Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by wolfpackTri

Bingo! Which is why we need something like Steam for Blurays!

No we don't we need Blu Ray for Blu Ray, then we get the whole package!

[master gandhi]

The evolution of marketing lingo across the formats:

"Available on Video" (VHS)
"Available on DVD and Video"
"Available on Blu-ray and DVD"
"Available on Blu-ray, DVD and Digital HD"

I wonder if it'll ever be...

"Available on Ultra HD Blu-ray, Blu-ray, DVD, Digital UHD and Digital HD"

There's quite a few formats right now, and that's not even mentioning Blu-ray 3D or Digital 3D.

It's either an exciting time or an exhausting time, depending on your outlook. Heh

[wolfpackTri]

Originally Posted by tele1962

No we don't we need Blu Ray for Blu Ray, then we get the whole package!

?????? There is no difference between a file on a PC vs a bluray on a disc. They are exactly the same. Now you are basically saying the reason you don't want that is because you want a disc with packaging.

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by wolfpackTri

?????? There is no difference between a file on a PC vs a bluray on a disc. They are exactly the same. Now you are basically saying the reason you don't want that is because you want a disc with packaging.

Yep with extras, info on transfer, people involved and equipment to show it on my calibrated TV.

Like this :

Deep Red - The Arrow Video Story - YouTube

[wolfpackTri]

Originally Posted by tele1962

Yep with extras, info on transfer, people involved and equipment to show it on my calibrated TV.

But a digital file would have every single bit of that except a case and a disc which takes up space

[master gandhi]

Originally Posted by wolfpackTri

But a digital file would have every single bit of that except a case and a disc which takes up space

The moment you realize it isn't a debate, but someone just venting about not wanting things to ever change.

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by wolfpackTri

But a digital file would have every single bit of that except a case and a disc which takes up space

I really think we are talking streaming here........and yes packaging, booklets, exclusive extras etc.

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by master gandhi

The moment you realize it isn't a debate, but someone just venting about not wanting things to ever change.

I am all for change..........for the better.!

PS
If someone can offer up a positive argument for streaming I am all ears....so far we have seen nothing.

[wolfpackTri]

Originally Posted by master gandhi

The moment you realize it isn't a debate, but someone just venting about not wanting things to ever change.

Yep! I'm all for change. Vudu has made my life easier and now I can sell off most of my collection!

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by wolfpacktri

yep! I'm all for change. Vudu has made my life easier and now i can sell off most of my collection!

pq?

[master gandhi]

Originally Posted by tele1962

I am all for change..........for the better.!

PS
If someone can offer up a positive argument for streaming I am all ears....so far we have seen nothing.

How is moving away from discs without sacrificing one single bit of quality a bad change?

If you were all ears, he was talking about downloading, not streaming. Downloading a file that is the exact size of a Blu-ray. Again, not streaming.

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by master gandhi

How is moving away from discs without sacrificing one single bit of quality a bad change?

Which streaming service offers this, along with the example video I posted?

PS
The videos for PC have been authored for Blu, so what you are getting is a copy of a a Blu Ray disc in digital format.....far removed from streaming?

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by tele1962

No one being Elite, just stating facts, and they don't lie.

You aren't stating facts, but merely opinions (peppered with some condescending disdain for those who don't share them). Here is are a few things where, in my opinion, you are wrong:

- Physical media does not automatically mean better image quality. It is true for most online distribution channels today, but we are already seeing some of them exceeding standard Blu-ray in certain ways, and they continue to get better, and at a faster pace than physical media (where each new iteration takes many years to establish itself - if it does at all).

- Even today's mainstream digital distribution channels (that use more compression than Blu-ray) are good enough to benefit from proper restoration as well. It is easy to distinguish an old HDTV master from a newer high-quality restoration on iTunes or Vudu.

- Films are rarely restored just for a Blu-ray release. Note that I'm talking about proper restoration, not cheap "remastering" (which often just means running an old master through some touch-up software) that is often done to double-dip on Blu-ray releases. Restorations are typically done for multiple distribution channels, theatrical presentations, and also archival purposes. Even if physical media went away completely, there would still be restorations.

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

You aren't stating facts, but merely opinions (peppered with some condescending disdain for those who don't share them). Here is are a few things where, in my opinion, you are wrong:

- Physical media does not automatically mean better image quality. It is true for most online distribution channels today, but we are already seeing some of them exceeding standard Blu-ray in certain ways, and they continue to get better, and at a faster pace than physical media (where each new iteration takes many years to establish itself - if it does at all).

Name one

- Even today's mainstream digital distribution channels (that use more compression than Blu-ray) are good enough to benefit from proper restoration as well. It is easy to distinguish an old HDTV master from a newer high-quality restoration on iTunes or Vudu.

Then they add compression to muck things up?

- Films are rarely restored just for a Blu-ray release. Note that I'm talking about proper restoration, not cheap "remastering" (which often just means running an old master through some touch-up software) that is often done to double-dip on Blu-ray releases. Restorations are typically done for multiple distribution channels, theatrical presentations, and also archival purposes. Even if physical media went away completely, there would still be restorations.

