Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[El_Jay]

Originally Posted by iamsometal

Sure, and that's why Return of the King won an Oscar for best picture.

Elijah Wood's possession by the ring occurred over the course of 3 films. Or did you miss that?

Anyone who thinks Anakin's 20-minute "turn to the dark side" is even remotely comparable to the nuanced performance Wood puts on as Frodo over the course of 12 hours of film is not one to be reasoned with, so don't even try.

This guy will debate whether Hayden Christensen is a better actor than Robert DeNiro. It's just not going to be possible to reach common ground.

[NYorker]

Originally Posted by kingkong650

You´ve got to love how PT Anakin and all the PT characters take greatest precedence in this image from the UK box and the US box. That said, this UK image is a lot better than the US version, Han, Luke and Leia are more prominent in this one and not stuck in the top right corner like they are in the US one. Perhaps the PT didn´t do as well in the UK as it did in the US?

The way George with this blu-ray release is targeting the younger demographic by giving precedence to the PT, all in order to milk a new generation, while ignoring the old fans of the OT that he´s already milked numerous times, is pretty blatant and somewhat cynical if you ask me.

Bingo. That pretty much sums up everything about this release.

And by the way, anyone who paid more than $0.10 for a poster of this is being robbed.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by El_Jay

The difference is that the new Trek movie was really good, and it's intentionally a 'reboot' and not some crap they tried to retcon into the Star Trek canon.

Furthermore, he isn't part of going back into Shatner/Nimoy Star Trek movies and digitally adding actors who weren't born when the movies were made.

The original Star Trek movies still exist and are still being produced. The original Star Wars are not.

Yeah, the older Star Trek movies, series, etc, are still available for those who want them. It's not like this new movie was made to replace the original Star Trek Motion Picture, with the original movie never getting released ever again or anything like that.

[NexusVerbal]

Originally Posted by Beast

Well, we'll have to agree to disagree. There's no real contradictions. They're all one well inter-connected story to me.

There's a lot of contradictions, Beast. Anyone who knows the films well enough can see them clearly. Lucas has just tried to patch them over as well as he could by making stuff up as he goes along.

And they're not really well-interconnected. Too many coincidences and convenient things happen, especially in Revenge of the Sith. Some of the story elements didn't seem to flow naturally into Episode IV, and just felt a little shoehorned, if you know what I mean.

[masterrusell]

I need help guys! In Spain (and Germany too, as we share the edition of the movies with our rich neighbous from Central Europe :-) we´re getting the English audio in a lossy track... In a glorious DTS 6.1 (we don´t know yet if at 768 kbps or 1.5 Mpbs)!!!

We hope that this issue is presented only in the "original" (If Lucas keeps changing things, nothing will be left from the movies releases from 1977 to 1983) trilogy or in all 6 movies. Anyway, this is totally unacceptable and we don´t get why LucaFilm and Fox are stealing us the DTS HD audio track for the English version but they do included and HD track... for the German track!
I mean, what we are getting is a lossy DTS track for the English (the most important audio track in the set, as it is the original language of the film) and Spanish track (6.1 EX for English and 5.1 for Spanish) and a DTS HD for the German track.

Do you believe that? Can you possible imagine the reaction of the fans if Fox release these movies (or whatever movies) in the US with a lossy track???

So does anyone have any e-mail address of LucasFilm? I´ve chacked their website but I didn´t find any link and I would like to write them about this issue.

Thanks so much for your help.

[aiman04]

Originally Posted by masterrusell

I need help guys! In Spain (and Germany too, as we share the edition of the movies with our rich neighbous from Central Europe :-) we´re getting the English audio in a lossy track... In a glorious DTS 6.1 (we don´t know yet if at 768 kbps or 1.5 Mpbs)!!!

