Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[NL197]

Originally Posted by Dsneybuf

Amazon Video claims to have the theatrical version of Return of the Jedi, but I don't know if they mean the original theatrical version.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00VF...ID=51d-W0Ik57L

The customer comments below point to it being the altered version.

[IndyMLVC]

Originally Posted by NL197

The customer comments below point to it being the altered version.

Hell, even the poster is the special edition

[Petey Parker]

Originally Posted by Nailwraps

I'm still holding out that we get an announcement at Star Wars Celebration next month. Me thinks Disney/Fox/Lucasfilm wants to keep this under strict lock and key and we're being put in the dark.

That really is the last hope. If no announcement is made then when it's the 40th Anniversary, then it's not comings any time soon. At least we're so used to disappointment at this point that it won't be heartbreaking (too much) if it doesn't happen.

[klauswhereareyou]

I'm perfectly fine sticking with the 2004 editions of the OT that I have on DVD until they bring out an unaltered set in HD.

[Stanis]

You can't trust Amazon reviews, they lump Physical release reviews in with the streaming which makes things difficult.

I'm all for the Original Trilogy on a HD format I can buy. For now my daughters can watch Harmy's version but if Disney wants my money they'll have to restore the og version beyond LD levels and have sound that also hasn't been tinkered with. There is so much they'd have to do that it makes it very unlikely they will do it and I'll probably just have to stick with Despecialized, unfortunately.

[Geoff D]

For what it's worth, I found this in a piece of promo bumpf from Prime Focus which again reiterates that Lowry have indeed restored the films in 4K. There's nothing about versions or whatever, but it's nice to know that we weren't dreaming when the 4K restoration was listed on Lowry's website five years ago:

[imsounoriginal]

"grain reduction"

[stvn1974]

Lucas still owned Star Wars five years ago so they are probably his CGI dump versions.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

"grain reduction"

On a purist level I also cringe when I think about Lowry's 'fly to San Francisco via London' aproach to grain management but I have to admit, some of the Bond movies look pretty fantastic.

Caveat: I haven't projected any of them yet though.

[imsounoriginal]

Originally Posted by octagon

On a purist level I also cringe when I think about Lowry's 'fly to San Francisco via London' aproach to grain management but I have to admit, some of the Bond movies look pretty fantastic.

Caveat: I haven't projected any of them yet though.

The Bond movies do look great (and I don't project either). But that phrase always makes me nervous. Even when Cameron said it about Aliens, and that turned out fantastic.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

"grain reduction"

It is what it is. Lowry's process is the best in the world at doing this IMO, and I can only reiterate for the umpteenth time that de-graining/re-graining are common tools in the modern colourist's playbook. Baselight, Resolve, Mistika etc etc all have such feature sets, so as much as people cringe at the very notion you've likely sat through dozens or even hundreds of features which have had some of that very work done to them - without so much as a hint of any such chicanery having been applied.

Indeed, it's only because it's reached a level of true (or true enough ) transparency that it has become as well integrated into the DI toolset, and this naturally dovetailed with the wider realm of film restoration. Some of the alternate material used for the Final Cut of Blade Runner could only be found as intermediate elements, so those shots had to be grain managed to better match the first-generation material around them.

[steel_breeze]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

The Bond movies do look great (and I don't project either). But that phrase always makes me nervous. Even when Cameron said it about Aliens, and that turned out fantastic.

I have projected the Bond movies (on a 92-inch screen), and they look great... except for the "force field" effect of frozen grain around any moving items in the frame, just like the STAR WARS blu-rays. Drives me crazy, and so hard to "unsee" once you've seen it. I always have to roll off the "detail enhancement" on my Oppo player when I watch "Dr. No", "On Her Majesty's Secret Service", or any of the STAR WARS original trilogy blu-rays so that I don't see as much of the shimmering force-field. (Olive's original "High Noon" blu-ray had this problem too -- big time -- but the newer release fixed it)

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by steel_breeze

I have projected the Bond movies (on a 92-inch screen), and they look great... except for the "force field" effect of frozen grain around any moving items in the frame, just like the STAR WARS blu-rays. Drives me crazy, and so hard to "unsee" once you've seen it. I always have to roll off the "detail enhancement" on my Oppo player when I watch "Dr. No", "On Her Majesty's Secret Service", or any of the STAR WARS original trilogy blu-rays so that I don't see as much of the shimmering force-field. (Olive's original "High Noon" blu-ray had this problem too -- big time -- but the newer release fixed it)

That in itself is what enhances grain and amplifies any such problems therein, so ladling on extra sharpening - sorry, "detail enhancement" - isn't ideal. The frozen grain on the Lowry Bonds looked dreadful on my Philips 21:9 TV but is much less egregious on my newer Sony TVs, I was very taken with OHMSS when I watched it last. As for the current SW Blus, nothing can stop the force-field effect in that one but that was a different era for Lowry AND a very rushed 'restoration' to boot. But I have every confidence that this new restoration - whatever form it may take - is gonna smash the old Blu-rays into the dust.

