to potentially create revenue in later years, even if there's no current or immediately planned use for them.
Those involve high res scans of the best available film elements and perhaps restorations from those scans if there's thought there might be a release on some medium (DCP, streaming, cable, etc).
Restorations, color grading, digital format output, etc can be done anytime after those scans are created, even years after, once the assets are protected. It seems that some studios do a lot of that expensive and time consuming work soon after scans are done, at least on some titles, others just save the scans for later potential use.
WAC takes advantage of the asset protection work Warner Motion Picture Imaging (MPI) is already doing for WB asset protection. Don't know how the restoration, color grading, etc is divided up between them, though certainly WAC does the final digital work to create a releasable BD master. DCP, streaming, cable etc versions are likely left to other groups.
There's a lot--many, many years--of critical digital work left to do. I saw a talk on this a year ago: out of roughly 10,000 classic 1930-1949 Hollywood titles at only 330 titles were currently available on theatrical DCP rentals prepared for public exhibition.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CRASHLANDING
True, but the market for theatrical DCPs of vintage films is miniscule even just measured against the demand for physical media. They're never going to create DCPs for anything but the most well-known films, because the minor ones are unlikely to draw more than a handful of people at a theatrical exhibition.
We're much better off hoping that the studios continue to focus on preservation and mastering for home media, which is the best pathway to maintain wider public access to these older properties. There's a lot of work to do there as well, but I'm encouraged by the progress even if (like everyone else on these forums) I wish it was moving faster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlockjr
Times have changed. Reports from independent, repertory, and other theaters around the country show a major upsurge in audience for classic films. Such and upsurge that some of those theaters have had to hire dedicated programmers to book those older films. And a significant problem they're having is a lack of available DCPs for many of the major titles they want to book.
Often there are film prints still available, but the infrastructure, both hardware and human, is often lacking now. And the cost of booking and shipping a film print--if the distributor trusts the theater to run it without damage--is often 2-3 times more than the same title on DCP, which makes that financially untenable.
Most of that surging audience for classic cinema--including movies on 35mm film--is actually under 35. The younger audience--at least those who go to independent theaters--seems to be looking for something different than the multiplex superhero fare. Especially on film, which has taken on a retro flavor similar to vinyl records--which now are the by far the largest dollar amount of physical music sales.
Well, they are drawing people now! Take a look at the far less known titles available on theatrical DCPs from Janus and Kino Lorber, for example. Which doesn't even count the DCPs of even older and more obscure titles coming from various archives like LoC, UCLA, BFI, Austrian Film Archive, etc. Once you have a high res, restored digital version of a title turning it in to a theatrical DCP isn't that much extra work, but then it makes it accessible for a theatrical audience. The way those films were always intended to be seen.
Preservation, absolutely. But home media formats are not preservation formats. Once the preservation formats are created, and then restorations, color grading, etc are done, the home media formats are derived from those higher quality, archival versions. Home media releases are just a (shrinking) by product of those preservation efforts.
As mentioned above, it seems that for younger people, the theatrical experience is becoming the way they're being exposed to and enjoying older properties, whether DCP or film. I attend an annual nitrate film festival in a small city, and the audience last year was the largest it has been since it started in 2016. This year they introduced premium assigned seating and at the higher price those sold out in less than a week. Meanwhile the older/classic films I've gone to see theatrically near also tend to be very full. Last night I attended a screening (sadly on DCP) of MULHOLLAND DRIVE that was sold out in a 430 seat venue. On a Tuesday night with BD, 4K, and streaming options all readily available now and for the past several years. The theatrical audience for older films is real.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DukeTogo84
Disney will probably be the first major studio to completely abandon physical media in the US. Give them 1-2 years tops.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DimitriL
I can't answer why they withhold it, but they genuinely are committed to their archival efforts. (And I imagine there are legal benefits to ongoing restoration efforts - no one can claim public domain for orphaned or abandoned works, theoretically.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaronBlud
Presumably they withhold physical media because they are trying to push people to use their streaming service, that's been at least theorized if not said out loud by a Disney employee. Why they don't put many of their films on Disney+ is probably because they see little to no value in them, in music terms they concentrate on their greatest hits and don't care about the B-sides as they estimate that they would get so few eyeballs. But Disney still has ongoing preservation and restoration programs to prepare for a possible future scenario where those B-sides go up in value.