We hope that this issue is presented only in the "original" (If Lucas keeps changing things, nothing will be left from the movies releases from 1977 to 1983) trilogy or in all 6 movies. Anyway, this is totally unacceptable and we don´t get why LucaFilm and Fox are stealing us the DTS HD audio track for the English version but they do included and HD track... for the German track!
I mean, what we are getting is a lossy DTS track for the English (the most important audio track in the set, as it is the original language of the film) and Spanish track (6.1 EX for English and 5.1 for Spanish) and a DTS HD for the German track.

Do you believe that? Can you possible imagine the reaction of the fans if Fox release these movies (or whatever movies) in the US with a lossy track???

So does anyone have any e-mail address of LucasFilm? I´ve chacked their website but I didn´t find any link and I would like to write them about this issue.

Thanks so much for your help.

You can get it from Amazon FR or UK. Anyway, you can try publicity@lucasfilm.com.

[WannabeSpiderMan]

Originally Posted by FC4L

Awesome post. Accept I don't think ROTS is 4 years after AOTC. I thought it was 2, or 1 like Empire to Jedi.

Thanks. Officially the Clone Wars lasted 3 years. So in TPM Anakin was 9/10 yrs old, then AOTC was roughly 10 yrs later, making him 19/20, then ROTS is after 3 years of war, making him 23 or 24. So ANH is 20 years later, making Vader 43/44, ESB is 3 years later, making him 46/47, and ROTJ is just 1 yr later, making him 47/48 when he dies.

[georgec]

There was a shout out to George Lucas in tonight's Curb Your Enthusiasm episode.

[masterrusell]

Originally Posted by aiman04

You can get it from Amazon FR or UK. Anyway, you can try publicity@lucasfilm.com.

Thanks for the link Aiman!

Yes, it is what i´m going to do... Or getting the US version if it is region free, but the key of the problem is why something that it is suposed to be sacred, like the audio, has been raped in such a rude way. This is the only version that has not the English audio in an HD track and I´d like to know why from LucasFilm (´cause Fox Spain are a bunch of incompetents that found out this problem when a user warned them in their facebook page and then told us that this was the best quality possible for the audio in the LucasFilm archives... B******t!).

[ahossein79]

Originally Posted by hipster.doofus7

Anakin was not "evil" in the second movie. He was still a good guy, who in a fit of rage did something evil. It makes him a flawed and angry person, but not completely evil (yet). We don't even know as viewers if the women and children were not involved in the death of Anakin's mother.

And oh, douche-baggery has nothing to do with good or evil. A person can be a douche and a good guy at the same time. Anakin in AotC was a teenager. 80% of teenage males are douchebags. That's all the explanation you need to understand his behavior at that age.

Also, Anakin's temper was already evident in TPM. His short fuse was evident by his reaction when Padme called him a slave. He then got into that fist-fight with Greedo in the deleted scenes. He was jawing with Sebulba before the pod race. When the Jedi Council debated his candidacy for the Order, Anakin was practically seething in the background. Finally, when Qui-Gon tells Anakin to stay put in the cockpit... Anakin disobeys, and distorts the technical meaning of Qui-Gon's word to justify his disobedience. Funny enough, that's the exact same thing he does with Obi-wan's orders in AotC.







Anger is what drove Anakin to kill the women and children. That was made explicitly clear in AotC. He was clearly remorseful after the fact. And it was obvious he committed this slaughter in a fit of rage. That's why he was sorry and crying.

TPM made it explicitly clear that Anakin had a problem with anger. I already listed examples above. Yoda even made that loooong speech to Anakin about anger leading to hate and suffering. How much more explicit do you want it to be? Yoda practically spells it out for you. Do I really need to connect the dots for you too?

I swear, some people are just so blind with hate they've lost any sense of objectivity.

