Star Wars: The Complete Saga (1977-2005)

[Nicolawicz]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

I always enjoy reading posts from Lucas apologists who have to defend the changes made to the shitty Special Editions. They get all argumentative when some of us don't like blinking Ewoks, magic rocks and terrible CGI added to classic films.

Yeah, they're beyond pathetic.

[rickah88]

Takes two to tango.

[ElvisForever]

Originally Posted by Nicolawicz

Yeah, they're beyond pathetic.

Aww. Someone needs attention.

Though I gotta admit Lucas apologist is a new one on me.

The lengths these "fans" go.

[Riddler95]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

I'm not implying. That's exactly what was done for the LaserDisc Star Wars Trilogy Definitive Collection. It's been documented and I confirmed it with the folks who mastered the discs back in the mid '90s.


On the video side the telecine was done by Lou Levinson, who watched the films projected before doing the transfers.


I miss the days where I could actually talk one-on-one with the people involved in the production of the LDs - and the heads of the respective video labels at the studios...but that was 20 years ago.

That must have been awesome. It must have been so neat to be able to talk to the people involved with the production of LaserDisc releases.

Recently a friend and I were talking about how it would be neat to talk to the people involved with the production of Blu-Ray & DVD releases.

I don't own the Definitive Collection or the THX (Faces) Editions but I'd buy them if I ever come across copies in good condition for a reasonable price.

[ElvisForever]

Originally Posted by Riddler95

That must have been awesome. It must have been so neat to be able to talk to the people involved with the production of LaserDisc releases.

Recently a friend and I were talking about how it would be neat to talk to the people involved with the production of Blu-Ray & DVD releases.

I don't own the Definitive Collection or the THX (Faces) Editions but I'd buy them if I ever come across copies in good condition for a reasonable price.

I think the importance is if the transfer of the audio files was done right.

The issue I always had with LD's are the laser rot. I don't care how good the copy is, there is always some degree of it, which makes it a poor medium for storage archiving.

When I see copies up on Ebay, I would be very cautious. It is like all the Near Mint copies of LP's...yeah right.

[crissrudd4554]

Originally Posted by Riddler95

That must have been awesome. It must have been so neat to be able to talk to the people involved with the production of LaserDisc releases.

Recently a friend and I were talking about how it would be neat to talk to the people involved with the production of Blu-Ray & DVD releases.

I don't own the Definitive Collection or the THX (Faces) Editions but I'd buy them if I ever come across copies in good condition for a reasonable price.

My dad actually grabbed a used Faces set for $0.25 at an Estate sale about 5 or 6 years ago since he remembered it as the first SW set I owned. I probably would have done the same had that been me. The set was actually in pretty good shape considering.

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by ElvisForever

I think the importance is if the transfer of the audio files was done right.

The issue I always had with LD's are the laser rot. I don't care how good the copy is, there is always some degree of it, which makes it a poor medium for storage archiving.

When I see copies up on Ebay, I would be very cautious. It is like all the Near Mint copies of LP's...yeah right.

Um...mine are fine. I have roughly 50 laserdiscs, never had a problem. LD players, on the other hand, that's a different story.

[kidglov3s]

Originally Posted by ElvisForever

I think the importance is if the transfer of the audio files was done right.

The issue I always had with LD's are the laser rot. I don't care how good the copy is, there is always some degree of it, which makes it a poor medium for storage archiving.

When I see copies up on Ebay, I would be very cautious. It is like all the Near Mint copies of LP's...yeah right.

I have about 400 LDs and rot issues with just a handful (Fargo, Fifth Element, Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, His Girl Friday, Image/HBO Dawn of the Dead, JP Umbrellas of Cherbourg). In my experience most discs can be expected to play fine, especially if they are not from 90s Sony DADC or damaged physically. No issues with my Star Wars CLV faces discs.

[Alan_Grant]

Originally Posted by Nicolawicz

Yeah, they're beyond pathetic.

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by kidglov3s

I have about 400 LDs and rot issues with just a handful (Fargo, Fifth Element, Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, His Girl Friday, Image/HBO Dawn of the Dead, JP Umbrellas of Cherbourg). In my experience most discs can be expected to play fine, especially if they are not from 90s Sony DADC or damaged physically. No issues with my Star Wars CLV faces discs.

Laser Rot better stay the hell away from my animation and vintage Disney TV titles...because I will quickly run to the internet and express my stern displeasure.

