Star Wars: The Original Trilogy (1977-1983)

[Bobbyjoe766]

Originally Posted by BladeRunner2007

Lucas is ashamend of the unaltered OT, as he feels these are unfinished movies. Workprints so to speak, that were never meant to be seen by the public. At least, that's what he said a long time ago. We all knows that BS. He also wants to erase them from the planet. Idiot.

Scott on the other hand openly states that he dislikes the Theatrical Cut of Blade Runner, yet he is aware of its fans and gives everyone the option to enjoy this version by releasing it on Blu-ray. Same goes for the so-called Director's Cut. He did manage to finally release his Final Cut 25 years later on Blu-ray, and he is very happy about it. He feels this is the best version, but he doesn't force his opinion on everyone else like Lucas does. That's the big difference between them. Lucas' ego is his own downfall.

Your powers are weak, old man.

If the 4K set does not contain the original versions (1977-83), I won't be buying. Any exclusive bonus features - used as an inducement to sway / make me forget about the original theatrical cuts, will not work this time.

[Bobbyjoe766]

Originally Posted by s2mikey

I actually like the voice over in BR that the theatrical edition has. But, when I watch the movie I go for the DC like every time. To me, movies should be released with each version. There is no reason NOT to do this other than....well....I dunno. Especially in UHD where that’s supposed to be the pinnacle of home entertainment. Alien recently got this right with having the theatrical and the alternate cut on the same disc. I’m hoping they do the same thing with any Star Wars UHD releases.

ALIEN got it wrong. The DC was treated shoddily.
The original 1979 theatrical version is my favourite, and I'm very happy with the restoration, but the DC should have also received the same love - it's not the ideal cut, but it's still ALIEN.

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by BladeRunner2007

Downfall as in he became the most hated man in the Star Wars universe. Most SW fans hate him for his stupid tinkering and childish behavior of banning the unalterted OT. It just comes off as if he's deliberately demolishing the OT with every subsequent release just to get his point across, that SW is HIS, not OURS. He can do whatever he likes. Sure, he can. But don't forget Lucas: we are the ones that made SW so successful in the first place. Not you. Without us, SW wouldn't be the cultural phenomenom that it is today. We gave you all your fortune. So please give us the versions that made you rich in the first place, George. Thank you.

The Star Wars Universe is not a real place and George Lucas doesn't live in it. Hence he is not hated there.

Most Star Wars fans do not hate him - as evident by the continued success of his company and the insane cheers he got at various Celebrations.

Are you serious claiming Star Wars successful has nothing to do with Lucas? Please.

If you didn't like the way Lucas did thinks you shouldn't have contributed to his wealth.

If Lucas is actually being "childish" then he is behaving no different to does who rant about hating him, etc.

I have no idea what Lucas' motivations and thoughts actually are but if it were some kind of flicking the bird to people who rant about the films (as some ranters claim it is) I would get a few chuckles out of that.

I have the VHS of the originals and the Special Editions box (I think) somewhere. If I want to watch the original versions I can get out the old video tape player and put them on.

Star Wars has brought me years of happiness - eve the EU and Force Awakens. That is ALL down to Lucas.

Even if it hadn't and I had disliked the special editions, prequels etc I would not hate anyone. That is just ridiculous.

Star Wars is a fairy tale. A bunch of movies. Something serious wrong if a person develops an emotion like hatred from any of it.

[BladeRunner2007]

I could live with a proper final cut of SW with small changes like this:










In a nutshell: correct some goofs, tweak some special effects with care(!) and enhance some matte paintings. No additional scenes, no shots/scenes that are 100% CGI. Original color timing.

[BladeRunner2007]

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

The Star Wars Universe is not a real place and George Lucas doesn't live in it. Hence he is not hated there.

Most Star Wars fans do not hate him - as evident by the continued success of his company and the insane cheers he got at various Celebrations.

Are you serious claiming Star Wars successful has nothing to do with Lucas? Please.

If you didn't like the way Lucas did thinks you shouldn't have contributed to his wealth.

If Lucas is actually being "childish" then he is behaving no different to does who rant about hating him, etc.

I have no idea what Lucas' motivations and thoughts actually are but if it were some kind of flicking the bird to people who rant about the films (as some ranters claim it is) I would get a few chuckles out of that.

