Justice League 4K UHD (2017)

[pottyaboutpotter1]

Originally Posted by BluRayHiDef

• Beautiful Cinematography.
• He had such a rule prior to falling to the dark side, so to speak. He disavowed it, however, as a result of seeing so many good guys die, particularly Robin, or become bad guys themselves; recall that he says, 'How many good guys are left? How many stayed that way?' Also recall that he says to Alfred, 'We're criminals, Alfred. We've always been criminals. Nothing's changed,' to which Alfred responds, 'Oh, yes it has, sir. Everything's changed. Men fall from the sky. The gods hurl thunderbolts. Innocents die. That's how it starts, the fever, the rage, the feeling of powerlessness, that turns good men...cruel.'
• As a side note, I just realized that his quote, 'How many good guys are left? How many stayed that way?,' alludes to a quote made by Christopher Nolan's version of Harvey Dent: 'You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain.'

Just one thing. If Robin’s Death is such a major part of Batman’s character in this film, why is he never mentioned once? What does his suit appear for less than 3 seconds? If you’re going to rely on something as major motivation for your character, it should not be something that can be easily missed on viewing the film. Just having Robin’s suit appear and Alfred imply things are different are not narrative shortcuts to actually dealing with this. It’s a problem I’ve seen repeated in a few of Snyder’s films; he often seems to feel that quickly implying a characters motivation is equal to actually explaining it. Look no further than the confusing characterisation of Kludd in Legend of the Guardians who goes from an apparently jealous brother to essentially zombifying his sister with no remorse and then to an evil psychopath incredibly quickly with the only implied reason for his behaviour being he felt jealous of Soren and liked the attention he got from Nyra.

Maybe it’s just the way I like stories, but just implying the motivation for one of your main characters is not a narrative shortcut to actually crafting good character motivation and development.

[meatball_84]

Originally Posted by pottyaboutpotter1

Just one thing. If Robin’s Death is such a major part of Batman’s character in this film, why is he never mentioned once? What does his suit appear for less than 3 seconds? If you’re going to rely on something as major motivation for your character, it should not be something that can be easily missed on viewing the film. Just having Robin’s suit appear and Alfred imply things are different are not narrative shortcuts to actually dealing with this. It’s a problem I’ve seen repeated in a few of Snyder’s films; he often seems to feel that quickly implying a characters motivation is equal to actually explaining it. Look no further than the confusing characterisation of Kludd in Legend of the Guardians who goes from an apparently jealous brother to essentially zombifying his sister with no remorse and then to an evil psychopath incredibly quickly with the only implied reason for his behaviour being he felt jealous of Soren and liked the attention he got from Nyra.

Maybe it’s just the way I like stories, but just implying the motivation for one of your main characters is not a narrative shortcut to actually crafting good character motivation and development.

I guess it boils down to how each of us reads it. I didn't find his motivations hard to follow at all. I still like the theory that the real Joker is dead and Leto's joker is actually Jason Todd gone crazy. It fits to his portrayal in Suicide Squad, and would be a good twist.

I really didn't like Batman much in Justice League due to Whedons changes. Apparently his guilt for becoming a killer was much more obvious in the Snyder Cut as is his willingness to die for becoming what he swore to destroy.

Ultimately I feel bad for anyone who cannot enjoys BvS: UE the way that I do. I have probably watched it once a month since it came out. I love it. Other than a few small nitpicks(Jolly Rancher), I feel that it was excellent, as is Man of Steel. As a life long DC fan, I appreciate that they were willing to be different. There are ideas there from classic comic stories, but it wanted to be something new. I will always be in line on day one for a Zack Snyder film, even if I am the only one.

[BluRayHiDef]

Originally Posted by pottyaboutpotter1

Just one thing. If Robin’s Death is such a major part of Batman’s character in this film, why is he never mentioned once? What does his suit appear for less than 3 seconds? If you’re going to rely on something as major motivation for your character, it should not be something that can be easily missed on viewing the film. Just having Robin’s suit appear and Alfred imply things are different are not narrative shortcuts to actually dealing with this. It’s a problem I’ve seen repeated in a few of Snyder’s films; he often seems to feel that quickly implying a characters motivation is equal to actually explaining it. Look no further than the confusing characterisation of Kludd in Legend of the Guardians who goes from an apparently jealous brother to essentially zombifying his sister with no remorse and then to an evil psychopath incredibly quickly with the only implied reason for his behaviour being he felt jealous of Soren and liked the attention he got from Nyra.

