The Matrix 4K UHD (1999)

[innerlightfilms]

Has anyone posted this? Says its a 35mm scan of the trailer and although its dark, it may be a good representation of how the colors should look.

https://vimeo.com/212361397

[guachi]

Originally Posted by ROSS.T.G.

I’m no Thomas Magnum but I suspect this will be the biggest selling 4K catalogue title.

Depending on how old a movie has to be for you to consider it a catalogue title, it's a good possibility. I don't actually know what the definition is. But on this website the current back catalogue winner for most 4k "sales" on this website is Blade Runner (where a "sale" is a movie in someone's collection). Blade Runner is currently in more collections than any movie released before 2014.

I'm curious to see what happens to the blockbuster 4k movies released in May and June of this year. Saving Private Ryan is proving to be very popular so far.

[ray0414]

Originally Posted by guachi

Depending on how old a movie has to be for you to consider it a catalogue title, it's a good possibility. I don't actually know what the definition is. But on this website the current back catalogue winner for most 4k "sales" on this website is Blade Runner (where a "sale" is a movie in someone's collection). Blade Runner is currently in more collections than any movie released before 2014.

I'm curious to see what happens to the blockbuster 4k movies released in May and June of this year. Saving Private Ryan is proving to be very popular so far.

Blu-ray. Com represents only a small portion of the market. But as for popular catalogs, there may be a few in contention:

Ghostbusters
Terminator 2 (which has the highest "viewed" thread here in the 4k section by quite a bit with nearly 500,000 views).

As well as the movies you mentioned. Would be cool get some individual total sales on 4k movies.

[guachi]

I've seen a few 4k catalogue titles pop up into the top 50 blu-ray sales charts but it's not enough to make an accurate guess.

On the plus side, even if blu-ray.com is a small portion it's at least the portion we frequent.

Saving Private Ryan, out a mere week and a half, is already in more collections than Terminator 2 and Ghostbusters 1. I'd have thought more people would own Ghostbusters as it's a fantastic movie and a great 4k release.

There does seem to be some decent correlation between actual sales charts and collections on this website as those movies that have sold well are in lots of collections. So even if blu-ray.com is a small portion of the market it seems to be a reasonable proxy.

So far, the number of collections The Matrix is in a week before its release is just above where Gladiator was and just behind Jurassic Park, which is also being released next Tuesday.

[OutOfBoose]

Originally Posted by Khronikos

The actual bluray shot of that building scene is not as blown out as that comparison makes it look apparently. Was on the resetera forum talking about this. That bluray to UHD comparison posted earlier is bunk. Down below the screenshot from the lobby on bluray.

But a lot of these other caps are terrible. I really hope the UHD looks better than this.

Comparison shows relative brightness, not actual. Camera can't capture it accurately. Yet lobby is still too bright. Outfits look gray. Highlights are clipped.

[SynViks]

It's really hard to clip highlights on a UHD. It is however very easy to clip them if you're transforming an HDR grade to SDR without Dolby Vision being present.

[Jpapp25]

Originally Posted by DJR662

I can't even imagine watching the first one without watching the sequels as well. For me, this is a trilogy, just the first movie alone won't work for me. Therefore I'm glad AF the sequels are coming in October!

I really, really liked Reloaded when it came out and strongly disliked Revolutions when I was younger. While I still really like Reloaded I think the CGI effects at the time, for me at least, take me out of the action at times but I still really like the ideas the film presents. Also, after having a few more years to digest Revolutions I think it is a good bookend to the entire trilogy even if I don't think it's perfect. I am looking forward to watching these all in 4k to really try and re-evaluate the trilogy as a whole as I don't think I've ever really watched all 3 closely together.

As for the 1st film, I am beyond excited to watch this in 4K and I really hope my Target UPS delivery is incorrect in that it will be Thursday before it arrives.

[Blu-21]

Originally Posted by OutOfBoose

If Pope supervised the sequels as well, I'm REALLY curious how they're gonna look now.

From what I understand the green tint was a strong stylistic choice for the sequels, which of course for the later DVD, HD-DVD and Blu-Ray they re-graded the first film to be more in line with Reloaded and Revolutions which had previously had a more neutral colour pallet in theaters, VHS, Laserdisc and on the older DVD.

This new BD and UHD looks like its gone back to the way The Matrix originally looked in its early life BEFORE the sequels were even announced.


Would be funny if the new BD and UHD of Reloaded and Revolutions go the other way around by revising the green heavy colour timing to a more neutral grading to better match with the look of The Matrix.

Paybacks a *****..

[OutOfBoose]

The sequels have less problematic look on BD, than the first film, but shots of the theatrical print indicate there's more color nuance to them. There's more neutrality to flesh tones and so on. I won't be surprised if they end up looking rather different on UHD.

[FilmBufffff]

Originally Posted by Tone blare

Is this really gonna be 29.99 on release day ? Hoping best buy has it cheaper.

Worse...$32. I really want this but that price is garbage. Shame on you WB, shame.

[Rangers_Lead_The_Way]

32 bucks, are they trying to discourage people from buying it?