Seriously, though, I have stuff on LD that was never released again, and a lot of it is very special (to me, at least). I tried to archive some of it via my default PC video capture software about five years ago, and the copy-protection wall came down and stopped it within five seconds. Annoying. And no, do not PM me with solutions, I've got enough stuff on my plate.

[HarcourtMudd]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

Um...mine are fine. I have roughly 50 laserdiscs, never had a problem. LD players, on the other hand, that's a different story.

As are mine (my LD library is about the same size). I have had a grand total of 2 cases of rot, and one of those was relatively minor (CAV Beauty and the Beast, and The Fugitive). In my experience, rot is a byproduct of physical damage (most kids don't get the care I give my LDs), or a manufacturing defect. It is not necessarily inherent to the format, but more cases have been reported in high humidity locals (the acrylic used is about 10x more hygroscopic than, say, CDs, and moisture can migrate down to the aluminum layer, oxidizing it).

As for players, my Pioneer CLD59 is still going strong...

[Ernest Rister]

Originally Posted by HarcourtMudd

As are mine (my LD library is about the same size). I have had a grand total of 2 cases of rot, and one of those was relatively minor (CAV Beauty and the Beast, and The Fugitive). In my experience, rot is a byproduct of physical damage (most kids don't get the care I give my LDs), or a manufacturing defect. It is not necessarily inherent to the format, but more cases have been reported in high humidity locals (the acrylic used is about 10x more hygroscopic than, say, CDs, and moisture can migrate down to the aluminum layer, oxidizing it).

As for players, my Pioneer CLD59 is still going strong...

Now I have anxiety about my Beauty and the Beast LD. Thanks, pal! (just kidding...but...dammit...goes to check Beauty and the Beast LD...)

[ElvisForever]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

Um...mine are fine. I have roughly 50 laserdiscs, never had a problem. LD players, on the other hand, that's a different story.

Back in the day I had over 200 (kick myself constantly for selling them!), so that is good to hear.

I would say there was more than 10 of them with bad laser rit, but the sparkles and what not are on every disc that I have ever seen.

I challenge anyone to truly claim that they have never seen it. Kind of like an audiophile claiming they have never heard a defect on a vinyl record.

The analog source is just the nature of the beast.

Transferring now woukd have been my first priority....annoying process that it is.

[HarcourtMudd]

Originally Posted by Ernest Rister

Now I have anxiety about my Beauty and the Beast LD. Thanks, pal!

Sorry 'bout that...

Originally Posted by ElvisForever

... but the sparkles and what not are on every disc that I have ever seen.

True, but I think a distinction between true rot and things that simply go with the analog territory might be in order. "Rot" is mostly characterized by, at the least sparkles in the video stream, or at worst video break-up. Most of the time this is accompanied by audio artifacts (dropouts, etc). This is a relatively rare occurrence in my experience (note that I said relatively). On the other hand, we have the laundry list of things the LD fanatics had to learn to live with, such as "confetti," or "crosstalk" (the top two on my list as a OCD perfectionist). It was rarely a matter of if a disc showed these things, but rather to what degree (and could I live with it...?). But, it would be a mistake to classify every occurrence of confetti as a symptom of rot...

The analog source is just the nature of the beast.

Absolutely - The local AV shop nearly stopped dealing with me because of my OCD and lack of understanding that nothing is perfect...but then I was a stupid kid in college

Anywhoo, this whole discussion has prompted me to move my LD titles up to the top of my viewing que, starting with The Definitive Collection...

[ElvisForever]

Originally Posted by HarcourtMudd

Anywhoo, this whole discussion has prompted me to move my LD titles up to the top of my viewing que, starting with The Definitive Collection...

And I certainly don't blame you for that. I have great memories of those classic movies. I remember the first time I saw and heard Apocalypse Now on LD and I never looked back.

[Early Memphis]

Well, I finally got the time to watch episodes I-III for the first time since they arrived (VHS? DVD?). Disappointed, I was.

Jar-Jar was … perhaps … even more offensive this go round. The aging process has left me far less tolerant of banal stupidity. Although not a particular fan of Ewan McGregor, he was tolerable - but Hayden Christensen … I actually preferred the kid in part one.

However, the ships, creatures and droids, etc. were quite wonderful - and the further I got from Jar Jar, like recovering from kryptonite, the higher I rated the episodes : 6, 7, 8. Don’t know that I’ll ever be able to sit still long enough to watch these three again, but I do look forward to revisiting episodes IV-VI soon. Hey, just one fan's opinion - certainly not meant to influence or outweigh yours.