Finally someone who gets Anakin's character, I swear I have had it with people who rag on the prequels who make no attempt to get Anakin's character and why I feel the no in ROTJ is not completely out of place with the new Blu-Ray release. Believe it or not I fall in the camp where I love the changes but I wish he would release the theatrical versions of the movies also on blu ray because it is the versions I grew up with. In phantom menace it is important we see Anakin as a kid because we see him as a kind kid with a great heart, though with a inferiority complex due to being a slave which causes him to have a bad temper, and causes him to lash out. It is not hard for me to vision Anakin as Vader. I am 32 and Vader is my favorite movie character of all time I guess it still bothers some fans to acknowledge Vader is more of a character you fear and pity, a man who could have had anything and lost it all because of paranoia, arrogance and ignorance. I might pop in Episode 2 or 3 on blu ray first because I think those might floor me the most with the visual presentation. I have every intention of picking up this box set, at Barnes & Noble I did in store reservation for $83.99 plus my member discount and I am so hoping for a 20% of coupon and I might be able to snatch this for close to $70 regardless I still feel at $90 which is $15 a movie plus 3 bonus discs the box set is a great deal!

[octagon]

Originally Posted by WannabeSpiderMan

At the end of TPM, Palpatine is introduced to Anakin, the boy who is destined by prophecy to destroy him, and he says something along the lines of "I shall watch your career with great interest".

AOTC skips ahead 10 years, and it shows Palpatine and Padawan Anakin having a private meeting on a first-name basis, which in it's context gives the impression that they meet all the time. Palpatine has become a father-figure. Also, various lines of dialogue that Anakin says throughout the movie proves that someone has been feeding his ego, and has filled his head with ideas that their democratic system is broken and that maybe they would be better off with a Dictator. (Clearly this was Palpatine.)

ROTS shows that Anakin's friendship and trust with Palpatine is so defined that Anakin had previously shared his darkest shame, that he killed the sand-people after his mother's death, with Palpatine. And Palpatine clearly did not chastise him for it, but suggested that he had done the right thing, and kept his secret. He then also goaded Anakin into killing the unarmed Dooku, telling him that it was okay, and that he should feel justified in his revenge. Which Anakin was clearly conflicted about. He then purposefully appointed Anakin to be a Jedi Master, knowing full well that the Council would reject that idea, further frustrating Anakin.

It was made clear that Palpatine had preyed on Anakin's fears and fed his ego and filled his mind with warped views to further his agenda over the course of 14 YEARS. Which I might add, were the most impressionable years of a man's life. And yes, a large chunk of that time was between films as they jumped ahead in time, but they still provided enough evidence to make it obvious what had transpired, if you paid attention.

By 'a large chunk' do you mean all of it? I understand what you're saying but that missing chunk is basically Anakin's entire second act. It's the bridge between a decent, normal kid and a fairly savage adult and we didn't see any of it. Anakin being capable of that kind of brutality was just presented as a fait accompli - it was just the kind of guy he was. How he became that kind of guy? Eh, details...details...he just did.

That didn't work for me.

It turned what could have been a very interesting character into a bad Seinfeld parody - How did Anakin Skywalker become Darth Vader? Well, he was a pretty normal kid and yada yada yada he slaughtered an entire village and Palpatine pretty much took it from there.

[WannabeSpiderMan]

Originally Posted by MCT

haha....one throwaway line TPM and ONE SCENE in AOTC is all thats needed to build a believeable bond between these two for you? Christ. Imagine what three whole movies that established their relationship would have done. Implying isnt enough. The payoff is much much much more powerful when characters are developed thoroughly....not 5 minutes of screentime before the climax takes place. Its funny how underdeveloped characters get critisized in every other movie but when it comes to the Prequels, theres every excuse and crazy leaps in logic to defend the poor writing.

So you are not only disregarding the other examples I gave, but also all of the interaction between them in ROTS. You are giving the impression that you would rather the films spend a much larger chunk of time on Palpatine and Anakin having their conversations for you to invest. But tell me this, were you satisfied with the very limited screen time together for Luke and Obi-Wan, or Luke and Yoda in the OT? Luke and Obi-Wan were barely together before Obi-Wan's sacrifice, and yet Luke had a bond with him. Luke barely had time with Yoda in ESB before it skips ahead a year in time and Luke's training is complete in ROTJ. Yet that was good enough for you at the time, right?