Of film yes, but for home cinema?

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by ArmyOfDarknessAW

You know all the information on a Blu-ray disc is digital right? You can't just blanket digital....if you have a problem it is with streaming....not digital. I can backup a Blu-ray onto my computer with the EXACT same PQ and AQ as a Blu-ray. The worse PQ comes into it with streaming.

Even that isn't true. It's just a question of bandwidth.

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

You aren't stating facts, but merely opinions (peppered with some condescending disdain for those who don't share them). Here is are a few things where, in my opinion, you are wrong:

- Physical media does not automatically mean better image quality. It is true for most online distribution channels today, but we are already seeing some of them exceeding standard Blu-ray in certain ways, and they continue to get better, and at a faster pace than physical media (where each new iteration takes many years to establish itself - if it does at all).

- Even today's mainstream digital distribution channels (that use more compression than Blu-ray) are good enough to benefit from proper restoration as well. It is easy to distinguish an old HDTV master from a newer high-quality restoration on iTunes or Vudu.

- Films are rarely restored just for a Blu-ray release. Note that I'm talking about proper restoration, not cheap "remastering" (which often just means running an old master through some touch-up software) that is often done to double-dip on Blu-ray releases. Restorations are typically done for multiple distribution channels, theatrical presentations, and also archival purposes. Even if physical media went away completely, there would still be restorations.

Opinion in which way ( not condescending just facts).

So you are stating here and now that some streaming services offer better PQ than Blu Ray?

You really think the likes of Criterion, Eureka, Arrow will bother their arses with film restoration , transfer if it goes digital?

[master gandhi]

Originally Posted by tele1962

Which streaming service offers this, along with the example video I posted?

PS
The videos for PC have been authored for Blu, so what you are getting is a copy of a a Blu Ray disc in digital format.....far removed from streaming?

No service offers this yet. It was a hypothetical. A possible leap forward in quality even. Think about it. A Blu-ray has a limited size that they must compress the movie into. There wouldn't really be those types of limitations if you were downloading them from a server like Steam. You would have a high quality copy on your hard drive, no disc required. No clutter whatsoever. Maybe every streaming device would also come with inputs for you to attach a hard drive, so you can download your movies instead of streaming them.

Currently I stream, but I'd be open to a future where I download my digital copies and they exceed Blu-ray quality as a bonus.

I'm actually going to test out the feature on Vudu on the PS3 that lets you download the movie. I never fully realized the feature was there until someone mentioned it here in this thread. I'm curious how that looks versus streaming.

[ArmyOfDarknessAW]

Originally Posted by tele1962

No we don't we need Blu Ray for Blu Ray, then we get the whole package!

It is the same exact file. Blu-ray is just a storage format just like a DVD and CD too. All the information is digital and is the same on disc or not.

Originally Posted by wolfpackTri

?????? There is no difference between a file on a PC vs a bluray on a disc. They are exactly the same. Now you are basically saying the reason you don't want that is because you want a disc with packaging.

Yeah I don't get it. Same information either way.

Originally Posted by tele1962

Yep with extras, info on transfer, people involved and equipment to show it on my calibrated TV.

Like this :

Deep Red - The Arrow Video Story - YouTube

The file on a PC still has all of that. There is nothing special a Blu-ray disc does to the information making it better. Pretty much this comes down to you wanting the real packaging which not everyone cares about.

Originally Posted by wolfpackTri

But a digital file would have every single bit of that except a case and a disc which takes up space

Exactly!

Originally Posted by Fiffy

Even that isn't true. It's just a question of bandwidth.

True, but there is issues with streaming like internet dropping and such. I stream because downloading isn't viable and optional yet. However if VUDU allowed me to download everything I plan to watch soon on my PS4 in HDX I'd definitely use that over streaming. My damn internet drops every now and then and it has happened during movies which sucks.

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by tele1962

Name one

Sony's UHD download service. Even Netflix UHD exceeds standard Blu-ray in some respects.

Then they add compression to muck things up?

You seem to believe that Blu-ray isn't compressed. An uncompressed digital master of a 2-hour movie is measured in terabytes. The movie files that are used for digital theatrical presentations typically occupy several hundred GB. The actual movie on most Blu-rays is typically 20-40 GB. It's all just varying degrees of compression and loss.

Of film yes, but for home cinema?

I don't follow.

[Mr Kite]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

Sony's UHD download service. Even Netflix UHD exceeds standard Blu-ray in some respects.

No it doesn't


You seem to believe that Blu-ray isn't compressed. An uncompressed digital master of a 2-hour movie is measured in terabytes. The movie files that are used for digital theatrical presentations typically occupy several hundred GB. The actual movie on most Blu-rays is typically 20-40 GB. It's all just varying degrees of compression and loss.
I don't follow.

Yes Blu Ray is compressed but not to the vast amounts streaming is and if done correctly will not be noticeable?

What is the point of a company such as Arrow restoring a film for digital?