Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[BillieCassin]

Originally Posted by Kryptonic

Or they've been told to focus on the timeline that's about to get a direct sequel trilogy starring a portion of the same cast? Could be that. There will always be some PT stuff produced, just like there was always some OT stuff produced during the last 15 years, even if the overall focus was on the PT and Clone Wars. Stop trivializing facts to fit your own agenda. All of the PT stuff were huge sellers.

No, there will not always be PT stuff produced. It may be produced again someday, but once the current products are in the pipeline are out, the owners of the content are not allowing it.

It's really straight forward. And if they were such huge sellers, at least compared to the OT stuff, they wouldn't be directing their licensees to not produce that product, even if they are promoting the new films.

Originally Posted by Geoff D

My 6-year-old nephew is sat in front of me right now playing with his Star Wars toys, which include Ahsoka Tano, padawan Obi-Wan from Phantom Menace, Anakin from Sith and Darth Maul. I think he's got Kit Fisto with him as well. And, of course, there's Artoo.

Like it or not, the prequels and Clone Wars HAVE reached a younger generation of fans which will be further bolstered by the Rebels cartoon, so liking Star Wars isn't solely the preserve of bitter men who are living squarely in the past. And by the way, that doesn't equate to me saying that 'the SE changes are AMAZING and that the UOT should never be released EVER', because most of the changes that are above and beyond mere technical upgrades are utterly superfluous and I'd buy the remastered UOT in a heartbeat. BUT I'm not so closed minded that I can't enjoy other aspects of Star Wars like the aforementioned prequels and the Clone Wars.

First, I'm very glad that you have a child that age around who actually plays with toys! That in and of itself is amazeballs, LOL.

I do wonder, though, if it's not TCW he is more taken by - may not be the case, but if TCW (which does sell OK, much better than PT stuff, even though both are going away for at least the time being) hadn't existed - if his interest would be the same. A good half of those characters are only in TCW, and the rest appear there. And the movies were over and done with long before he was born whereas TCW has been more current.

We'll never know, but again - in any case, very glad that he is playing with real toys. I don't know many folks with kids that age that don't have their faces shoved into an iPad, so hats off to you and I'm sure your good influence.


Personally, don't hate the prequels, I just think even if he felt he had to go backwards, he focused on the least interesting aspect. The Anakin Skywalker stuff is at the forefront, when it should have been in the background. I think that's why TCW is received better - folks lump them together, but they are far different beasts (aside, of course, from their differences in formats). The Clone Wars is an interesting topic - whereas, there really isn't much "war" in the PT. It's the backdrop we check in on a few times while watching the A-story all about whiny brats who get burned up, put on a suit, and suddenly are the worst evil known, LOL.

If the PT had been war movies, with the background of character tragedy/romance (guffaw, because romance and a Lucas-directed film are...well, this is the man that made the Sarlacc put a giant vagina LOL), it would have been received far differently. In some respects, I honestly think he thought he was copying the beats of the OT, as that same criticism could be lobbied at them on the surface - but the difference is quite stark when you really compare what keeps the story in motion.

In the OT, even when Luke is on Dagobah, etc., the war is always what is driving the conflict, as opposed to an artificial, external need to get X-character to X-place to do X so that the films make sense with the OT. Lucas himself admits that - for instance - that TPM was really simple - he needed to get Anakin off of Tatooine and to the Jedi, and the rest of it was just him "playing around" in the universe. Hey, totally his right, no doubt - but - that's why you don't see the passion the way you do for the driven nature of the OT where every second counted in telling the overall story.

Originally Posted by Geoff D

[edit]And for all the people crowing about how Ep VII is returning to the glory days (to tap in to the aforementioned "bitter men living squarely in the past" demographic ), you can bet your ass that when LFL have got that out of their system, they're gonna take the franchise into plenty of weird and wonderful new directions, which I'm all in favour of.

I am too!

I can't wait to see where it all goes. They have folks who really love and care about this franchise working on it now - not folks who are trying to go back and keep rejigger everything based on whatever life stage they are at now. Folks with a true love and reverence - and Disney is doing what Lucasfilm on it's own never did - creating one, coherent, logical, all-encompassing world that won't contradict itself.

Lucasfilm was famous for their "holocron" and their record keeping - because they had to be, because they had so many conflicting levels of cannon (once you get down to a half-dozen levels of canon, and the "mastermind" behind it all hasn't even looked at or read most of the material - it's just so messy). Folks claim that Lucas was so intimately involved in approving things, etc. - not really, he admits he never has read a single EU book, for instance. He basically just told them what they couldn't do, he had little if any to do with it's actual direction and just didn't care (he has said as much).