Maybe it’s just the way I like stories, but just implying the motivation for one of your main characters is not a narrative shortcut to actually crafting good character motivation and development.

It's called subtlety, and it works, especially due to the meta aspects of the character (but not solely due to them). Subtlety isn't something one considers when launching a cinematic universe, but this, hehehehe, does put a smile on my face.

[pottyaboutpotter1]

Originally Posted by BluRayHiDef

It's called subtlety, and it works, especially due to the meta aspects of the character (but not solely due to them). Subtlety isn't something one considers when launching a cinematic universe, but this, hehehehe, does put a smile on my face.

It’s not subtlety. Snyder doesn’t know how to be subtle (Superman = second coming of Jesus in these films is about as subtle as being hit by a freight train).

If you want to see subtle character motivation and development in a superhero movie, watch Logan. The way the backstory of events that led Logan and Xavier to their current situation we find them in is told incredibly subtly. At least for a superhero movie. And it’s given enough focus and significance without overshadowing the film.

There’s subtle, and then there’s just throwing something in and not bothering to do the necessary work to establish and develop the character and their motivation. Batman v Superman is the latter.

[BluRayHiDef]

Originally Posted by pottyaboutpotter1

It’s not subtlety. Snyder doesn’t know how to be subtle (Superman = second coming of Jesus in these films is about as subtle as being hit by a freight train).

If you want to see subtle character motivation and development in a superhero movie, watch Logan. The way the backstory of events that led Logan and Xavier to their current situation we find them in is told incredibly subtly. At least for a superhero movie. And it’s given enough focus and significance without overshadowing the film.

There’s subtle, and then there’s just throwing something in and not bothering to do the necessary work to establish and develop the character and their motivation. Batman v Superman is the latter.

Stop blaming everything on Snyder. He didn't write the script; Terrio wrote it.

[pottyaboutpotter1]

Originally Posted by BluRayHiDef

Stop blaming everything on Snyder. He didn't write the script; Terrio wrote it.

It was Snyder’s job to bring that script to screen. The director is the storyteller here. He could easily order rewrites. With his wife as executive producer, Snyder had more than enough power and opportunity to make changes to the story and script if he saw fit. The script isn’t set in stone. The director and the studio have ultimate power over the story, not the scriptwriter.

[testmon112]

Pretty much, the director decides their mise-en-scene and what performance style (theatrical, naturalistic, presentational, improvisational, non-actors etc) they want from their actors. Snyder will have looked over all components of the film and having his wife onboard as producer would definitely gave him leverage at WB.

[EbonDragon]

Originally Posted by testmon112

By dumbing down Bats in BvS he ended up becoming inert in Justice League. When it comes to the large battle sequences at the conclusion, this is when Batman's intellect and strategic planning comes into play, the problem is due to WW success the execs decided to move Diana closer to the leader position so Bats got sidelined to becoming a comedic relief (which was a mistake) undermining his qualities as a leader with Supes in JL.




It is a pity, we're not going to see Affleck and another director have a crack at Batman. Affleck certainly filled the 'physciality' of the role but I wanted to see it most fleshed out. I don't know about Jake but Matt Reeves is a solid director.



FFS, the blinds, lighting shafts, moods and cues already give off a Noir vibe. Dude was just disillusioned with the reception of BvS and Live By Night, Justice League might be the nail in the coffin going by the rumors.

Batman wasn’t comedic relief. Apart from the bleeding joke, he had his standard dry Batman humor. And he’s never been a leader of the JL. He’s always preferred to hand that position off to another. Handing it to WW is consistent characterization for him.

[CYMBOL]

Originally Posted by meatball_84

I guess it boils down to how each of us reads it. I didn't find his motivations hard to follow at all. I still like the theory that the real Joker is dead and Leto's joker is actually Jason Todd gone crazy. It fits to his portrayal in Suicide Squad, and would be a good twist.

