Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[dcowboy7]

Originally Posted by kenkraly2004

Yea maybe in the next issue of star wars insider #126 the july / auguest issue then we will get the blu-ray box set preview.

In this may/jun issue they have a preview of whats in jul/aug & there is no mention of the bluray preview.

So i would guess it will be in the sep/oct issue since that will be out late august & that would fit timing wise with the actual september bluray release.

[Beast]

It's not like we have much else to discuss. And nah, it'll be in the next issue.

[dcowboy7]

Why do you say that ?

It seems odd they would do that yoda demo cover mentioning it yet when they have a preview of whats in the next issue not even mention it at all.

[Beast]

It certainly won't be the following issue, the movies will be out in September.

[dcowboy7]

Originally Posted by Beast

It certainly won't be the following issue, the movies will be out in September.

Yes but like i said that issue is out in august.

[SAP12690]

I want COVER ART!!!

[femogan]

Originally Posted by sap12690

i want cover art!!!

[2]

[kenkraly2004]

Originally Posted by dcowboy7

Yes but like i said that issue is out in august.

Their will be info in issue #126 of star wars insider on the blu-ray box set the july / august issue. The issue will be out at the end of next month.

[BillieCassin]

Originally Posted by KubrickFan

If it's been going on since 1997, it's because George not only re-releases his movies with updated special effects, but tries to bury the original versions.
I think that people always want all of the released cuts available. Steven Spielberg hates the first two cuts of Close Encounters of the Third Kind until he got it right, and still all three of them are included on the DVD. Ridley Scott hates the original version of Blade Runner, and still that version (plus three other alternative cuts) are included with the Final Cut. I don't care that George feels the need to keep altering his movies, but would it kill him to give the people a choice? All we're asking is the original cut of each movie he released, that's not asking for much, is it?

Exactly.

I haven't heard anyone use any sexual abuse comparisons here, or really anywhere else - it's the hater-haters who use that example.

You hit both the nails squarely on the head.

1) It's not that we care what he does with them, but the destruction (and that's what it was, destruction - the original negatives were cut to all heck) and refusal to restore the originals for release that is the issue.

2) Lucas didn't simply redo the effects. He changed key moments of the films. By doing this and furthering #1, means the originals are pretty much lost unless he does something now. (And no, hater-haters, he cannot go collect up every VHS copy, etc. - it's the point of historical preservation.)

Lucas did the same thing with THX 1138. I have never seen that film - and now I can't, unless I go buy a VCR and track down a VHS. It just came out on Blu, and he *ONLY* included his new version. Why does that suck?

THX 1138 was (again, I've never seen it, just going by historical record) a film made by a very young filmmaker on very little budget, and was an amazing feat keeping those two things in mind. It's a historical document because it is evocative of a time and place, and quite an achievement for someone of his age and resources.

Now, we can never experience and appreciate that unless we go back and watch it on VHS. The only version he has chosen to make available is one that he went back and painted cartoons over as a man with relatively unlimited resources in his 50's. It's really not much of an achievement at that point, and he is pissing on his own cultural legacy.

Same with Star Wars. Personally, some of the changes are good. In fact, a lot of them are. ESB especially - because instead of messing with the story, tone, etc. like he did with SW and ROTJ, he enhanced what was already there. Bespin is awesome! It makes a lot more sense now that a cloud city would be full of windows and not bare white walls. And any update of the space effects has been great. But things like the silly Jabba scene inserted into SW, and the absurd music video dance party in ROTJ (which only served to make Jabba's less threatening to children instead of the dark, scary place it should have been and originally was) just kills it for me.

It will be interesting to see the new cuts. We can't say until we've seen them, but I am all for the additional Han/Leia scene in ESB - them just suddenly being a couple is a bit abrupt as it stands, another scene would really add to that. However, not sold on the scene before Jabba's with Luke though - we'll have to see (the kind of mysterious opening of ROTJ works as it stands, will be interested to see what this changes in tone).

All that said, I don't think anyone outside of the fringe of the fringe would care if he'd just keep both versions available, like virtually every other filmmaker (per your list). At least progress has been made - he's stopped using the absurd "workprint" term and now refers to them as the "classic" editions. Hopefully he comes around and takes the "classic" term to heart, and realizes they shouldn't be sent to the trash compactor.

[Brightstar]

Originally Posted by BillieCassin

Exactly.

I haven't heard anyone use any sexual abuse comparisons here, or really anywhere else - it's the hater-haters who use that example.

You hit both the nails squarely on the head.

1) It's not that we care what he does with them, but the destruction (and that's what it was, destruction - the original negatives were cut to all heck) and refusal to restore the originals for release that is the issue.

2) Lucas didn't simply redo the effects. He changed key moments of the films. By doing this and furthering #1, means the originals are pretty much lost unless he does something now. (And no, hater-haters, he cannot go collect up every VHS copy, etc. - it's the point of historical preservation.)

Lucas did the same thing with THX 1138. I have never seen that film - and now I can't, unless I go buy a VCR and track down a VHS. It just came out on Blu, and he *ONLY* included his new version. Why does that suck?

THX 1138 was (again, I've never seen it, just going by historical record) a film made by a very young filmmaker on very little budget, and was an amazing feat keeping those two things in mind. It's a historical document because it is evocative of a time and place, and quite an achievement for someone of his age and resources.

Now, we can never experience and appreciate that unless we go back and watch it on VHS. The only version he has chosen to make available is one that he went back and painted cartoons over as a man with relatively unlimited resources in his 50's. It's really not much of an achievement at that point, and he is pissing on his own cultural legacy.