[svenge]

Originally Posted by Early Memphis

Jar-Jar was … perhaps … even more offensive this go round. The aging process has left me far less tolerant of banal stupidity. Although not a particular fan of Ewan McGregor, he was tolerable - but Hayden Christensen … I actually preferred the kid in part one.

I maintain that Ewan McGregor is just about the only person involved with the PT whose reputation wasn't severely damaged and/or destroyed in the process. His portrayal of young Obi-Wan was indeed good enough to earn the "get out of jail free" card for it, though...

[bobbyh64]

Originally Posted by svenge

I maintain that Ewan McGregor is just about the only person involved with the PT whose reputation wasn't severely damaged and/or destroyed in the process. His portrayal of young Obi-Wan was indeed good enough to earn the "get out of jail free" card for it, though...

Who else had their reputation destroyed besides Hayden Christiansen (not sure if it was really destroyed though)? I don't think Liam Neeson, Samuel L. Jackson, or Natalie Portman did too poorly afterwards.

[svenge]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

Who else had their reputation destroyed besides Hayden Christiansen (not sure if it was really destroyed though)? I don't think Liam Neeson, Samuel L. Jackson, or Natalie Portman did too poorly.

I'll grant Liam Neeson, who was the only other person with a sizable who wasn't abysmal in TPM. Samuel L. Jackson was already cultural icon before playing a bit part as Mace Windu and admittedly didn't suck so he escaped unscathed.

Obviously Natalie Portman turned in several strong performances in other films even during the 1999-2005 PT era, but you wouldn't know that betwen the creepily robotic acting in TPM and the wholly unconvincing "romance" with Hayden Christensen in the later two films. Of course now that she's won an Oscar for Black Swan all that is forgotten.

Upon second thought my statement may have been a bit of an exaggeration, it certainly holds true for both George Lucas and Rick McCallum (along with Hayden Christensen).

[ElvisForever]

Hayden Christensen did just fine considering the way the rest of the films are.

Mark Hamill wasn't exactly Shakespeare caliber.

I think the key to understanding and appreciating the prequels is to see them for what they are, and when they were created.

Jar Jar Binks is no more annoying to me than C3PO. Matter of fact, at some times...even less so.

I get annoyed at Carrie Fisher many times over with her incredible griping and complaining at Han. Of course Luke's whining and teen angst all through Star Wars and Empire are just par for the course.

Natalie Portman's performance is highly underrated along with Hayden. The power of Episode III would not work had it not been for the setup of Episode II. The change to his outward sociopathic behavior was only echoed after we saw demonstrations of it before. I maintain that Hayden's masterful acting happens when he goes into his fits that are part of the family massacre's in Attack of the Clones.

I think far too often, people put a measuring stick on art because it doesn't stack up to what is "popular" vs what the art actually is.

Lately, when I was watching DePalma's documentary and hearing him talk about that Directors past a certain age are done. This kind of thinking to me is a crying shame and the beauty of the prequels not being appreciated is more of this behavior. Lucas had more great work in him and the fact that so many still visit the prequels shows that there is much to be seen there. I say why stop at 3...I go all the way to Rogue on a marathon and feel pretty darn good about the whole thing.

Perfect, heck no, but I don't see through the OT rose colored glasses either.

Haydn for example is a fine actor, and proof to this is how I can never un see him in Vader's outfit. This is testament FOR ME how he embodies the character without harming it. That is why I like young Haydn in at the end of Return of the Jedi. While I understand the connection to Shaw, it still doesn't change the fact that Haydn works better for the vision, and it follows to a nice conclusion that has a grand epic feel.

However, his character still saddens me. He had so much promise, and in the end his demise came from sad mistakes that are just a part of life with no clear path to what could have saved him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plJb6urme_Y

Regardless about how some people feel about Haydn, there is indication that there are a great many fans of his work (and I have enjoyed his other work as well), and I hope that he comes back for the later movies as a force ghost. Again, this makes an importance bridge with the force ghost in the special edition.

In this interview, I think he is like Jake Loyd in that his mistreatment and criticism is completely unwarranted. I think it comes from this attitude that the prequels should be from the OT fan's perspective instead of accepting the story for what it is. I have never ever understood the complete trashing of Jake Loyd.