HDMI 1.3 myths explained

[JTK]

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...44#post7517744

Start reading from post 400 on forward.

Pay attention to what Film Mixer is posting, especially quoted and bolded items, in regards to HDMI 1.3.

Lots of questions getting answered directly from Dolby people and everything else.

[theknub]

thanks JTK.... i hadn't realized how even overhyped i had 1.3, and even then it wasn't much. it's appreciated.

[JTK]

Originally Posted by theknub

thanks JTK.... i hadn't realized how even overhyped i had 1.3, and even then it wasn't much. it's appreciated.

I figure if a direct quote from one of Dolby's top guys couldn't cut it for us, nothing would.

[dobyblue]

Keep in mind a few other things.
If PS3 doesn't get an update for DTS-HD MA decoding then an HDMI 1.3 receiver is your only way to get it.
It doesn't necessarily mean you should run out and get one, but if you're upgrading or just buying a new receiver then you should certainly not try to AVOID an HDMI 1.3 receiver.
I'm not particularly interested in Dolby and am much more excited about the DTS-HD tracks, that no-one's heard yet! DTS-HD MA seems to be more common on Blu-ray than TrueHD.
It would seem foolish to completely downplay HDMI 1.3 as a tool for the manufacturers to make more money when all they're doing is advancing their product. I don't see too many people complaining about getting their favourite movies re-released in 1080p.
I'll be upgrading because I only have analog inputs on my Pioneer 1014TSX and the PS3 doesn't have analog outs. I want HDMI on my next receiver and it makes perfect sense to me to wait an extra few months for one with HDMI 1.3 specs.
http://hdmi.org/pdf/HDMI_Insert_FINAL_8-30-06.pdf

[ay221]

A 1.3 receiver is more useful for blu-ray than hd-dvd.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...44#post7520227

http://www.dolby.com/assets/pdf/tech...whitepaper.pdf

[JTK]

The players are going to have to meet the problem at halfway, if not more, so I'm not too terribly worried about it.

The PS3 looks lined up to be nicely supported with firmware and robust features.

I'm going to probably buy something as a nice stop gap now and then in maybe 2-3 years when the HDMI 1.3 beta testing period is done, I'll see about upgrading then.

Of course, that'll be when HDMI 2.0 is probably upon us or very close. I still hear talk about 18-24 months on that, as is.

I'm just not worried about any of it.

[Rob Tomlin]

Summation posted by keenan:

That makes it pretty clear and to the point, HDMI 1.3 is not needed to realize the full audio capabilities of the new HiDef players.

Correctamundo!

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin

Summation posted by keenan:



Correctamundo!

Now if I could just find a good receiver that actually "does it all right" like the LFE compensating, room EQ settings still hold on PCM, etc. etc.

[hyperdine]

Originally Posted by JTK

Now if I could just find a good receiver that actually "does it all right" like the LFE compensating, room EQ settings still hold on PCM, etc. etc.

Check this thread... https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=3896
I just posted info on the new Sony ES.

[JTK]

Originally Posted by hyperdine

Check this thread... https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=3896
I just posted info on the new Sony ES.

I have not forgotten about that puppy.

I normally would never go to Sony for anything audio related, but if that things comes out in the wash, I just might.

You gotta love 5 year warranty right out of the box.

Heh, if I could only find some legit way to get it for less than $1500 MSRP.

No way in hell I'm paying MSRP.

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin

Summation posted by keenan:



Correctamundo!

See this is wrong. The Sony player has HDMI 1.3 but doesn't decode DTS-HD MA, so you won't be able to listen to the track on Fox's releases unless you have an HDMI 1.3 compatible receiver.
Sony will only decode the core DTS. This means it cannot convert DTS-MA into PCM and therefore your HDMI 1.1 receiver will not be of any assistance.