[FilmBufffff]

Originally Posted by Rangers_Lead_The_Way

32 bucks, are they trying to discourage people from buying it?

It looks especially bad next to the 4K JP Collection that's releasing same day. It's only $18 more and you're getting four films as opposed to just one.

It it weren't for that god-awful green filter being wiped away with this new transfer, I wouldn't even be contemplating buying this on release day.

[lquevideo]

Originally Posted by Jpapp25

I really, really liked Reloaded when it came out and strongly disliked Revolutions when I was younger. While I still really like Reloaded I think the CGI effects at the time, for me at least, take me out of the action at times but I still really like the ideas the film presents. Also, after having a few more years to digest Revolutions I think it is a good bookend to the entire trilogy even if I don't think it's perfect. I am looking forward to watching these all in 4k to really try and re-evaluate the trilogy as a whole as I don't think I've ever really watched all 3 closely together.

As for the 1st film, I am beyond excited to watch this in 4K and I really hope my Target UPS delivery is incorrect in that it will be Thursday before it arrives.

the issue with reloaded/revolutions is that it kinda plays into the wachoski's hand in a way that the viewer isn't expecting.
frankly, i appreciate the movies more with the commentary with cornell west and ken wilbur.
the audience was expecting a movie in which neo saves humanity and ties everything all nicely, but that isn't the goal. the ultimate theme of the movie is balance.
the last two movies are movies where the themes are miles ahead of the plot and i've come to appreciate that more.

[yetanotherone]

Originally Posted by lquevideo

the issue with reloaded/revolutions is that it kinda plays into the wachoski's hand in a way that the viewer isn't expecting.
frankly, i appreciate the movies more with the commentary with cornell west and ken wilbur.
the audience was expecting a movie in which neo saves humanity and ties everything all nicely, but that isn't the goal. the ultimate theme of the movie is balance.
the last two movies are movies where the themes are miles ahead of the plot and i've come to appreciate that more.

Yes, and the Wachowskis had to deal with a lot of frustration as Warner Bros were pressuring to make exactly that kind of movie - since the original. https://www.buzzfeed.com/adambvary/t...7Wg#.lrQZYx76M

LW: This is the script that every single person rejected in this town. Everybody kept trying to change it. And everybody wanted us to blow The Matrix up.

AW: "Where is it? Where is the Matrix? Why don't you just blow it up?"

LW: "Like the Death Star?"

LW: Everyone was like, "Make the second [film] in the trilogy the exact same as the first. Why can't it just be the same? Why can't you just do it?" And we're like, "No, the point is that the opposite is true in the second one, and yes, it's gonna rub you the wrong way. But that's what we're interested in as artists." The second and third [movies] were the story for us. We explained to Warner Bros. what we wanted to do with the trilogy, and the first biggest thing was like, "Don't kill Neo! Just don't! You can't kill Neo! You can't kill Trinity! What are you doing?" It was never like somebody said, "Do what you want. Go forth, Wachowskis, and make whatever you want!"

Ultimately, as you say the Wachowskis were never interested to make the sort of movie where the good guys blow up the Matrix, as if it were the Death Star, and happily live ever after. It was more like about recognizing our world (or the Matrix in the movies) can be shaped into something different, something better, only if one finds balance and strives for change within.

To further drive the point of the story they always had in mind home; According to The Art of The Matrix, originally, The Matrix was scripted, shot, and edited with the following ending monologue, when Neo makes the phone call:

Hi. It's me. I know you're out there. I can feel you now.

I imagine you can also feel me.

You won't have to search for me anymore. I'm done running. Done hiding. Whether I'm done fighting, I suppose, is up to you.

I believe deep down, we both want this world to change. I believe that the Matrix can remain our cage or it can become our chrysalis, that's what you helped me to understand. That to be free, you cannot change your cage. You have to change yourself.

When I used to look out at this world, all I could see was its edges, its boundaries, its rules and controls, its leaders and laws. But now, I see another world. A different world where all things are possible. A world of hope. Of peace.

I can't tell you how to get there, but I know if you can free your mind, you'll find the way.

When American audiences attended a test screening for the film (which according to the Wachowskis was the worst in their entire career, as the audiences asked for all the philosophy to be taken out of the film, and only the action to remain), they complained they didn't know what the word "chrysalis" meant. So the Wachowskis re-wrote and Reeves re-dubbed the above monologue by Neo to something that no longer spells out the Wachowskis' master plan about the Machines not necessarily being the enemy, and the Matrix potentially being the new home for the two kinds, if they work together towards peace, which can only happen if one tries to change themselves on the internal. It's a shame this alternate ending monologue hasn't surfaced with this new home video version of the film.

Fun fact / offtopic:

In their latest project, the Netflix series Sense8, a character makes an appearance exhibiting powers far beyond any of our heroes and shares this wisdom before disappearing as she deems them not ready to understand:

I used to wonder if there was something I could do to try to change the world before I understood such thoughts were unskilled.

Trying to change the world only leads to suffering.

All we can change is ourselves.

This character will return in the upcoming series finale 2-hour film, so I'm really excited to see how the story will go.