I have the VHS of the originals and the Special Editions box (I think) somewhere. If I want to watch the original versions I can get out the old video tape player and put them on.

Star Wars has brought me years of happiness - eve the EU and Force Awakens. That is ALL down to Lucas.

Even if it hadn't and I had disliked the special editions, prequels etc I would not hate anyone. That is just ridiculous.

Star Wars is a fairy tale. A bunch of movies. Something serious wrong if a person develops an emotion like hatred from any of it.

Indifference. That's the reason studios and people like Lucas get away with sh!t like that.

[bobbyh64]

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

So however Scott actually feels about it all doesn't matter as long as her sys he is fine with it? Yet it is okay for you make stuff up about Lucas?

It doesn’t matter how Scott actually feels because there’s no way to tell how he actually feels if you don’t believe what he says. I never made up anything about Lucas. I suggested a possibility that makes sense. I think it’s a genuine possibility that he might be afraid that the public would generally prefer the unaltered OT over the special editions given the choice.

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

I don't have any belief about how Scott feels about anything.

Yes you do. In your first reply to me you said “And I believe Scott actually did complain about it.”

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

You selected Scott as a comparison and I'm simply pointing out that you don't actually know what either man thinks.

I know what they’ve said and what their actions are, so that’s generally a pretty good indicator of how they think.

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

There is a "logical reason" why the original version of the films are not available. Lucas doesn't what them to be available.

Yeah, that’s a logical reason why they don’t exist, but not a logical reason why Lucas decided they shouldn’t exist. Saying “just because” doesn’t really say anything at all.

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

We might not agree with it but that does not make his decision "illogical".

It does if what he says doesn’t make sense.

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

All changes are equal because it altering the original state.
And have Alfred Hitchcock or Charlie Chaplin approved of HD remasters of their movies or the upgrading of the audio to Dolby Digital 5.1?

So you think they’d be against HD masters of their movies but have no problem with them being in VHS or DVD quality? And Hitchcock would be just as outraged with dirt removal as he would with CGI blood being added to the shower scene in Psycho?

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by s2mikey

I actually like the voice over in BR that the theatrical edition has. But, when I watch the movie I go for the DC like every time. To me, movies should be released with each version. There is no reason NOT to do this other than....well....I dunno. Especially in UHD where that’s supposed to be the pinnacle of home entertainment. Alien recently got this right with having the theatrical and the alternate cut on the same disc. I’m hoping they do the same thing with any Star Wars UHD releases.

Honestly, I prefer the special editions of the OT. Yes, there are a few awful scenes and changes but most are neutral or an improvement. The good outweighs the bad but they should release the unaltered originals for the fans that prefer those. Just do it, damnit.

The option to view alternate versions of a movie goes way back to DVD.

I think Terminator 2 was the first to do it.

I said earlier I too want a definitive box set with all the versions at the time I wasn't thinking about the various tweaks that have been made to even the Prequels.

How times have the six films actually had changes?

My choice would be a digital and disc boxset with :

- the OT in their original unmastered versions
- the originals remastered for HD, 4K, Dolby sound (I'm neutral on that myself but others want that)
- the OT special editions
- the PT theatrical versions
- the PT home release versions
- all nine films with isolated score
- all nine films with isolated sound effects track
- every bonus feature they have
- and what would get me to buy blu-ray is some nifty extra features with the film in storyboard mode, view the films pre-VFX, etc.

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by BladeRunner2007

Indifference. That's the reason studios and people like Lucas get away with sh!t like that.

Indifference by who?

The public?

[scarletlion]

There's no dedicated thread to the Project 4K77 stuff that I can see (perhaps there should be), so can I ask what the feelings about it are on this forum please?

I have copies of both 4k77 and 4k83 and it really is lovely to see the scenes that didn't get mangled. But I have to say some of the scenes (I think from memory it might be the trash compactor scene) do have alot of grain and noticeable distortion. Does that add to the authenticity for you lot? It did distract alot for me as I'm not used to it.

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

It doesn’t matter how Scott actually feels because there’s no way to tell how he actually feels if you don’t believe what he says. I never made up anything about Lucas. I suggested a possibility that makes sense. I think it’s a genuine possibility that he might be afraid that the public would generally prefer the unaltered OT over the special editions given the choice.