[Rob Tomlin]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

See this is wrong. The Sony player has HDMI 1.3 but doesn't decode DTS-HD MA, so you won't be able to listen to the track on Fox's releases unless you have an HDMI 1.3 compatible receiver.
Sony will only decode the core DTS. This means it cannot convert DTS-MA into PCM and therefore your HDMI 1.1 receiver will not be of any assistance.

See, this is wrong as I understand it for this reason: if the movie is authored in the "advanced" mode (virtually all of them are), the player MUST decode the new codecs (such as DTS-HD MA) internally.

Yes, only HDMI 1.3 will have the capability of sending the full uncompressed stream to a receiver. But what good does that ability do you if the movie is authored in the "advanced" mode?

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin

See, this is wrong as I understand it for this reason: if the movie is authored in the "advanced" mode (virtually all of them are), the player MUST decode the new codecs (such as DTS-HD MA) internally.

Yes, only HDMI 1.3 will have the capability of sending the full uncompressed stream to a receiver. But what good does that ability do you if the movie is authored in the "advanced" mode?

This only applies to Dolby and only applies to Dolby on HD DVD.

At any rate we're going to find out for sure in a few months.

[Rob Tomlin]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

This only applies to Dolby and only applies to Dolby on HD DVD.

At any rate we're going to find out for sure in a few months.

If that is true, that is huge.

I will do some more research on that specific issue. If accurate, it would be a mistake for anyone to buy a new receiver now.

[dialog_gvf]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

See this is wrong. The Sony player has HDMI 1.3 but doesn't decode DTS-HD MA, so you won't be able to listen to the track on Fox's releases unless you have an HDMI 1.3 compatible receiver.
Sony will only decode the core DTS. This means it cannot convert DTS-MA into PCM and therefore your HDMI 1.1 receiver will not be of any assistance.

That's how I understood it too. For BD, the decoding of advanced audio can be done onboard or off. But, HDMI 1.3 is required for guaranteed transport of the lossless codecs.

At some point Pioneer was talking about using the 1.3 handshake over 1.2a to a new receiver from their BD deck. We'll see if that occurs. All sorts of iffy there.

For HD DVD in "advanced" mode (pretty much everything now and in the future) the decoding must be done in the player. Which is fine if the player is over spec. But, too bad if they are just to spec (2.0 TrueHD decode).

I'd prefer the decode in the player and output LPCM. But CHOICE is OK, I think.

Gary

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Rob Tomlin

If that is true, that is huge.

I will do some more research on that specific issue. If accurate, it would be a mistake for anyone to buy a new receiver now.

Indeed.

Let me know if you find out anything.

At the rate this thing is going, maybe I will just wait until HDMI 1.3 receivers show up.

[JTK]

http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/articles...i_versions.php

Good read.

[theknub]

one thing i was thinking... correct me if wrong as i go.

say you have the samsung and as far as we know, right now it won't decode a full DTS-MA signal. it will only decode the core so to speak. however, isn't the core itself lossless in this scenario? given that, it will output a pcm 5.1 signal of lossless audio over hdmi. over coax/optical it will send "only" 1.5 mbps (because of bandwidth) but the hdmi signal will pretty much be what any of us really need (for now).

[dobyblue]

Originally Posted by theknub

one thing i was thinking... correct me if wrong as i go.

say you have the samsung and as far as we know, right now it won't decode a full DTS-MA signal. it will only decode the core so to speak. however, isn't the core itself lossless in this scenario? given that, it will output a pcm 5.1 signal of lossless audio over hdmi. over coax/optical it will send "only" 1.5 mbps (because of bandwidth) but the hdmi signal will pretty much be what any of us really need (for now).

The core itself is lossy. The PCM signal will be lossless to the lossy core; it will accurately represent the lossy core signal.

[JTK]

Originally Posted by dobyblue

The core itself is lossy. The PCM signal will be lossless to the lossy core; it will accurately represent the lossy core signal.

^^ Try and say this out loud repeatedly as fast as you possibly can.