Sense8: The Series Finale | Official Trailer [HD] | Netflix - YouTube

BTW, the mysterious arc-villain The Chairman making an appearance in the above trailer is speculated by fans to be played by the Wachowskis' go-to villain, Hugo Weaving. The voice in the video can certainly remind me of Weaving. So that's one more thing to be super excited about.....

[Pgcmoore]

2 days!!!

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by SynViks

It's really hard to clip highlights on a UHD. It is however very easy to clip them if you're transforming an HDR grade to SDR without Dolby Vision being present.

Funny thing is though most studios are using Dolby Vision to master their HDR product, whether it ends up that way on physical UHD disc or not - I don't work in the biz so I'm only going on what I've heard/deduced, by all means shoot me down in flames if necessary - and yet the SDR trim passes of newly remastered catalogue stuff often comes out looking really harsh and overcooked on 1080p Blu. I can't believe how shitty the new BD of CE3K is, for example, with not only lots of blown out highlights but really crushed blacks too. And yet the SDR passes of new movies released simultaneously on UHD and BD tend to look a bit more capable to my eyes in terms of highlights, it still seems to be the case that the SDR version is the primary creative intent and the HDR is done afterwards whereas on these catalogue remasters they seem to start with the HDR pass and trim the SDR out of that which doesn't always seem to be ideal, DV or not.

[Khronikos]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Funny thing is though most studios are using Dolby Vision to master their HDR product, whether it ends up that way on physical UHD disc or not - I don't work in the biz so I'm only going on what I've heard/deduced, by all means shoot me down in flames if necessary - and yet the SDR trim passes of newly remastered catalogue stuff often comes out looking really harsh and overcooked on 1080p Blu. I can't believe how shitty the new BD of CE3K is, for example, with not only lots of blown out highlights but really crushed blacks too. And yet the SDR passes of new movies released simultaneously on UHD and BD tend to look a bit more capable to my eyes in terms of highlights, it still seems to be the case that the SDR version is the primary creative intent and the HDR is done afterwards whereas on these catalogue remasters they seem to start with the HDR pass and trim the SDR out of that which doesn't always seem to be ideal, DV or not.

Yeah, something is happening on these releases that prevents the bluray from looking very good. And this is insane because all people have is bluray shots to go off of.

I presume this film looks really good on UHD. But I have no idea be shown these horrible bluray shots.

And it's not just here. A lot of people are wondering about the state of the photos related to the UHD.

[pawel86ck]

Originally Posted by OutOfBoose

Comparison shows relative brightness, not actual. Camera can't capture it accurately. Yet lobby is still too bright. Outfits look gray. Highlights are clipped.

But the thing is, besides strong green tint that particular looby scene looks similar brightness wise on both BD's, I can see the same amount of shadow details. It's only a UHD that's much darker (at least on camera photos)

first vs remastered BD screenshots

https://images2.static-bluray.com/re...6_28_1080p.jpg
https://static.afbeeldinguploaden.nl...2/QuLAGV4x.jpg

remastered BD vs UHD photos

https://blu-ray-rezensionen.net/wp-c...-vs-UHD-11.jpg
https://blu-ray-rezensionen.net/wp-c...-vs-UHD-12.jpg

Brightness looks wrong on remastered BD but only during some outdoor scenes. It looks like new master was clearly made with UHD disc in mind, and BD transfer was made the fastest way possible.

Originally Posted by innerlightfilms

Has anyone posted this? Says its a 35mm scan of the trailer and although its dark, it may be a good representation of how the colors should look.

https://vimeo.com/212361397

Almost no green tint

[OutOfBoose]

Originally Posted by pawel86ck

But the thing is, besides strong green tint that particular looby scene looks similar brightness wise on both BD's, I can see the same amount of shadow details. It's only a UHD that's much darker (at least on camera photos)

Old BD has clipped highlights, but darker shadows and consistent gamma. The new BD has clipped highlights too, brighter shadows and ovearall very inconsistent gamma, that jumps even within a scene from shot to shot. Based on screens provided.

On comparison above the old BD is darker (easily visible on highlights, but even in shadows - shadow detail is there, but shadows are darker on the old BD). But go a few pages back and check out the cartwheel shooting shot comparison and even further back to see Neo and Trinity looking at each other from the very same scene. You'll see what I'm talking about.

[pawel86ck]

Originally Posted by OutOfBoose

Old BD has clipped highlights, but darker shadows and consistent gamma. The new BD has clipped highlights too, brighter shadows and ovearall very inconsistent gamma, that jumps even within a scene from shot to shot. Based on screens provided.

On comparison above the old BD is darker (easily visible on highlights, but even in shadows - shadow detail is there, but shadows are darker on the old BD). But go a few pages back and check out the cartwheel shooting shot comparison and even further back to see Neo and Trinity looking at each other from the very same scene. You'll see what I'm talking about.

With green tint applied remastered BD looks even darker to me, at least in this particular scene
https://s31.postimg.cc/zdgsdbdk9/a232.jpg
https://static.afbeeldinguploaden.nl...2/QuLAGV4x.jpg

Only some outdoor scenes looks indeed too bright, for example screenshots from "training" scene in particular, but I dont know if it was intented look or result of bad BD transfer.