Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by Neon Rabbit

I really don't understand the massive backlash for TLJ either.

They killed Luke Skywalker.

[starkrogersthor91]

Originally Posted by Bobbyjoe766

Nope. I don’t have any problem with DISNEY - or anybody else - taking the characters in new and unexpected directions. I never followed the EU novels and comics, never was interested in that stuff, just the movies.

The sequels lack originality.

The original film lacked 'originality' in the first place. It was literally a hodge-podge of inspirations and influences that Lucas ripped directly from other media.
The story and characters of The Hidden Fortress. The themes of The Searchers. The visual aesthetic of Flash Gordon, Lawrence of Arabia and Metropolis. Action sequences ripped directly from The Dam Busters and Adventures of Robin Hood.

Yes, the original was a seminal film in and of itself, and made many of its own technological innovations. But, it was FAR from "original."
People complaining sequels lack originality are either ignorant, don't want to face the fact or just want to nit-pick for the sake of it.

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by davlee1991

The story and characters of The Hidden Fortress.

I believe only R2-D2 and C-3PO are taken from The Hidden Fortress, Luke is most likely taken from the Samurai Trilogy. The story of how Miyamoto Musashi evolves over the course of three movies from an immature nothing into a strong and determined man, is the same as with Luke, over the course of his three films.

But yes, the majority of Star Wars was taken from other films.

[starkrogersthor91]

Originally Posted by Scarface32

I believe only R2-D2 and C-3PO are taken from The Hidden Fortress, Luke is most likely taken from the Samurai Trilogy. The story of how Miyamoto Musashi evolves over the course of three movies from an immature nothing into a strong and determined man, is the same as with Luke, over the course of his three films.

But yes, the majority of Star Wars was taken from other films.

Hidden Fortress also had a ‘general’ seeking aid in order to get a ‘Princess’ across enemy lines.

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by davlee1991

Hidden Fortress also had a ‘general’ seeking aid in order to get a ‘Princess’ across enemy lines.

Well I agree that a lot of the plot was taken from The Hidden Fortress (1958), but as far as characters* go, I believe the androids are the only direct correlation to characters in said film. As for Leia, I believe she's inspired by Maid Marian from The Adventures of Robin Hood (1938).


*Motivations, mannerisms, hair styles, clothing styles, etc. (things involving a person)

[Bobbyjoe766]

Originally Posted by davlee1991

The original film lacked 'originality' in the first place. It was literally a hodge-podge of inspirations and influences that Lucas ripped directly from other media.
The story and characters of The Hidden Fortress. The themes of The Searchers. The visual aesthetic of Flash Gordon, Lawrence of Arabia and Metropolis. Action sequences ripped directly from The Dam Busters and Adventures of Robin Hood.

Yes, the original was a seminal film in and of itself, and made many of its own technological innovations. But, it was FAR from "original."
People complaining sequels lack originality are either ignorant, don't want to face the fact or just want to nit-pick for the sake of it.

I’m talking about originality within its own (STAR WARS) universe, is what’s lacking. How many planet-destroying super weapons have there been? Universe shrinkage and characters related to each other when it conveniently serves the plot, etc.

[Hardback247]

Originally Posted by Bobbyjoe766

Nope. I don’t have any problem with DISNEY - or anybody else - taking the characters in new and unexpected directions. I never followed the EU novels and comics, never was interested in that stuff, just the movies.

The sequels lack originality.

Originality ≠ quality.

[CreasyBear]

Originality is far less important than a compelling storyline and themes that have context and adhere to internal logic.

The Disney films, aside from Rogue One, do none of that.

[Hardback247]

Originally Posted by CreasyBear

Originality is far less important than a compelling storyline and themes that have context and adhere to internal logic.

The Disney films, aside from Rogue One, do none of that.

They DO adhere to internal logic.

[CreasyBear]

Originally Posted by Hardback247

They DO adhere to internal logic.

Go on.

[Hardback247]

Originally Posted by CreasyBear

Go on.

They make absolutely PERFECT sense if you just paid attention to the dialogue, subtleties and themes, and not judge everything from a surface level.

[SymbioticFunction]

The Last Jedi didn't seem very subtle. Far from it in fact. btw I don't personally detest it but I was very seriously underwhelmed with it. It also had that really horrible hoax phone call moment.

[Hardback247]

Originally Posted by SymbioticFunction

It also had that really horrible hoax phone call moment.

I've said this before, but that scene was the movie's way of communicating to the audience that it's okay to laugh and just have a little fun watching it.

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by Hardback247

I've said this before, but that scene was the movie's way of communicating to the audience that it's okay to laugh and just have a little fun watching it.

Is it bad that I don’t even remember a "phone call" moment?

Like an actual phone? Or are you talking about when Rey and Kylo were talking telepathically?

[Hardback247]

Originally Posted by Scarface32

Is it bad that I don’t even remember a "phone call" moment?

Like an actual phone? Or are you talking about when Rey and Kylo were talking telepathically?

It's near the beginning, when Poe was stalling Hux for time on his communicator.

[Indiana Jonezzz...]

Originally Posted by Hardback247

They make absolutely PERFECT sense if you just paid attention to the dialogue, subtleties and themes, and not judge everything from a surface level.

Well, you said that Luke briefly thought about murdering Ben in the hut scene, and showed no emotion at all. Which would imply that you paid no attention to the film.

Originally Posted by Hardback247

I've said this before, but that scene was the movie's way of communicating to the audience that it's okay to laugh and just have a little fun watching it.

That’s true, but any comic relief could’ve also communicated that. It didn’t require a terrible, bad reception phonecall joke, to try and stall things, while Poe makes fun of Hux’s name (General Hugs!!!?). It completely undermines the threat of The First Order, and spoils the tension and tone of the opening of the film. Just my opinion though.

[Hardback247]

Originally Posted by Indiana Jonezzz...

Well, you said that Luke briefly thought about murdering Ben in the hut scene, and showed no emotion at all. Which would imply that you paid no attention to the film.

I take that back.

[Indiana Jonezzz...]

Originally Posted by Hardback247

I take that back.

That’s quite a big change in how you view the scene now. Does that make you feel differently about Luke in TLJ, because he reacted with fear and anger and thought about murdering his nephew? Do you feel that’s consistent with Luke in the OT, who threw down his lightsaber after fighting Vader in ROTJ, because he realised that anger and hatred would lead to the darkside?

[Hardback247]

Originally Posted by Indiana Jonezzz...

That’s quite a big change in how you view the scene now. Does that make you feel differently about Luke in TLJ, because he reacted with fear and anger and thought about murdering his nephew? Do you feel that’s consistent with Luke in the OT, you threw down his lightsaber after fighting Vader in ROTJ, because he realised that anger and hatred would lead to the darkside?

The thing is, those were different circumstances.

[Alan_Grant]