I'm not pretending these films are screenwriting masterpieces. But they are made for children, and children want to enjoy the spectacle of heroes on adventure, and not watch 2-4 hours of a character being corrupted by a villain on an intimate level. The adult mind wants that, but it's just not the spirit of Star Wars.

[Ray O. Blu]

Wow, It's been a LONG time since I watched Star Wars. I just watched some scenes from both discs that came in the 1997 dvd set. Talk about not aging well. Cheesefest. I now understand Lucas' motivation to "modernize" the OT with current tech. I just don't think it will help. The whole saga needs to be redone with current technology and better actors. I guess I've outgrown muppets and low-budget, plastic costumes after all.
I know. I know. My loss... I'm bummed out a little because I LOVED these movies as a kid at the theater.

(I seriously don't care if Greedo shoots first or not. He looks like one of the rubber ducks that kids play with in the bathtub!)

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by hipster.doofus7

Anakin was not "evil" in the second movie. He was still a good guy, who in a fit of rage did something evil. It makes him a flawed and angry person, but not completely evil (yet). We don't even know as viewers if the women and children were not involved in the death of Anakin's mother.

True, but the details of that are still rather vague. Anakin implies it was mostly the men, but also breaks down over his murders of the women and children in the camp.

A person can be a douche and a good guy at the same time.

I guess it would depend on what you mean by using such a term. Aside from the medical definition, I don't even know what that expression means.

Anakin in AotC was a teenager. 80% of teenage males are douchebags. That's all the explanation you need to understand his behavior at that age.

Again, I'm totally in the dark here.

Also, Anakin's temper was already evident in TPM. His short fuse was evident by his reaction when Padme called him a slave. He then got into that fist-fight with Greedo in the deleted scenes. He was jawing with Sebulba before the pod race. When the Jedi Council debated his candidacy for the Order, Anakin was practically seething in the background. Finally, when Qui-Gon tells Anakin to stay put in the cockpit... Anakin disobeys, and distorts the technical meaning of Qui-Gon's word to justify his disobedience. Funny enough, that's the exact same thing he does with Obi-wan's orders in AotC.

To quote Jar Jar, "Yousa point is-a wellsayd."

I swear, some people are just so blind with hate they've lost any sense of objectivity.

And what's worse is that far too often, those accused of hatred are the same people trying their best to be objective...double standard, much?

[WannabeSpiderMan]

Originally Posted by NYorker

Bingo. That pretty much sums up everything about this release.

And by the way, anyone who paid more than $0.10 for a poster of this is being robbed.

This unfortunate artwork was not created for the blu-ray release. It was made years ago. Apparently, it was chosen by Katie Lucas to be re-purposed for the blu-ray box design, so it wasn't some calculated means to usurp your childhood heroes in preference to the prequel characters to subconsciously milk money from the younger generation. The artist just didn't do a good job when they made their layout choices. You guys are really reaching sometimes with your Lucas Hates Us conspiracy theories.

With that said, and as an artist myself, I REALLY hate the artwork for the blu-ray set. There have been thousands of better pieces of artwork created over the years that could have been chosen. But in the end, I just care about the movies themselves so I got over it.

[georgec]

Originally Posted by WannabeSpiderMan

But in the end, I just care about the movies themselves so I got over it.

Well, it's a good thing the movies haven't been changed!

[marlon dingle]

Someone has mentioned the lid of the C3PO & R2D2 escape pod. Sometimes it's grey and other times it is blue. I was just thinking, what if the surface was actually a mirror so at some points when it reflects a cloud it's obviously Grey and sometimes its blue when it reflects a clear blue sky.

