Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[NYorker]

Originally Posted by aiman04

Lucas was smart to start in the middle of the saga then. At least people are genuinely surprised with the Vader revelation. Now (1999) that everyone knows that already, he can start back at the beginning. I think that's the best way.

It wasn't a question of being smart:

If the movie failed - at least it could stand on its own. There was no way he was going to start from a "episode 1."


MacEachaidh,

Your last two posts were among the best I read on this thread. Well said.

[Riddler The Slag]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

The spelling is actually "Plagueis", as in "[the] plague is". The "Sith" novel reveals a little more about him, when Palpatine admits to Anakin that Plagueis was his own master.

As amazing as the scenes with Palpatine were in ROTS, the novelization made all of his scenes a trillion times better.

That being said, only McDiarmid could have pulled that off. The scene where he tells Anakin that he knows he wants to kill him was some of the best acting of the entire Prequel trilogy.

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by Riddler The Slag

As amazing as the scenes with Palpatine were in ROTS, the novelization made all of his scenes a trillion times better.

I really wanted to see that scene between Qui-Gon and Yoda restored for the Blu-Ray release, because its such a powerful emotional exchange. Yoda's been broken over the deaths of so many Jedi, and blames himself for keeping the Order so strict and one-sided. He's then comforted by Qui-Gon, who offers to train him in the ways of retaining his identity after death. Yoda then humbles himself, and becomes an apprentice again.

[The Apocalypse]

I disagree with the ROTS novelization's assertion that during the Battle between Yoda and Sidious, Sidious grew stronger while Yoda grew weaker. I'd argue to the contrary in fact, which is demonstrated in that RotS Blu-ray alternate ending of the Duel in the Senate,

[Show spoiler]where it is Palpatine who flees by flying a Senate seat out of the building and Yoda remains there.

I'd prefer that version to what we got in the end, and in anycase, it would still have led to the events that unfold later.

[klauswhereareyou]

Watched AOTC for the first time in awhile and skipped every scene involving Anakin and Padme on Naboo and Tatooine. It's actually a better film. It's too bad that the writing and directing of those scenes is so awful and unbearable to watch, because they really bring the film down, unless you skip them all like I did, but if you haven't seen it before the plot would be a little confusing.

[georgec]

Originally Posted by klauswhereareyou

Watched AOTC for the first time in awhile and skipped every scene involving Anakin and Padme on Naboo and Tatooine. It's actually a better film. It's too bad that the writing and directing of those scenes is so awful and unbearable to watch, because they really bring the film down, unless you skip them all like I did, but if you haven't seen it before the plot would be a little confusing.

LOL take out half of the movie and it's not bad.

[Moviefan2k4]

Originally Posted by EclipseSSD

I disagree with the ROTS novelization's assertion that during the Battle between Yoda and Sidious, Sidious grew stronger while Yoda grew weaker. I'd argue to the contrary in fact, which is demonstrated in that RotS Blu-ray alternate ending of the Duel in the Senate,

[Show spoiler]where it is Palpatine who flees by flying a Senate seat out of the building and Yoda remains there.

I'd prefer that version to what we got in the end, and in anycase, it would still have led to the events that unfold later.

Well, you do see Yoda grimace in pain from Sidious' lightning, before he focuses again to try and repel it.

[klauswhereareyou]

Originally Posted by georgec

LOL take out half of the movie and it's not bad.

Yeah....to me AOTC is the worst, but I guess after my little scene skipping experiment, I have found a way to make it's viewing tolerable.

[The Apocalypse]

Originally Posted by Moviefan2k4

Well, you do see Yoda grimace in pain from Sidious' lightning, before he focuses again to try and repel it.

Yeah, but you don't suddenly become weaker in the way the novelization was implying. Besides once he focuses and he repeals it, you can see that sort of determination in his eyes. Yoda was consistently calm and collected, yet determined, while Palpatine was obviously drawing on his anger and rage to destroy Yoda. In terms of Force knowledge, Yoda and Sidious are about equal in their respective sides, Light and Dark. Saber skills? If they were duelling on even ground, I'd say Yoda would have won.

[Riddler The Slag]

Originally Posted by EclipseSSD

In terms of Force knowledge, Yoda and Sidious are about equal in their respective sides, Light and Dark. Saber skills? If they were duelling on even ground, I'd say Yoda would have won.

To be one hundred percent honest, I was so grossly underwhelmed by the Yoda Sidious fight in terms of we got nothing new. The Voldermort-Dumbledore duel was what Yoda and Sidious should have been. Just a display of massive power and I felt so cheated we never got that!

