Suspiria (1977) (Remastered)

[Lutz]

Originally Posted by cakefactory

I dunno about that. I doubt the makers of say, Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon wanted it to be seen in English in the US, but the home video versions did just that for the huge percentage of home video/TV watchers that refuse to read subtitles and will not watch anything unless it's in english. I'm guessing the residents of other countries are much the same. The rest of your post is legit, but that part doesn't seem necessarily true.

There is a big difference in quality between a dub prepared for home video and a dub prepared by the people mixing the original soundtrack in association with the original production.

People have a knee jerk reaction when they hear "dub" because of home video dubs which occurred later on. These have nothing to do with the high quality dubs associated with Italian films from this period.

[Retroj23]

Don't mean to beat a dead horse but the colors on the Synapse release look very vivid and seem to fit the overall mood of this film. Now of course we don't know for sure if this was the intended look that Argento or the DP intended. Which brings up the question of where did Synapse come up with it? So until we see this disc in motion and compare it to the Italian disc it's going to be more of the same.

I for one cannot wait to see the Synapse BD.

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by Braktastic

Once it became clear that there's really no wrong way to watch an these types of Italian horror films, I defaulted to English primarily because it easier to watch dialogue that's in sync with the majority of the actors lips.

I do the same now unless it's a specific case where the Italian is recommended. Half the cast usually speaks English and the other half Italian anyways, so I might as well sit back and not have to read the screen for two hours.

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by cakefactory

And then "how dare they remove the Italian language track on the standard!!"

Well, that would be a lousy thing to do if they were to do that. I know already I'll be going for the steelbook for this one anyways. I hope they make enough to hold up for those of us that want to buy one as well as considering the scalpers are going to swoop in and buy 2/3 of them for resale.

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by Mpmarks1975

Torsten Kaiser posted initially in the smaller Italian thread, and 2-3 weeks ago in this one. He explained how his
restoration came about, and the fact he worked off the answer print and other reference points for accuracy. He goes into the technicalities better than i could para-phrase. My personal view is what most of us think it should look like with those really vivid garish colors may have been brought about by years of tinkering on home formats, more specifically early 2000s and beyond. This is only my non technical view.

People can twist and distort the evidence all they want, but the fact is, those Synapse colors do not look garish. The Synapse images show colors that don't even exist in the Italian. Like the shot of the feet with the pinkish/magenta light that stands out from the red in the rest of the shot. In the Italian it all just blends in. Do you honestly think Synapse created colors that aren't there? Because in their restoration, those colors are separated, but in the Italian, they blend together. It's obvious a separate pinkish light was used to highlight the feet, but in the Italian you can't even see the colors apart.

Same for the shot of the wall that is mostly blue in the Italian, but clearly half the wall is actually green in the Syanpse. Again, do you think they purposely split the wall into two different colors? If not, then obviously those color differences existed already, but the Italian just doesn't bring out the different colors as well so many of the colors blend together. It's obvious that wall was illuminated with 2 different colors. So why doesn't the Italian disc show that?

[kidglov3s]

I wish I could see things the way the "Italian only" folks do, then I wouldn't be bothered by my IT Cannibal Holocaust/House on the Edge of the Park not having the English audio advertised on the case.

[death_nerve]

Originally Posted by mar3o

Same for the shot of the wall that is mostly blue in the Italian, but clearly half the wall is actually green in the Syanpse. Again, do you think they purposely split the wall into two different colors? If not, then obviously those color differences existed already, but the Italian just doesn't bring out the different colors as well so many of the colors blend together. It's obvious that wall was illuminated with 2 different colors. So why doesn't the Italian disc show that?

That particular image was the exact point where I stopped entertaining the idea of the Italian disc being more accurate than the Synapse version or any of the previous releases. The wall is green and blue in that shot because of the giant green and blue stained glass window on the opposite side of the room. If you have the Anchor Bay/Blue Underground DVD go to "The Bat" chapter and start paying close attention right after she takes care of the pest. Suzy is smoking in the dark and they've lit the window behind her to project the cascading rainfall and part of the green and blue design onto the walls.

In two of the Synapse comparison shots (#7 & #2) the Italian version just has solid green throughout. Even with the difference in color, there should still be two distinct colors on the wall in screencap #2 matching the colors of the window in screencap #7.

[stigdu]

I'm not sure I actually believe there's a German guy called 'Torsten Kaiser.'

Seems like the most stereotypical Germanic name I've ever heard. I wonder if he's friends with Sillius Sodus and Biggus Dickus?

And if he's lying to us about his name, then God only knows what flights of fancy he's regaling us with his tales of the restoration of Suspiria.

All jokes aside, he seems very earnest and knowledgable, and I think both versions look great.

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by cakefactory

Even just missing out on her delighted ONE AND TWO AND THREE AND FOUR!! would be too great a price to pay!

Come on, Suzy, you're not paralysed!

[shaysaysHAHA]

I prefer most of Argento's films in Italian but the English version of Suspiria is superior IMO.

[death_nerve]

Originally Posted by stigdu

I'm not sure I actually believe there's a German guy called 'Torsten Kaiser.'

Seems like the most stereotypical Germanic name I've ever heard. I wonder if he's friends with Sillius Sodus and Biggus Dickus?

And if he's lying to us about his name, then God only knows what flights of fancy he's regaling us with his tales of the restoration of Suspiria.