Lucas is a lot like Roddenberry. Lucas was just far richer, had better contracts, and started earlier in life/lived longer. The best of Trek came without the involvement of, and even the direct protests of, Roddenberry. He famously hated what they did with WoK - which is generally the "ESB" of Trek. He objected strongly to the "militaristic/nautical" theme and said "That is not my Star Trek" - when, if you watch TOS, clearly, the entire thing is, it's just turned up a notch.

He also very much despised (to his dying day) what they did with VI, because Kirk wouldn't "be racist" against Klingons - because that didn't tie in with his later ideas of perfection of humanity in the 24th century, ideas that didn't exist in nearly such a pure way as he tried to revise later in TOS. Then you look at TNG - I'm sorry, nostalgia aside (I can remember seeing the trailer in the theater for TNG, when my dad dragged me to Voyage Home - he was a big TOS fan, I never got the bug until after TNG - though I now love the TOS movies, and am ok on the show), the first season or two when Roddenberry was actually there kinda suck. It wasn't until his involvement ended that the show really got awesome.

I see the same with Star Wars. I am completely open to them making awesome, kick-butt, best ever Star Wars in the future. I am not so married to the OT that it will only be the ever be all end all. I have a strong feeling I might even like this sequel trilogy better - even if the OT will always be my childhood. And once the sequel trilogy is done, I will be completely open to whatever comes after - because they aren't trying to revise and change what has happened, obsessed with constantly remaking and revising the past.

I'm wide open to it. Star Wars is a great universe - and with a single continuity between all media, and the love of the spirit of what came before, I have no doubt I'll enjoy it completely. That passion/love was lost for me in the SE's and the PT, it just wasn't on screen to me - and while you have defenders of the SE's and PT, I rarely have seen anyone claim to be passionate about them, much less really demonstrate it. That's the true downfall of them, IMO, and what I see of the future is folks who grew up with that passion, and are bringing something back to Star Wars that it hasn't had in quite some time.

[BillieCassin]

Originally Posted by wormraper

actually they seem to care a lot. otherwise us "lucas haters' wouldn't be getting this kind of opposition

You know, I love reading well-versed opinions on both sides, and having an intelligent debate. It's really the best of what message boards should be.

That said, you find that if you put one or two folks on ignore, who just seem to be constantly "Nah-nah-nah-nah-nah" and who don't actually contribute meaningfully to the conversation, just exist to poke and prod at folks who may disagree with them, inventing ridiculous arguments that no one has made, and who have been previously suspended for such behavior it's gotten so out of hand, etc. - this thread is really pretty fascinating.

[Geoff D]

Well, as soon as my nephew puts his toys down he's on the ipad to play Minecraft with his brother.

And you've hit the nail on the head with Lucas: he's obsessed with the past, not only with the PT and the subsequent retrofitting of the OT, but with his old-school filmmaking style in general - and yet he's also the man who dragged cinema kicking and screaming into the new digital age! He uses cutting edge technology to tell very old fashioned stories, he's a walking, talking dichotomy which is why he produces so much feeling - good and bad - amongst the fans, you just can't pin him down!

In fact, after what I said before about celebrating the new directions that the new movies will eventually take, I don't really care if they look forward, back or side to side, just as long as they realise what makes a good Star Wars movie: exciting, propulsive stories, boo-hiss bad guys and spiky, sarcastic characters. Bring it on.

[The Film Expert]

Originally Posted by Bruce Campbell

Plus he seems like a great humanitarian. Calling for his death and harassing his children accomplished nothing but making you look like a sad human being.

Some people just take it too far. I don't blame him for not releasing the theatrical cuts when he was being berated by angry entitled fans and receiving death threats. Maybe he would have released them by now them if so many people never attacked him the way they did.

[SethRex]

I was in my late teens when the Prequel trilogy came out and I enjoy them. If it means I'll get flamed for doing so, then so be it. But nobody is allowed to tell me I'm meant to hate the prequels. And that goes for Jar Jar Binks. Not sorry, but that's how it is.

[Kryptonic]

Originally Posted by BillieCassin

No, there will not always be PT stuff produced. It may be produced again someday, but once the current products are in the pipeline are out, the owners of the content are not allowing it.

It's really straight forward. And if they were such huge sellers, at least compared to the OT stuff, they wouldn't be directing their licensees to not produce that product, even if they are promoting the new films.

Please stop acting like your some kind of authority or have inside connections. It's really quite pathetic.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Sure, but it's the age-old thing of one person pushing, so the other's gotta push back twice as hard, repeat ad infinitum. Doesn't matter that we've all done this dance a thousand times, if SOMEONE is WRONG on the INTERNET then we just can't let it go, none of us.