[The Apocalypse]

Originally Posted by Riddler The Slag

To be one hundred percent honest, I was so grossly underwhelmed by the Yoda Sidious fight in terms of we got nothing new. The Voldermort-Dumbledore duel was what Yoda and Sidious should have been. Just a display of massive power and I felt so cheated we never got that!

Indeed, it could have been quite an epic display, the ultimate clash of Light vs Dark Side.

[budious]

George could have made it so much better if Yoda had just been given a little machine gun that shot lightsaber bullets.

"**** with me you wanna. Rough play you wanna. My little friend say hello."

[stvn1974]

I think even a hundred years from now people will still be saying "George could have made it much better if he had..." when it comes to the prequels.

[Riddler The Slag]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

I think even a hundred years from now people will still be saying "George could have made it much better if he had..." when it comes to the prequels.

Not in every case but that was a glaring omission when it comes to the Palpatine - Yoda duel. It's kind of like he had run out of gas and or originality at that point. Throw things - seen it, cool lightsaber duel - happening on another planet as well, lightning - yawn. I think like many it was a chance for ol' Lucas to knock it out of the park and it just really came up as a bunt.

[The Apocalypse]

For the Battle of the Heroes in ROTS, that may be what some people see as the problem, since the action was switiching between two duels (Yoda/Sidious and Anakin/Obi-Wan), instead of focusing entirely on one, then moving on to the next one way down the line, which would mean the movie probably would've had to be longer.

[ZoetMB]

Originally Posted by MacEachaidh

When Vader says, "I ... am your father!", it's nothing more now than an unwelcome surprise for Luke — it's now info we already know, and our response is more a matter of, "Yeah ... and??"

There are two answers to that: One, is to watch the films in this order: 4, 5, 1, 2, 3, 6. There other is that Vader being Luke's father is no longer a surprise to anyone. The plots of the films are so ingrained into our culture that even people who haven't seen the films know that Vader is Luke's father, so it doesn't matter any more. Just as everyone knows that King Kong falls off the Empire State Building. Or that Vito Corleone gets shot. Or that Atlanta burns in Gone With the Wind. It's no longer about what happens. It's a matter of why it happens, how it gets resolved and how characters learn or change as a result of those events.

What was amazing back in the day was that even though films played in theatres for far longer than they do today (Star Wars played for a year in some venues), you could go see the film months after release and still not know the spoilers. While there were certainly film reviewers, this was long before the internet and every little bit of trivia about every single film was not posted online. Variety and Hollywood Reporter were still trade publications read primarily by people in the business. And consumers were a lot more disciplined in those days about not revealing plot points. If Star Wars was written today, it would have to be written differently due to the change in the media reporting environment. With Twitter, texting, etc., there are no secrets anymore.

The reflections of the OT in the PT is one of the few things I liked about the PT. What bothered me is all the unnecessary plot holes and inconsistencies in the PT that could have been avoided with better writing and plotting, items which have been discussed ad nauseum before.

[klauswhereareyou]

I never really had an issue with cutting between the duels in ROTS, afterall Lucas started heavily cross cutting his climaxes starting with Empire Strikes Back. My issue with the saber fights at the end of Sith is that both duels come off as being kind of silly with the jedis/sith flying all over the place. I mean it was goofy enough in the other two prequels, but Sith took it to even further rediculous heights.

[RayCRP]

Guess there's no point in me watching Gone With the Wind now...

I do agree that the Yoda/Sidious duel felt like nothing new, that it was a wasted opportunity to allow these two heavyweights to take the mythology to even greater heights. It was almost as much of a letdown for me as not getting the Qui-Gon scene that leaked from the novelization prior to the movie's release.

But I really didn't mind the Kenobi/Skywalker duel. A few things stuck out to me as pointless (flashy helicopter spins, cable swinging, etc.), and I would've preferred more of a psychological battle a la A New Hope, but given how young and naive Anakin was, their battle in Sith didn't seem out of place for me.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

I think even a hundred years from now people will still be saying "George could have made it much better if he had..." when it comes to the prequels.

A hundred years from now? There are only like twelve of us who still yak about it now.

[Monolithium]

Originally Posted by klauswhereareyou

Yeah....to me AOTC is the worst, but I guess after my little scene skipping experiment, I have found a way to make it's viewing tolerable.

I do the same with TPM. I've got it down to thirty minutes.