What do ye think of Aliens, steely? I still say it's one of the finest looking discs in my entire collection.

[Phobics]

I doubt they'll do a OG Blu release... Though I don't think it would look that great unless it was cleaned up. I just really want the nooo, needless cgi singing at jabbas, and changed forced ghosts out of ROTJ... I didn't mind the other stuff and in some instances added more to the films. They do need to revert the Han and greedo shooting for sure.

[steel_breeze]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

That in itself is what enhances grain and amplifies any such problems therein, so ladling on extra sharpening - sorry, "detail enhancement" - isn't ideal. The frozen grain on the Lowry Bonds looked dreadful on my Philips 21:9 TV but is much less egregious on my newer Sony TVs, I was very taken with OHMSS when I watched it last. As for the current SW Blus, nothing can stop the force-field effect in that one but that was a different era for Lowry AND a very rushed 'restoration' to boot. But I have every confidence that this new restoration - whatever form it may take - is gonna smash the old Blu-rays into the dust.

What do ye think of Aliens, steely? I still say it's one of the finest looking discs in my entire collection.

Love ALIENS; great disc. And you're absolutely right about EVERY release getting some sort of grain reduction -- even the "great looking grain" discs... it's a natural part of the process. So I'm not against thoughtful "grain management"; I was responding to the specific case of the Bond movies and past Lowry releases. That force-field effect bothers me every bit as much as waxy faces. Criterion grain is my ideal (THREE COLORS trilogy, MYSTERY TRAIN, etc), yet I'm certain even that grain has been "managed".

And for the record, my usual setting for "Detail Enhancement" on my Oppo is -2; I always prefer a softer look. But for the Bonds and STAR WARS flicks, I reduce it further to -4. So I am NOT one who watches things with detail jacked. I like an old-school film-print look.

[Geoff D]

Case in point: if anyone looks at the Prime Focus pdf it mentions that "grain reduction and image processing" were carried out to Prometheus, which I think everyone agrees looks rather spiffing, what what? Sure, it was shot on digital and not film which may make it easier to massage in such a manner without it looking so egregious, but it certainly didn't leave behind any creepy-crawly artefacts.

[imsounoriginal]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

What do ye think of Aliens, steely? I still say it's one of the finest looking discs in my entire collection.

Preach.

[jobalexang]

Originally Posted by rodneyfaile

In a hypothetical universe, I wonder which would do better, a new 4K/UHD set of the special editions or a Criterion release of the Unaltered Original Trilogy.

Oh man, I would buy a Criterion release so hard. But there's no way that happens...

[reason108]

Originally Posted by Phobics

I doubt they'll do a OG Blu release... Though I don't think it would look that great unless it was cleaned up. I just really want the nooo, needless cgi singing at jabbas, and changed forced ghosts out of ROTJ... I didn't mind the other stuff and in some instances added more to the films. They do need to revert the Han and greedo shooting for sure.

If I can't have the original theatrical then perhaps a new "special edition" for a more civilized age? Keep the added scenes in Empire, and cleaned up special effects but get rid of digital rocks blocking R2, Hayden force ghost and Greedo shooting first, etc. I would buy that.

[bobbyh64]

Does anyone even think Disney will release semi-special editions of the OT? I can't imagine them removing some of the changes and not others. Nor would I want them to. The original versions should be released because they are the real movies and have more of a right to exist than the special editions.

Lucas's attitude about his films seems really crazy to me. I just watched the Blu-ray version of THX 1138 and compared the CGI scenes to the original version of the movie and the changes seem so ridiculous to me. Even if the CGI looks good, what's the point in making changes 50 years later? He even added a single CGI shot to American Graffiti to make the skyline more colorful.

I think it's funny how in the past Lucas said special effects should be used to help tell the story and not be the focus of the movie and he also promoted film preservation. There isn't much evidence that he actually agrees with either of these things he said.