I think what I was wondering isn't why isn't X on disc, but why isn't it out at all? So many films and TV shows aren't available at all.
For example, Song Of The South has been fully restored. What is the point? What is the point of spending easily several hundred thousand dollars to restore a three-strip negative, only to sit it on a shelf? Not on D+, not on another platform, not on disc...just not out at all?
What's to gain by paying to restore and maintain something they have in intention of releasing?
I think what I was wondering isn't why isn't X on disc, but why isn't it out at all? So many films and TV shows aren't available at all.
For example, Song Of The South has been fully restored. What is the point? What is the point of spending easily several hundred thousand dollars to restore a three-strip negative, only to sit it on a shelf? Not on D+, not on another platform, not on disc...just not out at all?
What's to gain by paying to restore and maintain something they have in intention of releasing?
I mean, the answer for Song of the South is pretty obvious: they are concerned that the negative impact of unfavorable publicity around the film would outweigh any financial gain. We can agree or disagree with that reasoning, but it's not really a mystery.
As to why it might be restored anyway, the answer is preservation. Even if it doesn't make sense to release something today, by restoring it they would preserve that option for later if it seemed more viable. If they don't preserve the films, they won't have any option to monetize them later.
Which might be in a weird way a good thing. Physical media is like extra paper route money and not seen as a threat to their precious streaming, otherwise they might just shut it down completely.
Yes, if they're smart they would realize that physical not only does impact streaming, but prob. encourages it.
I have every streaming service (except Apple), and there are numerous cases where I'll see a movie has a physical release, look it up, see it's streaming and just decide to wait and watch it that way.
I save the physical releases for titles I want to invest my time in (Oppenheimer, Brutalist, TV Shows), or that I want on the shelf to encourage deliberate viewing vs. the randomness of streaming (which is where Criterion releases often fit), or that I just want physical releases for the heck of it (like VinSyn, or Caligula).
So if anything, getting involved in physical media has only increased my reliance on streaming because I'm that much more committed to ensuring I have access to movies where I'm not quite motivated for a physical purchase.
I think there are extremes of course - people who basically only watch physical and have the cut the cord otherwise....and people who only stream and can't imagine a physical copy. I think most people on this forum skew toward my side.
So if the media producers had sense (not a sure thing), they would see that a healthy, niche physical market is to their benefit in all ways.
For anyone that's been looking for a copy of A Matter of Life and Death, which has been largely unavailable for months now from Criterion and others, it's back in stock at Deep Discount:
Restorations do not extend copyright, which for US films is assumed to be 95 years (there's some odd accidental exceptions, but if a film is more than 95 years old it's definitely public domain). Any new creative material added to a film--like a newly recorded music track for a silent film, or newly re-created intertitles for that same silent film--will have their own copyright. But once the original film is over 95 years old, it's PD.
I’m not talking about them losing their copyrights so much as enhancing their legal position in protecting them. That’s always part of their efforts. (When it comes to *extending* copyrights…well, you just make a live-action version of the property. Voila. You just bought yourself another century or so of that IP, even as the original animated films fall into public domain.)
And actually received today. Took six days to go from Louisville to Memphis, two more to travel the last 60 miles to my house. Ridiculous, but they're here. Late Ozu collection is finally mine!
And actually received today. Took six days to go from Louisville to Memphis, two more to travel the last 60 miles to my house. Ridiculous, but they're here. Late Ozu collection is finally mine!
Nice. One of my favorite Criterion purchases. I've likely rewatched the films from that set more than anything else in my collection.
Masahiro Shinoda has passed. One of the very best. Criterion has released Demon Pond and Pale Flower on Blu-ray and they have the rights to a slew of others. Hopefully one day they release Under The Blossoming Cherry Trees which I consider his best work.