Here's the rub though...a truly contented person wouldn't need to 'push back' at all let alone twice as hard.

The fact that the constant drumbeat of 'haters, haters, haters, you're all just a bunch of haters' has only gotten louder and more shrill in the face of the mere possibility of the haters getting what they've wanted for so long gives lie to the Contented Fan charade.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by The Film Expert

Some people just take it too far. I don't blame him for not releasing the theatrical cuts when he was being berated by angry entitled fans and receiving death threats. Maybe he would have released them by now them if so many people never attacked him the way they did.

Do you really think GL is that petty? That he would deny Star Wars fans copies of the UOT simply because some people said mean things about him on the internet?

That's not a very flattering picture you're painting.

[Kryptonic]

Originally Posted by octagon

Here's the rub though...a truly contented person wouldn't need to 'push back' at all let alone twice as hard.

The fact that the constant drumbeat of 'haters, haters, haters, you're all just a bunch of haters' has only gotten louder and more shrill in the face of the mere possibility of the haters getting what they've wanted for so long gives lie to the Contented Fan charade.

Or maybe we're just tired of listening to the same old sh*t for the last 15 years. Yeah, I think it's that.

[Lord Method Man]

Originally Posted by Batmon77

I dont know about yall, but when Yoda appears at Dooku's mountain entrance, its still makes me get up outta my seat. Getting to see Yoda fight is some mind blowing shit that i didnt forsee back when he was a puppet in the OT.

Back to your regular scheduled program......

Yoda fight scenes were beyond ridiculous. I wish I had more hands since 2 were not nearly enough to bury my face into.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by octagon

Here's the rub though...a truly contented person wouldn't need to 'push back' at all let alone twice as hard.

The fact that the constant drumbeat of 'haters, haters, haters, you're all just a bunch of haters' has only gotten louder and more shrill in the face of the mere possibility of the haters getting what they've wanted for so long gives lie to the Contented Fan charade.

OR, Content Fan is just sick and tired of hearing the same ranting & raving for over a decade, on every message board.

[Lord Method Man]

Originally Posted by octagon

Do you really think GL is that petty? That he would deny Star Wars fans copies of the UOT simply because some people said mean things about him on the internet?

Senile old Lucas no longer has any say in the matter.

[The Film Expert]

Originally Posted by octagon

Do you really think GL is that petty? That he would deny Star Wars fans copies of the UOT simply because some people said mean things about him on the internet?

That's not a very flattering picture you're painting.

Wouldn't you be annoyed if you created something that people loved and then improved on it only to get death threats, claims that you raped their childhood, not to mention years of abuse on the internet and outside?

Why would you give into their demands and give them what they wanted after their degree of bullying? If he gave in then I'm sure that these people would think that what they were doing was fine and would think that in order to get your own way you just need to harass and threaten someone until they can't take it anymore and give in.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by The Film Expert

Wouldn't you be annoyed if you created something that people loved and then improved on it only to get death threats, claims that you raped their childhood, not to mention years of abuse on the internet and outside?

No.

[Batmon77]

Originally Posted by Lord Method Man

Senile old Lucas no longer has any say in the matter.

Anyone here see the paperwork concerning the sale?

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Kryptonic

Or maybe we're just tired of listening to the same old sh*t for the last 15 years. Yeah, I think it's that.

So you've been part of this back and forth for fifteen years and the haters are the ones who just can't let go?

Okay.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by octagon

So you've been part of this back and forth for fifteen years and the haters are the ones who just can't let go?

Okay.

Like I said bro, both sides can't let it go. One pushes, the other pushes back, lather, rinse, repeat. This. Is. THE INTERNET!

[Petey Parker]

Originally Posted by The Film Expert

Wouldn't you be annoyed if you created something that people loved and then improved on it only to get death threats, claims that you raped their childhood, not to mention years of abuse on the internet and outside?

Why would you give into their demands and give them what they wanted after their degree of bullying? If he gave in then I'm sure that these people would think that what they were doing was fine and would think that in order to get your own way you just need to harass and threaten someone until they can't take it anymore and give in.

If you're in the public eye you'd have to be pretty foolish to read anything about yourself on the Internet, I know it's cliche but you will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. No matter how well liked there is always someone out there who doesn't like something for any number of reasons. I would think some older like Lucas probably doesn't even have the time nor inclination to read it. You'd drive yourself insane reading it.

[al cos.]

Originally Posted by rickah88

OR, Content Fan is just sick and tired of hearing the same ranting & raving for over a decade, on every message board.

Content Fan seems pretty fragile.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by al cos.

Content Fan seems pretty fragile.

They seem very edgy lately.