Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by whaleman

I hated how the PT had to tie in all the secondary characters from the OT.
Chewbacca was the general of the Wookies who met with the top Jedis in the clone wars. I'm surprised they didn't show Han solo as a kid meeting Chewbacca in RotS (thank God).
Boba Fett had to be a clone and his father was the subject of all the clones. What a coincidence.
C3P0 and R2D2 just happened to be built by Darth Vader. Again what a coincidence.
I think GL just didn't have time to delve into the past of Lando Calrissian and Han Solo. Other than that every single character of significance in the OT plays a significant role in the PT.

Chewbacca was not needed in RoTS much like Worf (or his grandfather) in The Undiscovered Country.

[Sith]

Originally Posted by greg_achen

I present to you the crappy disc art! Glad to see Lucasfilm is going all out with this release.



As long as the picture and sound quality of the films themselves are top notch, I will be a happy camper. However, what has been released thus far hasn't been encouraging.

I like those except for maybe the blue blu ray line in the bottom. But all I care about is the transfer.

Sounds like the concert was awesome. Glad you had a good time.

[Bluyoda]

Originally Posted by Dotpattern

Maybe because Yoda recognizes this same impulsive behavior that helped lead Anakin to the dark side - the impulsive behavior to do whatever it took to help save their loved ones. Seems to me that Yoda was just trying to stop Luke so as not to risk losing him to the dark side the same way they lost Anakin. It seems as though a lot of decisions Yoda and Obi-Wan make in regards to lying to Luke and being over-protective are all examples of them not wanting to have the same thing happen twice.

[Show spoiler]The actual line is, "Obi-Wan was wise to hide her from me." So no problem there. But as far as Leia "remembering" her mother, it can be assumed (and yes, argued) that she is perceiving visions of her mother through the Force as memories. As Yoda tells Luke, "Through the Force, things you will see. Other places, the past, the future, old friends long gone." If Luke can have visions of his friends' future, isn't it passable that Leia could have visions of her own mother from the past and misinterpret those as memories? Luke has Yoda to help him understand his visions. Leia doesn't.



Aren't "changes in the Force" completely different than detecting and specifically identifying a Sith Lord? In ANH, Vader is confused at first when he says, "I sense something. A presence I've not felt since..." He didn't sense Obi-Wan specifically. He put two and two together. "A presence I've not felt since...(I'm finishing his sentence) I was in the presence of my old master!" Isn't it reasonable then that the Jedi can feel a change in the Force but not know what that means? Vader could only figure it out because he had once been in the "presence" of Obi-Wan.



What else is he going to do? "Hey fellow Jedi's! I know I just murdered a bunch of fellow Jedi masters, kids and cut off Master Windu's hand allowing Palpatine to kill him...but I'm over all that now. I've come to my senses! Y'know, that Darth Sidious is a liar! He promised me a lot of things but he didn't come through on any of them! So NOW I want to come back and be with you guys. So...how do you like my new suit?"



Couldn't it be reasonably assumed that the entire reason Obi-Wan meets with Chewbacca in the cantina in ANH is due to their mutual friendship with Yoda? Or that during the 20 years between ROTS and ANH Obi-Wan and Chewbacca kept in communication, knowing that one day they would need to get Luke off the planet? In ROTJ, Chewbacca seems to accept that Luke is a Jedi and tries to tell Han. Is Chewbacca just gullible? Or does he believe it because he knows the history? Han seems pretty quick to reject any belief in the Jedi or the Force. Maybe Chewbacca has been trying to tell Han the story for years and maybe Han just laughs at him and tells him to shut up.



This assumes that Obi-Wan and Yoda went into their huts and never came out. It can safely be assumed they weren't living in complete isolation and that they found ways to get information. In ANH, Leia's message to Obi-Wan is recorded specifically for him, "Years ago you served my father in the Clone Wars. Now he begs you to help him in his struggle against the Empire." She seem to know exactly where Obi-Wan is hiding in order to get the message to him. Therefore, it's reasonable to assume communication has been getting to Obi-Wan (and even Yoda) for all that time.

Vader never sees or comes into contact with R2 in the OT. But who says he doesn't recognize C3PO? But, again, what's he supposed to do? Should he run over to 3PO and say, "Hey! I built you! Years ago! Don't you remember? What's the matter? Don't you recognize me?? Oh, I guess you wouldn't - I've got a mask on. Well here...let me take it off! Recognize me now?? No? Oh...you had your memory wiped? Well...that was a waste of time wasn't it. Put Captain Solo in the Carbon Freeze!!"

As for you other questions...I have no idea.

Yeah, good job, mate. We have answered these "plot holes" so many times that I don't bother anymore.

It's really quite genius of George to make Anakin turn to the dark side because he wants to save his loved one, as it dramatically strengthens Luke's journey, and draws beautiful parallels.