I’m not talking about them losing their copyrights so much as enhancing their legal position in protecting them. That’s always part of their efforts. (When it comes to *extending* copyrights…well, you just make a live-action version of the property. Voila. You just bought yourself another century or so of that IP, even as the original animated films fall into public domain.)
Masahiro Shinoda has passed. One of the very best. Criterion has released Demon Pond and Pale Flower on Blu-ray and they have the rights to a slew of others. Hopefully one day they release Under The Blossoming Cherry Trees which I consider his best work.
Perhaps the last of the Japanese New Directors. Samurai Spy is my favorite ninja film of all-time. Himiko and Double Suicide are also absolute favorites of mine. All three deserve to be on Blu-ray. A lot of people don't know that he directed the film on the 1972 Sapporo Winter Olympics, similar to Kon Ichikawa with the 1964 Tokyo Olympics.
Looking at this photo, I can't imagine how amazing Under The Blossoming Cherry Trees would look on BD. Please Criterion, make this happen at some point.
Criterion Channel has a Shinoda collection up featuring 19 of his films (even though it is on the Channel, for some reason his Sapporo Winter Olympics film isn't included in this collection.)
I mean, the answer for Song of the South is pretty obvious: they are concerned that the negative impact of unfavorable publicity around the film would outweigh any financial gain. We can agree or disagree with that reasoning, but it's not really a mystery.
As to why it might be restored anyway, the answer is preservation. Even if it doesn't make sense to release something today, by restoring it they would preserve that option for later if it seemed more viable. If they don't preserve the films, they won't have any option to monetize them later.
If ever there was a time in history to release Song of the South in the most over the top, boutique, full-splash, 100 percent lean-in to every single aspect, it would be right now. It obv won't happen, but this is the moment to get away with everything.
If ever there was a time in history to release Song of the South in the most over the top, boutique, full-splash, 100 percent lean-in to every single aspect, it would be right now. It obv won't happen, but this is the moment to get away with everything.
There's already been hundreds of such releases of Song Of The South...from pirates.
Reports from independent, repertory, and other theaters around the country show a major upsurge in audience for classic films. Such and upsurge that some of those theaters have had to hire dedicated programmers to book those older films. And a significant problem they're having is a lack of available DCPs for many of the major titles they want to book.
My daughter is president of the film club at her university (a very well-known school with many alumni working within industry), and she has a seat at the table for programming at the on-campus theater (a century-old gem).
To your point, the interest is high, and securing titles is not as simple as clicking a button. It requires a great deal of planning to secure the most wanted, i.e., the most likely to fill seats.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ophone
It's also a thing about the location. When I see where you're from I believe you on the spot. The nerd and film enthusiasts percentage is way higher among university students.
Absolutely. The college years are the most formative, and while it's true a majority of university students are perfectly happy streaming Netflix, there is a percentage that streams but also seeks something deeper, something beyond what is current and non-mass market.
To stream the Criterion Channel, or even better, have a few Criterion titles on your shelf, as a young adult is a way to define yourself as a person of substance with knowledge and appreciation of the arts.
This is the market that studios must capture and physical media is a way to attract and build an audience. We have to acknowledge that success is outsize to simple sales numbers. The efforts by A24 is a master class in how to build a brand for this audience and elevate films on the strength of their brand, e.g., EEAAO.
All countries
Argentina
Austria
Belgium
Brazil
Bulgaria
Chile
China
Colombia
Cyprus
Czech Republic
Estonia
Denmark
Finland
Greece
Hong Kong
Hungary
Iceland
Indonesia
Ireland
Israel
India
Latvia
Lithuania
Malaysia
New Zealand
Norway
Philippines
Poland
Portugal
Romania
Russia
Singapore
South Africa
South Korea
Sweden
Switzerland
Taiwan
Thailand
Turkey
Ukraine
United Arab Emirates
Took six days to go from Louisville to Memphis, two more to travel the last 60 miles to my house. Ridiculous, but they're here. Late Ozu collection is finally mine! 
Linear Mode