I really didn't like Batman much in Justice League due to Whedons changes. Apparently his guilt for becoming a killer was much more obvious in the Snyder Cut as is his willingness to die for becoming what he swore to destroy.

Ultimately I feel bad for anyone who cannot enjoys BvS: UE the way that I do.

Personally, I think the problem is not so much subtly - but rather that what might be more of a fan easter egg or nod, is used as a story telling device.

Batman seeing the old suit of Robin's (that he died in) that he has enshrined - what does that mean to anyone who isn't a fan? Robin has never been introduced in the movies (he was barely introduced in the Nolan movies). If I haven't grown up with that character - that scene is meaningless.

While you might understand the weight of that reference and the deeper meaning - kids and non-DC fans (casual movie goers), the reference has no weight and the scene fails to be informative other than a generalized reference. I think it short changes the emotion of the moment.

That's just my 2 cents though.

[meatball_84]

Originally Posted by CYMBOL

Personally, I think the problem is not so much subtly - but rather that what might be more of a fan easter egg or nod, is used as a story telling device.

Batman seeing the old suit of Robin's (that he died in) that he has enshrined - what does that mean to anyone who isn't a fan? Robin has never been introduced in the movies (he was barely introduced in the Nolan movies). If I haven't grown up with that character - that scene is meaningless.

While you might understand the weight of that reference and the deeper meaning - kids and non-DC fans (casual movie goers), the reference has no weight and the scene fails to be informative other than a generalized reference. I think it short changes the emotion of the moment.

That's just my 2 cents though.

I see where you are coming from. But it is really not difficult to piece together. Everyone knows who Robin is to Batman. While they may not know the story of Jason Todd, they should be able to figure out the writing is from the Joker, which should clue them that Something bad happened to push Batman to his current mindset.

While I would love to see that story expanded, I didn't feel that it was necessary to go further at this point.

[TpFox]

Haven't seen this posted but did anyone notice this is getting Dolby Vision based off the back cover image on amazon

[JG-havkroll]

Originally Posted by TpFox

Haven't seen this posted but did anyone notice this is getting Dolby Vision based off the back cover image on amazon

Yes. It was in the official announcement and press release.

[pottyaboutpotter1]

Originally Posted by meatball_84

I see where you are coming from. But it is really not difficult to piece together. Everyone knows who Robin is to Batman. While they may not know the story of Jason Todd, they should be able to figure out the writing is from the Joker, which should clue them that Something bad happened to push Batman to his current mindset.

While I would love to see that story expanded, I didn't feel that it was necessary to go further at this point.

Thing is, the audience shouldn't have to piece together a major part of the character's backstory and motivation using what they already know from other adaptations. Batman v Superman might be someone's first exposure to Batman. They may not know what the writing on the suit (that appears for less than 5 seconds) might mean. Not everyone will make the jump from "Robin's suit is in a case" to "Robin was killed by Joker and that's why Batman is acting like this". I'm not saying Robin's death should have overshadowed the movie, but it should have been addressed. One of the many useless dream sequences could have been used to explain Robin's death. Alfred could have tried to talk to Bruce about it.

I get some people like it when "movies don't hold my hand" but there's a difference between leaving things subtle and vague enough for the audience to piece together on their own and leaving it vague because you're not actually bothering to develop something.

If you're going to hinge your character's motivation and development on a major event in their backstory, that event needs to be explained, detailed and fleshed out. There are many ways of doing this. Look at how Logan fleshes out the backstory of what brought Logan and Xavier into exile or how John Wick develops what happened to Wick's wife without having those events detract from the current story. Quickly having Robin's suit appear for five seconds isn't a good way of doing this.

Requiring the audience to do all the legwork to understand your character's motivations is just lazy writing. This isn't a case of the audience having to connect the dots, this is the audience having to create the dots as well.

[meatball_84]

Originally Posted by pottyaboutpotter1

Thing is, the audience shouldn't have to piece together a major part of the character's backstory and motivation using what they already know from other adaptations. Batman v Superman might be someone's first exposure to Batman. They may not know what the writing on the suit (that appears for less than 5 seconds) might mean. Not everyone will make the jump from "Robin's suit is in a case" to "Robin was killed by Joker and that's why Batman is acting like this". I'm not saying Robin's death should have overshadowed the movie, but it should have been addressed. One of the many useless dream sequences could have been used to explain Robin's death. Alfred could have tried to talk to Bruce about it.