I actually think the deleted scene of Luke's construction of the lightsaber in ROTJ would be great to be in the movie, for it would make it seem even more that Luke is about to suffer the same fate as his father.

Gosh, I cannot wait to see the whole Saga on Blu-ray this September.

I haven't watched them in 1-2 years, as I have been patiently waiting for the inevitable release on Blu-ray!

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by Sith

I like those except for maybe the blue blu ray line in the bottom. But all I care about is the transfer.

Sounds like the concert was awesome. Glad you had a good time.

/agree that disc art is way sweet. Remember it's not the discs we pay for it's what they put out. Knowing George this is gonna be one awesome release!

[Bluyoda]

Originally Posted by whaleman

C3P0 and R2D2 just happened to be built by Darth Vader. Again what a coincidence.

R2D2 wasn't built by Anakin/Vader.

Perhaps you guys should actually sit down and watch these movies instead of tearing them apart at every opportunity.
Well, at least the BD release will animate some of you to watch them again.

Originally Posted by Cowboy

Maybe this, maybe that...at the end of the day it all boils down to sixteen years between trilogies, ideas changed, he forgot things and he didnt tie alot of stuff together. Just plain and simple....Mr. Plinkett points them all out. In the current form these can not be blended together and watched 1-6 in order without some major bumps. Hopefully with the time he has had on the BD's that will all change.....

That Plinkett dude is a complete and utter joke. Has been discussed before.

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by Cowboy

/agree that disc art is way sweet. Remember it's not the discs we pay for it's what they put out. Knowing George this is gonna be one awesome release!

I think GL is holding back on what the disc's look like. Look at what he did with the DVD's. Why wouldn't he do it with the BD's !

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by crazyBLUE

I think GL is holding back on what the disc's look like. Look at what he did with the DVD's. Why wouldn't he do it with the BD's !

I agree they should be special.

Funny how cast members from the original films have had nothing nice to say about the PT though. A co worker who collects autographs was at a comic con some years ago and Anthony Daniels was there. So my friend gives him a picture to sign (one with a half built 3po from TPM as it was all he had) Daniels looks at him and says do you like these newer films? And my friend says well not really...and Daniels says I know what you mean.

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by Cowboy

I agree they should be special.

Funny how cast members from the original films have had nothing nice to say about the PT though. A co worker who collects autographs was at a comic con some years ago and Anthony Daniels was there. So my friend gives him a picture to sign (one with a half built 3po from TPM as it was all he had) Daniels looks at him and says do you like these newer films? And my friend says well not really...and Daniels says I know what you mean.

The thing to look at is its an opinion from someone & everyone has a different opinion. Look at what this thread has done !

[greg_achen]

Originally Posted by crazyBLUE

I think GL is holding back on what the disc's look like. Look at what he did with the DVD's. Why wouldn't he do it with the BD's !

If you are trying to make others optimistic about this release, mentioning the OT dvds might not be the best strategy. Let's hope the Blu Rays are nothing like that rush job.

[philzilla]

Originally Posted by greg_achen

If you are trying to make others optimistic about this release, mentioning the OT dvds might not be the best strategy. Let's hope the Blu Rays are nothing like that rush job.

yeah, they are, generally speaking, crap.

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by greg_achen

If you are trying to make others optimistic about this release, mentioning the OT dvds might not be the best strategy. Let's hope the Blu Rays are nothing like that rush job.

I just looked at them & they looked good to me. Didn't look like a rush job to me !

[Dotpattern]

Originally Posted by crazyBLUE

I just looked at them & they looked good to me. Didn't look like a rush job to me !

You bastard!! Can I say bastard??

[Jay444]

Originally Posted by Dotpattern

The actual line is, "Obi-Wan was wise to hide her from me." So no problem there. But as far as Leia "remembering" her mother, it can be assumed (and yes, argued) that she is perceiving visions of her mother through the Force as memories. As Yoda tells Luke, "Through the Force, things you will see. Other places, the past, the future, old friends long gone." If Luke can have visions of his friends' future, isn't it passable that Leia could have visions of her own mother from the past and misinterpret those as memories? Luke has Yoda to help him understand his visions. Leia doesn't.

Good thoughts, but I always took it as Leia remembering her adopted mother (Mrs. Organa) and not Pandabear. Its not said in any of the films that her adopted mother was still alive (I don't buy into any of that EU stuff). I don't think she was aware she was adopted until after Luke tells her that Vader is his father (thus her wigging out a bit and wanting to not talk about it with Han, it was a LOT to digest). So, I think when Luke asks her about her mother she thinks of adopted mother whom would be sad as being married to a senator during a time of galatic oppression. Just my take though.

[Dotpattern]

Originally Posted by Jay444

Good thoughts, but I always took it as Leia remembering her adopted mother (Mrs. Organa) and not Pandabear. Its not said in any of the films that her adopted mother was still alive (I don't buy into any of that EU stuff). I don't think she was aware she was adopted until after Luke tells her that Vader is his father (thus her wigging out a bit and wanting to not talk about it with Han, it was a LOT to digest). So, I think when Luke asks her about her mother she thinks of adopted mother whom would be sad as being married to a senator during a time of galatic oppression. Just my take though.