Same with Star Wars. Personally, some of the changes are good. In fact, a lot of them are. ESB especially - because instead of messing with the story, tone, etc. like he did with SW and ROTJ, he enhanced what was already there. Bespin is awesome! It makes a lot more sense now that a cloud city would be full of windows and not bare white walls. And any update of the space effects has been great. But things like the silly Jabba scene inserted into SW, and the absurd music video dance party in ROTJ (which only served to make Jabba's less threatening to children instead of the dark, scary place it should have been and originally was) just kills it for me.

It will be interesting to see the new cuts. We can't say until we've seen them, but I am all for the additional Han/Leia scene in ESB - them just suddenly being a couple is a bit abrupt as it stands, another scene would really add to that. However, not sold on the scene before Jabba's with Luke though - we'll have to see (the kind of mysterious opening of ROTJ works as it stands, will be interested to see what this changes in tone).

All that said, I don't think anyone outside of the fringe of the fringe would care if he'd just keep both versions available, like virtually every other filmmaker (per your list). At least progress has been made - he's stopped using the absurd "workprint" term and now refers to them as the "classic" editions. Hopefully he comes around and takes the "classic" term to heart, and realizes they shouldn't be sent to the trash compactor.

Is that really true ?? if so how did he make the 1997 special edditions with no negatives?

[IndyMLVC]

Originally Posted by joliefan

Is that really true ?? if so how did he make the 1997 special editions with no negatives?

He cut the negatives for the SE's. That's what the OP was saying.

[nametag]

Originally Posted by BillieCassin

Exactly...
...

+1 Agreed on all counts.

For me it's indefensible... even if someone personally prefers the newer cuts, the fact remains that, in not releasing the originals, a huge piece of cultural history is lost. There's no way around that.

[kenkraly2004]

The SE's of the OT for me I can't find many faults other than greedo shooting 1st and the 1st cgi jabba in 1997 the updated one from 2004 looks a little better but still needs improved one and other than that the special editions of the original trilogy are fine minus those 2 faults as I mention. And if all the versions of the OT both OT and SE's where offered on the blu-ray as a branching option on the blu-ray box set that whould be great.

[Beast]

Originally Posted by nametag

+1 Agreed on all counts.

For me it's indefensible... even if someone personally prefers the newer cuts, the fact remains that, in not releasing the originals, a huge piece of cultural history is lost. There's no way around that.

Other than the fact that there are copies available. Betamax, VHS, Laserdisc, and DVD. And others.

So nothing is "lost". Much like if a book goes out of print, but is still available on the secondary market.

Just because it's not available for your Ebook or Kindle, doesn't mean it stops existing from history.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Beast

Other than the fact that there are copies available. Betamax, VHS, Laserdisc, and DVD. And others.

So nothing is "lost". Much like if a book goes out of print, but is still available on the secondary market.

Just because it's not available for your Ebook or Kindle, doesn't mean it stops existing from history.

But the older formats have a shelf-life don't they? VHS or Beta degrades eventually as will LD and DVD. As we all know Blu-ray is impervious to all conventional weapons apart from baked-beans and five year olds. And even books turn to dust....

[Brightstar]

Originally Posted by chip75

But the older formats have a shelf-life don't they? VHS or Beta degrades eventually as will LD and DVD. As we all know Blu-ray is impervious to all conventional weapons apart from baked-beans and five year olds. And even books turn to dust....

Thats why you need the 77-83 negatives so they can be scanned and put on blu ray

[s2mikey]

Originally Posted by Imrahil2001

So the fact that the transfer is non-anamorphic and 20 years old is "okay"? How "okay" would you be if that's what we were getting on blu? It's a nonsensical argument, Beast, and you're a fool for continually promoting it.

Yeah, the non-anamorphic part is what bugs me. Who wants that?

[Carcaridon]

The only issues I have with ESB is the missing Luke line "...taste very good" and the whole Vader/shuttle trip. I liked the extremely angry Vader saying "Bring my shuttle." Other than that, the enhanced FX are fine with me. I can even deal with ANH and the Jabba scene, which is still redundant. But just put Han back to shooting first and we're good. ROTJ, I normally only watch the stuff involving Luke. The rest of the movie is on par with the PT in my opinion.

[Dotpattern]

Originally Posted by Carcaridon

The only issues I have with ESB is the missing Luke line "...taste very good" and the whole Vader/shuttle trip. I liked the extremely angry Vader saying "Bring my shuttle." Other than that, the enhanced FX are fine with me. I can even deal with ANH and the Jabba scene, which is still redundant. But just put Han back to shooting first and we're good. ROTJ, I normally only watch the stuff involving Luke. The rest of the movie is on par with the PT in my opinion.

He never sounded "extremely angry" to me. Or even angry.

[STARSCREAM]

Originally Posted by Carcaridon

The only issues I have with ESB is the missing Luke line "...taste very good" and the whole Vader/shuttle trip. I liked the extremely angry Vader saying "Bring my shuttle." Other than that, the enhanced FX are fine with me. I can even deal with ANH and the Jabba scene, which is still redundant. But just put Han back to shooting first and we're good. ROTJ, I normally only watch the stuff involving Luke. The rest of the movie is on par with the PT in my opinion.

I also wish he would put back that line about R2 back in. I loved the "you're lucky you don't taste very good" line after R2 got spit out by the Dagobah swamp monster.