Sony Black Crush on late-2014 / early-2015 BDs

[wesslan]

One week to JP disc, hopefully someone bought it and we can get those caps also

[Geoff D]

Gonna watch the UK bluray later.

[sixty-inch]

Originally Posted by wesslan

And as many others have said, the US BD doesn't look that way for many including me so stop juding one title based on some screenshotcomparison shots. If it looked that way every professional reviews would notice.....

I'm still waiting for more comparisons

What do you expect from more screen comparisons? The US Disc won't get any better thereby...

I've already made a couple of them:

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/114853/
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/114860/
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/114928/

and like Indiana Jonezzz and BONKERS already said the Disk looks how it looks and the Black Problem definitely exists so stop denying it..

[StingingVelvet]

Some cherry-picked shots look super dark, yes. If you've watched the film on BD however you will know all the inside-the-tank shots are not like that. The outside shots consistently look better on the US BD in these comparisons, IMO.

The official review here mentions a "couple" super black scenes but still gives the disc a perfect 5.0 for picture quality:

Fury, photographed on film and presented on Blu-ray in a "Mastered in 4K" 1080p presentation, looks stunning. Aside from a shot or two in which black levels struggle with depth and accuracy, the image is striking, even considering its primarily bleak, cold, gray-dominant appearance. The image reveals any number of accurate, lifelike, tactile details, not only on worn, rough, scarred, and grimy human faces but also in the battered, rusted, muddy, and bullet-riddled tank exteriors and interiors alike. The image is meticulously representative of the murky, unwelcoming wartime landscape, down to the finest uniform wear and tear, worn bluing on firearms, and bits of gore. Colors are largely drained, save for a somewhat livelier middle stretch in which the men interact with a couple of women in their German home where cheerier primaries prevail over the gray-heavy palette that shapes the rest of the movie. Flesh tones appear accurate and reflective of the way source light influences them. Very light grain accentuates the image. No wear and no major compression issues plague the release. This is a stellar presentation from Sony.

I'm done arguing black crush or not, I'm just saying the disc looks great and the DVD/Polish BD look blown out and worse in 90% of caps.

[grrrarg]

If there wasn't a problem, there wouldn't be a 23 (going on 100) page thread.

Hopefully Sony can identify and rectify this problem before they ruin any more releases.

[tenia]

Originally Posted by Pieter V

Fury French Blu-ray screenshots:

http://www.hdnumerique.com/dossiers/...ml#prettyPhoto

And here's mine for Retro HD : http://retro-hd.com/tests/blu-ray/1953-fury.html

[sixty-inch]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

I'm done arguing black crush or not, I'm just saying the disc looks great and the DVD/Polish BD look blown out and worse in 90% of caps.

I have both Blu-Ray Disks and i entirely prefer the Polish Version over the US one for sure and there is absolutely nothing blown or washed out on my TV > it Looks like a movie and not like a dark hole...

[cirik]

There is no doubt that US BD is borked but let me start on something a little different - looking at US BD of Fury reminds me of what happened with Drive Polish BD which was authored with incorrect levels.

Left US BD (Sony), Right Polish BD













Incorrect black levels despite crushed blacks result in more saturated colors so regular Joe Sixpack might prefer it especially in daylight scenes but US BD of Drive and PL BD of Fury are not washed out - they are the correct ones. Period.


Now look what happens if I screw up US BD with incorrect levels (I've just enabled 16-235 to 0-255 in Media Player Classic Home Cinema):

Left - US (borked by me), Right - PL BD (unchanged)









They are almost the same.
Lastly, check what happens if I brighten them to extreme level:

Left - US, middle US (borked by me), Right - PL.





Check how incorrect levels affects shadow details - even extreme brightening is not helpful. Details are gone forever.
Just what happened to Fury US BD.

[Naiera]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

I'm done arguing black crush or not, I'm just saying the disc looks great and the DVD/Polish BD look blown out and worse in 90% of caps.

You're still wrong. It's nice of you to leave the matter alone though, because your denial wasn't helping anyone.

[Wernski]

Originally Posted by Pecker

Before we go any further, and irrespective of whether there's a problem with these discs or not, that's quite wrong.

Others may like to watch the restoration documentary on the restored Godfather Collection.

In it Robert Harris discusses Gordon Willis' cinematography, shooting techniques, and in particular the way he got his reputation as the 'Prince of Darkness'; something quite relevant to our discussion here.

Harris notes that other directors shoot with a lot of light to spare, creating a lighter film than intended, where the low level light detail and overall brightness of the film is generally lowered at the printing stage. However, he notes that Willis shot films very darkly in the first place, so there is only ever one way to print a Willis film.