All jokes aside, he seems very earnest and knowledgable, and I think both versions look great.

I'm not questioning his expertise but I am questioning the reference materials that were given to him by the rights holders. If he was contractually obligated to use their materials and given little room for deviation, then the upcoming German release might be a fairer representation of his work on Suspiria than the Italian release.

[Mpmarks1975]

Originally Posted by death_nerve

I'm not questioning his expertise but I am questioning the reference materials that were given to him by the rights holders. If he was contractually obligated to use their materials and given little room for deviation, then the upcoming German release might be a fairer representation of his work on Suspiria than the Italian release.

From his previous post in one of the threads he was involved with the German blu, he stated the Italian blu could have been improved upon but the Italian version is a true representation of his restoration. I think he was mainly talking about the encode.

[sjconstable]

Originally Posted by shaysaysHAHA

I prefer most of Argento's films in Italian but the English version of Suspiria is superior IMO.

I think it's creepier in Italian - the witches near the end are laughable in the English track but kinda sinister in Italian.

[WaverBoy]

Originally Posted by death_nerve

That particular image was the exact point where I stopped entertaining the idea of the Italian disc being more accurate than the Synapse version or any of the previous releases. The wall is green and blue in that shot because of the giant green and blue stained glass window on the opposite side of the room. If you have the Anchor Bay/Blue Underground DVD go to "The Bat" chapter and start paying close attention right after she takes care of the pest. Suzy is smoking in the dark and they've lit the window behind her to project the cascading rainfall and part of the green and blue design onto the walls.

In two of the Synapse comparison shots (#7 & #2) the Italian version just has solid green throughout. Even with the difference in color, there should still be two distinct colors on the wall in screencap #2 matching the colors of the window in screencap #7.

Good point. I'd like to hear a well-reasoned rebuttal to this by someone who is more expert on these things than I am, which is to say, not at all.

[Cbeck]

Originally Posted by death_nerve

That particular image was the exact point where I stopped entertaining the idea of the Italian disc being more accurate than the Synapse version or any of the previous releases. The wall is green and blue in that shot because of the giant green and blue stained glass window on the opposite side of the room. If you have the Anchor Bay/Blue Underground DVD go to "The Bat" chapter and start paying close attention right after she takes care of the pest. Suzy is smoking in the dark and they've lit the window behind her to project the cascading rainfall and part of the green and blue design onto the walls.

In two of the Synapse comparison shots (#7 & #2) the Italian version just has solid green throughout. Even with the difference in color, there should still be two distinct colors on the wall in screencap #2 matching the colors of the window in screencap #7.

I have the Italian disc and that shot IS green with blue, not solid green. The shot of the wall which follows also shows green and blue on the wall distinctly . Also regarding the much discussed " pink feet " in the bat scene, the feet are obviously higlighted with a light and they do not blend into the background at all. The pink is there, just not dialed up to 11. Those screen captures do not do the disc justice. I wish people would get the disc and watch it first. On my display the colors look stunning. I am watching on a plasma with an Oppo player.

[sjconstable]

Originally Posted by Cbeck

I have the Italian disc, and that shot IS green with blue, not solid green. The shot of the wall which follows also shows green and blue on the wall distinctly . Also regarding the much discussed " pink feet " in the bat scene, the feet are obviously higlighted with a light and they do not blend into the background at all. The pink is there, just not dialed up to 11. Those screen captures do not do the disc justice. I wish people would get the disc and watch it first. On my display the colors look stunning. I am watching on a plasma with an Oppo player.

I have my laptop hooked up to my plasma so I don't need to buy the disc to see it look just the same. Enjoy your disc and stop trying to convince everyone it's better than the Synapse, are you trying to justify your purchase to yourself?

[Mahadeva]

Originally Posted by sjconstable

I have my laptop hooked up to my plasma so I don't need to buy the disc to see it look just the same. Enjoy your disc and stop trying to convince everyone it's better than the Synapse, are you trying to justify your purchase to yourself?

Could you tell me the timecode of that scene?

[Torrente]

Originally Posted by sjconstable

stop trying to convince everyone it's better than the Synapse

Which Synapse disc?

Is it finally released?

[cakefactory]

Originally Posted by sjconstable

I have my laptop hooked up to my plasma so I don't need to buy the disc to see it look just the same. Enjoy your disc and stop trying to convince everyone it's better than the Synapse, are you trying to justify your purchase to yourself?

He's not trying to convince anyone the Italian disc is better than the Synapse, he's trying to get all these people freaking out about how bad a disc is without having watched it themselves that they're not right for dismissing it based on a handful of screenshots from a biased source. If you think the synapse caps look better, great, I'm right with you. If you are trying to mount a lengthy argument about how the (NOT EVEN OUT) synapse disc is better and how the italian disc sucks without having watched it yourself, enough already. Wait for the Synapse and be happy with it, stop trying to criticize something you haven't seen based on a shred of evidence from the company that IS trying to convince you their upcoming disc is better. If you're not going to watch the damn thing, why is it so important to you that you must come up with huge arguments against it? You're not giving it a chance, and thus why do you care?

[sjconstable]

Originally Posted by cakefactory

If you're not going to watch the damn thing, why is it so important to you that you must come up with huge arguments against it? You're not giving it a chance, and thus why do you care?

What are you referring to? Based on that lengthy diatribe I think you need to chill out a bit.