I get some people like it when "movies don't hold my hand" but there's a difference between leaving things subtle and vague enough for the audience to piece together on their own and leaving it vague because you're not actually bothering to develop something.

If you're going to hinge your character's motivation and development on a major event in their backstory, that event needs to be explained, detailed and fleshed out. There are many ways of doing this. Look at how Logan fleshes out the backstory of what brought Logan and Xavier into exile or how John Wick develops what happened to Wick's wife without having those events detract from the current story. Quickly having Robin's suit appear for five seconds isn't a good way of doing this.

Requiring the audience to do all the legwork to understand your character's motivations is just lazy writing. This isn't a case of the audience having to connect the dots, this is the audience having to create the dots as well.

I still disagree that it needed to be fleshed out anymore at that point. Logan barely touched any more on the subject of where the other X-Men we're. If Logan was your first Xmen movie, that detail probably wouldn't make much sense, or would be missed entirely.

We didn't need to know what exactly happened to Batman in his past to understand where his mindset is now. Alfred perfectly laid out that he had changed and was more cruel than before. The opening scene with the battle in Metropolis was the only real evidence we needed to see on where his hostility for Superman came from. If that scene was missing, and we were just told about it in passing, then I would be with you 100%

It seems to me that the Robin scene mostly matters to you because you DO know what happened and you wanted to see it. And I won't fight you on that, it'd be cool to see. But you only have so much time in a movie. And if BvS was somebodys first Batman movie, then Robin's suit with Jokers writing would probably not be the ONE thing that the person wouldn't understand. At some point you have to assume that kids these days know more about the story of Bruce Wayne than the story of Jesus.

[Uncanny]

https://screenrant.com/justice-leagu...cenes-runtime/

Justice League Blu-Ray’s Extra Superman Scenes Are Less Than 2 Minutes Long

The Return of Superman deleted scenes releasing on the Justice League Blu-ray have a total runtime of only 1 minute 51 seconds. That’s much shorter than what people might have been expecting. It’s certainly less than the deleted scenes that were included on Wonder Woman‘s Blu-ray release – and Wonder Woman included every scene Patty Jenkins wanted.

[Pieter V]

Originally Posted by Uncanny

https://screenrant.com/justice-leagu...cenes-runtime/

Justice League Blu-Ray’s Extra Superman Scenes Are Less Than 2 Minutes Long

The Return of Superman deleted scenes releasing on the Justice League Blu-ray have a total runtime of only 1 minute 51 seconds. That’s much shorter than what people might have been expecting. It’s certainly less than the deleted scenes that were included on Wonder Woman‘s Blu-ray release – and Wonder Woman included every scene Patty Jenkins wanted.

Source: Pieter V/Blu-ray Forums

[doctor_who]

More Superman is a good thing!

[birdztudio]

Oh man I skipped through many many pages as I thought I was in the wrong place... again this thread is 4K UHD let’s get back to it shall we?

Justice League 4K UHD Digibook (Amazon Exclusive) [Germany]
Release date: March 29
Purchase link: https://www.amazon.de/Justice-Digibo.../dp/B077CYFWZ8

[paulfootball]

"Justice League Blu-Ray’s Extra Superman Scenes Are Less Than 2 Minutes Long"

Boy talk about saving footage for another release. Probably isn't even the black suit footage. Knowing WB they'll release a Snyder cut one day or he'll come back and cut his version for a Bluray release. WB likes to milk things. Just look at all the Reeve Superman releases we've had and box sets.

[xbs2034]

Two minutes actually makes perfect sense. Originally AMC and Regal were listing the runtime as 121 minutes (please don't mention the idea that it was supposed to be 170 mins long, maybe a workprint cut was that, but Snyder made fun of that rumor when it first appeared and people who were on set said the plan was always to be significantly shorter than BvS) before taking it down two minutes.

And since we know WB was pushing to get the film under two hours, it could be these scenes which went and they were actually finished due to being dropped at the last minute.