That's possible too. The reason I move towards visions of Padme and not her adopted mother are because Luke makes a specific distinction, "Your real mother." To me, that implies that she knows she's adopted, has memories of her adopted mother, and that Luke is not asking for those.

[motorheadache95]

Originally Posted by Bluyoda

R2D2 wasn't built by Anakin/Vader.

That Plinkett dude is a complete and utter joke. Has been discussed before.

Well yeah, in the sense that he's a fake, ridiculous character. The real man behind the character is actually quite funny and intelligent (admittedly though, his sense of humor with the character is EXTREMELY dark).

Seriously though, those videos are quite intelligent and offer well-thought out critical analysis of the films. I really think it's a mistake just to dismiss him because you don't agree with his assessment of the films. I myself don't agree with EVERYTHING he says (though most of it), but they are hilarious.

On a side note, even though I actually kind of like Indy IV, I can't wait for him to review it.

[Jay444]

Originally Posted by Dotpattern

That's possible too. The reason I move towards visions of Padme and not her adopted mother are because Luke makes a specific distinction, "Your real mother." To me, that implies that she knows she's adopted, has memories of her adopted mother, and that Luke is not asking for those.

I couldn't remember if he made that distinction? If so, then I am going to say you are right. Well, looks like I get to go watch Return of the Jedi again. Oh, the torture...lol...anything but that!

My sarcasim sometimes goes unnoticed. I fn love Return of the Jedi.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by motorheadache95

Well yeah, in the sense that he's a fake, ridiculous character. The real man behind the character is actually quite funny and intelligent (admittedly though, his sense of humor with the character is EXTREMELY dark).

Seriously though, those videos are quite intelligent and offer well-thought out critical analysis of the films. I really think it's a mistake just to dismiss him because you don't agree with his assessment of the films. I myself don't agree with EVERYTHING he says (though most of it), but they are hilarious.

On a side note, even though I actually kind of like Indy IV, I can't wait for him to review it.

You mean stuff like this?

Obi Wan in A New Hope - "For over a thousand generations the jedi were the guardians of peace and justice in the old Republic."

Bail organa in RoTS -"We can not let a thousand years of democracy disappear"

The Emperor in RoTS - "I will not let a Republic that has stood for a thousand years be split in two."

Now I am not sure but I am willing to bet that 1000 generations and 1000 years are not even in the same ball park!

I hope George will go back and actually watch the OT now and fix either the OT or the PT.

[Sith]

Originally Posted by Cowboy

You mean stuff like this?

Obi Wan in A New Hope - "For over a thousand generations the jedi were the guardians of peace and justice in the old Republic."

Bail organa in RoTS -"We can not let a thousand years of democracy disappear"

The Emperor in RoTS - "I will not let a Republic that has stood for a thousand years be split in two."

Now I am not sure but I am willing to bet that 1000 generations and 1000 years are not even in the same ball park!

I hope George will go back and actually watch the OT now and fix either the OT or the PT.

The Republic stood for 1000 years after Lord Bane tricked the Sith Army of Darkness into using the dark side thoughtbomb against itself and reinstalled "The Rule of Two".

Everyone knows that right.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by Sith

The Republic stood for 1000 years after Lord Bane tricked the Sith Army of Darkness into using the dark side thoughtbomb against itself and reinstalled "The Rule of Two".

Everyone knows that right.

Right.....

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Dotpattern

Couldn't it be reasonably assumed that the entire reason Obi-Wan meets with Chewbacca in the cantina in ANH is due to their mutual friendship with Yoda? Or that during the 20 years between ROTS and ANH Obi-Wan and Chewbacca kept in communication, knowing that one day they would need to get Luke off the planet?

Sure, that can be assumed but reasonably? I dunno. Even if the crawl had read 'in small, small galaxy far, far away' Chewbacca being a speeder ride away when Obi-Wan needed a quick getaway is a bit convenient, no?

Chewie knowing Obi-Wan for twenty+ years also puts an odd light on Han's 'Where did you did up that old fossil' line. Did Chewbacca just grunt words to the effect of 'Hey, boss, we have a fare. Just some guy. Never saw him before, didn't fight any wars with him or anything'?

Just to be clear, stuff like this isn't exactly a deal-breaker. There are bound to be inconsistencies.

What I don't get it is why people sometime seem so hell-bent on rationalizing every single one of those inconsistencies. Instead of engaging in all sorts of mental gymnastics to try to perfectly mesh the two trilogies I don't know why people don't just say 'eh, yeah, that one doesn't really track...whattayagonnado'.

For instance, does anybody really believe Anakin would have no idea his wife was carrying twins?

Of course not.

Does it really matter?

Eh, whattayagonnado.