I know that this cant be true cause it's been blue in different versions but it's a good excuse to get over the continuity.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by WannabeSpiderMan

So you are not only disregarding the other examples I gave, but also all of the interaction between them in ROTS. You are giving the impression that you would rather the films spend a much larger chunk of time on Palpatine and Anakin having their conversations for you to invest. But tell me this, were you satisfied with the very limited screen time together for Luke and Obi-Wan, or Luke and Yoda in the OT? Luke and Obi-Wan were barely together before Obi-Wan's sacrifice, and yet Luke had a bond with him. Luke barely had time with Yoda in ESB before it skips ahead a year in time and Luke's training is complete in ROTJ. Yet that was good enough for you at the time, right?

I'm not pretending these films are screenwriting masterpieces. But they are made for children, and children want to enjoy the spectacle of heroes on adventure, and not watch 2-4 hours of a character being corrupted by a villain on an intimate level. The adult mind wants that, but it's just not the spirit of Star Wars.

Maybe I'm not being clear - I'm disregarding the events in Sith because they don't explain his fall, they're after the fact. By the time we meet the adult Anakin in Clones he's already all but fallen. That's my main problem with the way his character played out.

We spent the bulk of Clones and all of Sith watching a not very likable character fall a very small way.

As for the OT, eh, it worked on a Karate Kid sort of level. Did I really believe a few weeks with Mr. Miyagi made Daniel-san a match for the Cobra Kai? No, not really. But I was willing to go along with it because it was a good story.

This wasn't.

[WannabeSpiderMan]

Originally Posted by octagon

By 'a large chunk' do you mean all of it? I understand what you're saying but that missing chunk is basically Anakin's entire second act. It's the bridge between a decent, normal kid and a fairly savage adult and we didn't see any of it. Anakin being capable of that kind of brutality was just presented as a fait accompli - it was just the kind of guy he was. How he became that kind of guy? Eh, details...details...he just did.

That didn't work for me.

It turned what could have been a very interesting character into a bad Seinfeld parody - How did Anakin Skywalker become Darth Vader? Well, he was a pretty normal kid and yada yada yada he slaughtered an entire village and Palpatine pretty much took it from there.

I can't convince you otherwise if a story just didn't work for you. And that's okay. I personally felt that what happened to his mother is a reasonable catalyst for a fit of blind rage.

His mother, his only family, the woman he was reluctantly separated from as a child, was kidnapped by savage sand-people with implications of torture and captivity over the course of several weeks (I think it was that long). To see his mother die in such a terrible way, a sweet kind woman, who he missed and loved and hadn't seen in 10 years, combined with the enhanced emotions of a teenager and the guilt/rage that resulted, plus having the power and the means to exact revenge at that exact moment of heightened emotion, resulted in his murderous outburst.

He WAS conflicted/remorseful afterwards as well.

(I hope that wasn't too clumsily written, I'm sleepy.)

[WannabeSpiderMan]

Originally Posted by octagon

Maybe I'm not being clear - I'm disregarding the events in Sith because they don't explain his fall, they're after the fact. By the time we meet the adult Anakin in Clones he's already all but fallen. That's my main problem with the way his character played out.

We spent the bulk of Clones and all of Sith watching a not very likable character fall a very small way.

As for the OT, eh, it worked on a Karate Kid sort of level. Did I really believe a few weeks with Mr. Miyagi made Daniel-san a match for the Cobra Kai? No, not really. But I was willing to go along with it because it was a good story.

This wasn't.

Ha, that made me laugh! Nice comparison.

Yeah, Anakin's portrayal in the prequels did seem to divide people in regards to his likability. I think that the Clone Wars series has done an excellent job in fleshing out his character due to just having the time to do so, and it seems that based on what I've read online, people have found that version of him much more appealing overall as well.

I've always thought that in an ideal version of the prequels, the TPM would never have existed (for obvious reasons), AOTC could have been the "Episode 1" with a bright-eyed padawan Anakin, "Episode 2" could have shown the midst of the Clone Wars and how war would change and harden a young Anakin, and then "Episode 3" could have been ROTS.

So I suppose that by admitting that, it concedes partially to what you are saying, but I am still content with what we have overall, because well, my inner-child still likes the movies.