Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[thebard]

Originally Posted by kemcha

Then, a strange thing happened, the hypocracy of Star Wars fans ended there, just the three Star Wars films. What happened next? E.T. When Spielberg took the weapons out of the hands of the Federal agents and replaced them with billyclubs. Where was that same hypocracy? There was some for a short while, but nothing nowhere near the level that rose to Star Wars.

They were walkie-talkies, not billyclubs. And the uproar ("hypocracy", sic) ended because both versions were made available on DVD, and the original ET release was the one put on blu-ray.

http://savestarwars.com/news.html#2011spielberg

Originally Posted by kemcha

I actually found it quite humorous. And while I can understand some Star Wars fans being upset over the Special Edition films, nobody takes into account one thing, in the end, these films belong to George Lucas. He created them, he gave us a wonderful universe to enjoy long after he's gone and if he wants to expand them, he's welcome to it. We have the original theatrical editions on DVD, we have the Special Edition films on Blu-ray and everybody is happy.

Obviously, not everyone is happy, or this thread would be a lot shorter.
As for the DVD transfers of the original films, I would shy away from pointing to them as a satisfactory release, here on a forum that regards picture quality as an integral part of the home theater experience. They are laserdisc-era transfers, with primitive DNR applied, and don't look decent displayed or projected on modern equipment.

And no one has argued that these films belong to the public and not George Lucas... except George Lucas:

American works of art belong to the American public; they are part of our cultural history.

http://savestarwars.com/lucasspeecha...aledition.html

[kemcha]

Ah well! Until, at least, 2020, we'll only have one version of Star Wars on Blu-ray. If anything, the new trilogy will be finished before Disney gets around to addressing "Theatrical vs Special Edition".

[wormraper]

Originally Posted by kemcha

Ah well! Until, at least, 2020, we'll only have one version of Star Wars on Blu-ray. If anything, the new trilogy will be finished before Disney gets around to addressing "Theatrical vs Special Edition".

all it takes is one deal struck with fox for permission to distribute the original "A New Hope" and it's done. happens all the time. I seriously wouldn't be surprised to see it out to coincide with Ep VII

[kemcha]

I have to admit that it's hard to tell but I think Fox could end up striking some kind of arrangement with Disney, similar to the distribution arrangement that Fox has with MGM. It's possible that Fox could license A New Hope out to Disney as long as Fox is allowed to retain joint distribution and the continued inclusion of the Fox studio logo's and the Fox 'fanfare' music that has been a recognized symbol of the Star Wars film since 1977.

I read an article a few days ago that talked about one major missing element that fans will miss when the new trilogy hits, and the author of the article mentioned that Fox 'Fanare' music, that clashing of the 'boom'boom'boom' of the drums. For all intents and purposes, that Fanfare is as much a part of the culture of Star Wars as the movie is.

Hate Fox Studios all you want but that Fox Fanfare Theme is as much a part of Star Wars as the movies are.

[Bogey]

Originally Posted by kemcha

Hate Fox Studios all you want but that Fox Fanfare Theme is as much a part of Star Wars as the movies are.

Truth.

[kemcha]

Ain't that the truth. It's just sad that the Fox Fanfare will be missing from Star Wars: Episode VII. I just assumed it was part of the Star Wars films. I never realized that it's actually part of 20th Century Fox's opening credits until I read that article posted back in November. I'll have to dig that article back up and post it here. The link, anyways.

[Geoff D]

Going back to the restored OT for a second, I'm in the "it mightn't sell as much as you think" camp. People keep GOING ON about the SUCCESS of the franchise in CAPITAL LETTERS, and while it's true that the OT is what started it all, Star Wars fandom has grown beyond those three movies.

The reason why they have those big Celebration events is because those folks are embracing all of it; as the name implies, they're celebrating their love for Star Wars, not drowning in their hate of it (or rather what it's become) like what happens on every message board ever. Generations of new fans have been raised on the SEs, the prequels and the Clone Wars (watched S6 yesterday, **** me that was amazing), not to mention all that EU stuff in between for the hardcore SW nerd.

My point is, I have a feeling that the restored OT would be seen as nothing more than a quaint artefact by a great many people who've Learned To Stop Worrying And Love Star Wars. And don't forget the dedicated fans who've done something about it and already created their own special edition/despecialised/partly specialised/whatever versions. I've read several comments from folks who wouldn't even buy a restored OT if it were available, simply because they prefer x version now. And no doubt when it comes out there'll be people who dislike the transparencies and matte lines etc, or the colour won't be right blah blah, so even the official OT will simply become more meat for the fan-edit grinder.

Heck, even if the people on this forum are a representative sample of who would buy it, y'all do realise that you might have to pay more than $9.99 for each film, right?