The point is that, unlike Willis, most DoPs shoot dark films much brighter than they intend them to be shown, then darken the film in post-production.

Your contention that everything on the OCN should make it onto the Blu-ray Disc is inaccurate.

What we do know is that a great number of reviews of the film on its original cinema release discussed how dark it was, and whatever the pros and cons of these releases, none of the ones we're discussing other than the Sony Blu-rays, look like the sort of films which anyone would ever call dark.

Steve W

These Sony blus are being taken from the OCNs?

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by Wernski

These Sony blus are being taken from the OCNs?

[Naiera]

Ain't no one taking nothin' from no dang original camera negatives, yo

[Geoff D]

Just watched the UK Fury Blu-ray. Right from the off I could tell something was wrong. Forget about caps and Polski versions and VOD and all that other shit; when Wardaddy comes flying off the tank to kill ze German and we're supposed to get our first good look at him (when the camera tilts up from the body) you literally cannot see his face. Brave artistic choice or a simple balls up? The tank interiors are little better, with the pervasive blacks sucking the detail out and leaving their faces peeking out of the darkness (reminds me of Pazuzu in the Exorcist ). The blacks sometimes have a bluey-purple tinge that does the image no favours either.

I'll admit that the effect seems to get less offensive as the movie wears on - perhaps my brain simply got used to it and stopped pining for shadow detail that just wasn't there? And I'd be lying if I said I didn't like the contrasty look of the brighter daylight scenes, where I never felt like I was missing any vital picture information in the shadows. But man, when they gets back in the tank....damn.

Overall, the problem is just too harmful in the scenes that it does overtly affect, so the Blu-ray comes as a crushing (heh) disappointment.

[sixty-inch]

Found something interesting from another Forum:

Sony has provided us with links to various clips from the film. I have not reviewed these for spoilers, so proceed at our own risk!

http://video.sonypictures.com/homevi...80_YouTube.mp4

http://video.sonypictures.com/homevi...80_YouTube.mp4

http://video.sonypictures.com/homevi...80_YouTube.mp4

http://video.sonypictures.com/homevi...80_YouTube.mp4


Look at those Clips^^ they are definitely using an other (proper) master of the film, for me it Looks similiar to my Polish BD it also has the English Subtitles Hardcoded.

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by sixty-inch

Found something interesting from another Forum:



http://video.sonypictures.com/homevi...80_YouTube.mp4

http://video.sonypictures.com/homevi...80_YouTube.mp4

http://video.sonypictures.com/homevi...80_YouTube.mp4

http://video.sonypictures.com/homevi...80_YouTube.mp4


Look at those Clips^^ they are definitely using an other (proper) master of the film, for me it Looks similiar to my Polish BD it also has the English Subtitles Hardcoded.

Those clips are straight from Sony. No one can say that Apple or UV did something with their software.

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by Naiera

You're still wrong. It's nice of you to leave the matter alone though, because your denial wasn't helping anyone.

I'm not wrong because I'm not arguing anything but subjective taste. I went in not knowing anything about this issue and thought the BD looked amazing. The reviews both here and on other BD review sites say it looks amazing. In 95% of the caps posted I think the US BD looks much better. The rare blackout inside the tank is cherry-picked, you see a ton of facial detail on the BD inside the tank.

None of that can be "wrong." Black crush or not, it is what it is.

[tama]

Foxcatcher is a recent Sony release. If this was a wide problem wouldn't this release have same/similar issues?

[Bad Sandwich]

Originally Posted by StingingVelvet

I'm not wrong because I'm not arguing anything but subjective taste. I went in not knowing anything about this issue and thought the BD looked amazing. The reviews both here and on other BD review sites say it looks amazing. In 95% of the caps posted I think the US BD looks much better. The rare blackout inside the tank is cherry-picked, you see a ton of facial detail on the BD inside the tank.

None of that can be "wrong." Black crush or not, it is what it is.

Actually, aesthetic preferences aside, you *are* sort of wrong, since you keep labeling the Polish Fury release as "blown out", which denotes a specific issue that actually does not affect that release.

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by tama

Foxcatcher is a recent Sony release. If this was a wide problem wouldn't this release have same/similar issues?

Whiplash and Foxcatcher are both from Sony Pictures Classics. Maybe different people are authoring those titles compared to the ones listed in the OP, which are all mainstream productions.

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by Bad Sandwich

Actually, aesthetic preferences aside, you *are* sort of wrong, since you keep labeling the Polish Fury release as "blown out", which denotes a specific issue that actually does not affect that release.

I see the caps, I think they look too bright and blown out. That's my opinion, it cannot be wrong.