[Blu-21]

Geoff D makes some strong points. I mean yeah there might be demand for the UOT but you have to remember theres a lot of fans out there now that have either learnt to accept the updated versions and with the younger fans have grown up with said updated versions to the point that they'd see the UOT pretty much how Lucus sees them and that's as unfinished primitive rough cuts. Don't get me wrong the UOT should absolutely be respectfully preserved, but I just don't think they will be given the super delux treatment that many people here think.

[Lemmy Lugosi]

They missed the boat for this collectors' cash. They waited so long, that I'm no longer interested.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by kemcha

Ain't that the truth. It's just sad that the Fox Fanfare will be missing from Star Wars: Episode VII. I just assumed it was part of the Star Wars films. I never realized that it's actually part of 20th Century Fox's opening credits until I read that article posted back in November. I'll have to dig that article back up and post it here. The link, anyways.

You had to read an article to figure that out? Have you never seen any other 20th Century Fox movie?

I agree that it is very iconicially tied with the Star Wars films and it is sad that it won't be a part of the new ones, but I didn't have to read an article to figure it out.

[Merlinpants]

Originally Posted by Merlinpants

I can easily see Disney agreeing to put Fox's logo on Episodes VII-IX, as well as a percentage of the box office grosses, in exchange for the rights to A New Hope returning to disney. Marvel did the deal with paramount for avengers and iron man 3, marvel is owned by disney, it has worked once, it will work again.

This.

[blonde_devil]

Originally Posted by KaineKinetic

1148 pages...

maybe your pages are bigger than mine, I see many more

Why would Disney need to pay for the right to A New Hope? Lucas has owned it for years now, ever since the Special Editions came out. Lucas said himself that was how it was done - he "agreed" to do the special editions but the catch was he got the rights to the original movie back. It was thiers the moment they bought Lucas Films.

It will be interesting to see what happens with the fanfare. I can see Disney being asked a fortune to use it but I don't see them agreeing to the Fox logo when Fox has nothing to do with the movies. Worse case I see them either skipping it all together or creating their own. However I wonder if there is already some sort of deal in place - Star Wars In Concert used it so you never know.

[ZoetMB]

Originally Posted by octagon

I want a UOT release as much as anybody but let's be honest, it probably wouldn't generate huge amounts of revenue. People talk good games but my guess is relatively few would double-dip and many of those would wait for bargain basement pricing.

I totally agree. While this is something that fans want, by "fans" I mean those who are obsessive and can quote every change made to the film, not those who saw the film at some time in the past and "enjoyed" it.

I would say that most people (outside the kind of people who inhabit sites like this one as well as Star Wars fan sites) don't really care all that much. I think the failure of the 3D release of Star Wars kind of proves that there's not as much continued interest in the OT as fans think.

The BD release sold a ton of copies (although I don't have exact sales figures). Most people are not going to double-dip (or triple-dip if they already had in on DVD) or quadruple dip (if they already also had it on VHS) unless it was bargain basement prices and maybe not even then. And by that, the entire original trilogy would have be under $20.

And while fans would consider this heresy, I'd bet there would even be some backlash: people who have seen the films only since 1997, don't pay close enough attention to know about all the tinkering and versions, and who might buy it and be disappointed that it's not the film that they originally saw. And then there are those who wouldn't mind the 1997 special edition changes, but would mind the further changes applied to the BDs. Or even vice-versa (doubtful, but still possible).

And in reconstructing the originals, I'm sure they wouldn't get it "perfect" - those who love to complain would find something to obsess over: a frame missing, some slight difference in the sound mix, some slight color variation, some slight cropping difference, an optical that looks slightly different, a matte line, some slight difference in the sound mix...whatever.

I've mentioned this before, but I have a set of the OT THX VHS edition in a boxed set, which I had put up for sale for a time. I thought there would have been lots of bidders - people who really wanted the untouched originals. There was virtually no interest. I still have them, although I've since decided to keep them (even though I no longer have any way to play them back).

[The Fallen Deity]

Originally Posted by Blu-21

Geoff D makes some strong points. I mean yeah there might be demand for the UOT but you have to remember theres a lot of fans out there now that have either learnt to accept the updated versions and with the younger fans have grown up with said updated versions to the point that they'd see the UOT pretty much how Lucus sees them and that's as unfinished primitive rough cuts. Don't get me wrong the UOT should absolutely be respectfully preserved, but I just don't think they will be given the super delux treatment that many people here think.

In fairness they don't have to spend loads doing frame by frame restorations.

Surely there must good quality IP prints out there somewhere where they can work off?

That way they don't have to spend loads of money and they can still get quite lot back in the process.

Just a thought...

[kidglov3s]

Originally Posted by ZoetMB

I've mentioned this before, but I have a set of the OT THX VHS edition in a boxed set, which I had put up for sale for a time. I thought there would have been lots of bidders - people who really wanted the untouched originals. There was virtually no interest. I still have them, although I've since decided to keep them (even though I no longer have any way to play them back).

You do realize there are LD and DVD releases that render the VHS set worthless, right?

I find the logistics/interest arguments to be silly. If this was the case then no catalog title would ever be feasible to release on Blu-ray. If you can't sell Star Wars you can't sell anything.

[RayCRP]

Originally Posted by ZoetMB

And in reconstructing the originals, I'm sure they wouldn't get it "perfect" - those who love to complain would find something to obsess over: a frame missing, some slight difference in the sound mix, some slight color variation, some slight cropping difference, an optical that looks slightly different, a matte line, some slight difference in the sound mix...whatever.

To be fair, those matte boxes in ANH are glaring... :P

[PrestigeWorldwide]

Originally Posted by kidglov3s

You do realize there are LD and DVD releases that render the VHS set worthless, right?

Not to mention the HD OT fan edits that look better than the DVD's.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by ZoetMB

I would say that most people (outside the kind of people who inhabit sites like this one as well as Star Wars fan sites) don't really care all that much. I think the failure of the 3D release of Star Wars kind of proves that there's not as much continued interest in the OT as fans think.

The only movie that was released in 3D was Episode 1: The Phantom Menace, which is one of the prequels. How does the (as you put it) so-called "failure" of a 3D reissue of one of the prequels (the most heavily criticized film of all of the prequels and the entire saga for that matter) translate into a lack of interest in the OT?

Plus, I'm not so sure that release was a failure. Didn't it make a decent amount of money at the box office for a re-release of that type? I thought the main reason why we didn't see the rest of the films converted and released had more to do with Disney acquiring Lucasfilm and their priorities being in a different place.

The BD release sold a ton of copies (although I don't have exact sales figures). Most people are not going to double-dip (or triple-dip if they already had in on DVD) or quadruple dip (if they already also had it on VHS) unless it was bargain basement prices and maybe not even then. And by that, the entire original trilogy would have be under $20.

To some extent I agree with this. Such a release likely wouldn't be record breaking. But I do think it would sell well enough to justify it's existence.

And while fans would consider this heresy, I'd bet there would even be some backlash: people who have seen the films only since 1997, don't pay close enough attention to know about all the tinkering and versions, and who might buy it and be disappointed that it's not the film that they originally saw. And then there are those who wouldn't mind the 1997 special edition changes, but would mind the further changes applied to the BDs. Or even vice-versa (doubtful, but still possible).

Well, I have seen some people post online (I think a comment or two of this nature may even be buried in this thread) who grew up with the post-1997 versions and didn't understand the anger until they saw changes like Vader saying "Nooooo!" in ROTJ on Blu-Ray.

But that being said, I think most would agree that the original versions would be the "most important" previous editions to release. Though to be honest I actually wouldn't mind if they made some kind of ultimate release where they also restore the 1997 theatrical special editions as well. It would be nice if all versions could co-exist since no matter how you break it down, each version likely introduced at least some amount of fans to the OT.

And in reconstructing the originals, I'm sure they wouldn't get it "perfect" - those who love to complain would find something to obsess over: a frame missing, some slight difference in the sound mix, some slight color variation, some slight cropping difference, an optical that looks slightly different, a matte line, some slight difference in the sound mix...whatever.

True, there would be a very small handful of vocal uber-obsessive fans who would nitpick these things. Heck, as it is defining what constitutes the "original versions" is already difficult given that there were quite a few minor variations in the early years. Still, I think a release that is 99% close to the versions previously released on VHS (and even the bonus DVD discs) would be welcomed by most fans wanting the originals as long as they are in their proper aspect ratio and properly restored for today's picture and sound standards.

I've mentioned this before, but I have a set of the OT THX VHS edition in a boxed set, which I had put up for sale for a time. I thought there would have been lots of bidders - people who really wanted the untouched originals. There was virtually no interest. I still have them, although I've since decided to keep them (even though I no longer have any way to play them back).

That probably had more to do with the fact that it is VHS and not a newer format. I have the non-anamorphic DVD versions that were included in the 2006 individual DVD releases. A lot of other people probably have those as well. Why would they go out of their way to buy an old VHS set? And from what I've heard, it sounds like better transfers are out there unofficially (not true HD, but made from better sources with a better end result), so some fans have likely gone that route.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by RayCRP

To be fair, those matte boxes in ANH are glaring... :P

They're one of the easiest fixes though. As Dennis Muren has been saying for years, if you get the gamma right then the garbage mattes take care of themselves (this we can see on the two Blu-rays of Ghostbusters). Heck, I'd be willing to bet that other things like the transparencies and matte lines would also be improved with a slightly darker, denser image (different to the hefty contrast boost which the 2004 versions got). If you don't push so much light through it then optical deficiencies become less obvious.

[klauswhereareyou]

I just want the bongo music back at 1:06 here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pia4UC36dkk