Yes you do. In your first reply to me you said “And I believe Scott actually did complain about it.”



I know what they’ve said and what their actions are, so that’s generally a pretty good indicator of how they think.



Yeah, that’s a logical reason why they don’t exist, but not a logical reason why Lucas decided they shouldn’t exist. Saying “just because” doesn’t really say anything at all.



It does if what he says doesn’t make sense.



So you think they’d be against HD masters of their movies but have no problem with them being in VHS or DVD quality? And Hitchcock would be just as outraged with dirt removal as he would with CGI blood being added to the shower scene in Psycho?

I'm getting into the malarky of splitting up posts. Who has time for the?

You deny you are making stuff up about Lucas and you admit you are in the next sentence. "Suggested a possibility" means you are making it up.

No you are incorrect. I said I believe Scott has complained about it - meaning I have a memory of it but that that it not something I'm claiming is a fact. That is not the same thing as claiming some insight into his mind.

What people say isn't always how they feel.

It is logical to Lucas. You just don't like it.

It makes sense to him.

I have no idea how Hitchcock, Ford, Chaplin, etc, would feel about any home entertainment technology. Maybe Chaplin was spinning in his grave at the notion of VHS. Maybe Hitchcock would never have wanted his movies watched anywhere except on a cinema screen.

Remastering a movie is altering it from the way it is. Adding a 5.1 track is overwriting the original artists work. It is all the same thing.

Was CG blood added to Psycho? When did that happen? The blu-ray?

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by scarletlion

There's no dedicated thread to the Project 4K77 stuff that I can see (perhaps there should be), so can I ask what the feelings about it are on this forum please?

I have copies of both 4k77 and 4k83 and it really is lovely to see the scenes that didn't get mangled. But I have to say some of the scenes (I think from memory it might be the trash compactor scene) do have alot of grain and noticeable distortion. Does that add to the authenticity for you lot? It did distract alot for me as I'm not used to it.

Are those 4K bootlegs of New Hope and Empire?

[scarletlion]

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

Are those 4K bootlegs of New Hope and Empire?

As far as I can see - yes. But I don't believe they are trying to make anything out of them. They just want to provide the original theatrical versions to fans in good quality.

[BladeRunner2007]

It's Jedi not Empire, though.

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by scarletlion

As far as I can see - yes. But I don't believe they are trying to make anything out of them. They just want to provide the original theatrical versions to fans in good quality.

Obviously bootlegs. I was more expressing surprise ash their existence. I'm surprised Disney has not put a stop to such a thing.

What is the source they are using? Reels from the original release I assume.

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by BladeRunner2007

It's Jedi not Empire, though.

I don't know why but I never remember Empire was 1980.

[scarletlion]

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

Obviously bootlegs. I was more expressing surprise ash their existence. I'm surprised Disney has not put a stop to such a thing.

What is the source they are using? Reels from the original release I assume.

http://www.thestarwarstrilogy.com/st...e/Project-4K77

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by scarletlion

http://www.thestarwarstrilogy.com/st...e/Project-4K77

I rather find out in a conversation.

Bad enough we are having this chat on machines.

[drush9999]

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

Obviously bootlegs. I was more expressing surprise ash their existence. I'm surprised Disney has not put a stop to such a thing.

Disney can't stop them being out there, the best way to combat piracy is to release these in 4K themselves

[bobbyh64]

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

I'm getting into the malarky of splitting up posts. Who has time for the?

Huh?

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

You deny you are making stuff up about Lucas and you admit you are in the next sentence. "Suggested a possibility" means you are making it up.

Not the same thing. Do you think everyone who proposes a theory is just making stuff up out of thin air?

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

No you are incorrect. I said I believe Scott has complained about it - meaning I have a memory of it but that that it not something I'm claiming is a fact. That is not the same thing as claiming some insight into his mind.

I never said you claimed it was a fact. You said you had no belief about how Scott feels about anything. That contradicts your earlier post in which you said you believed Scott complained about it. What do facts have to do with it?

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

What people say isn't always how they feel.

Then maybe you’re in total agreement with me and just don’t want to say it.

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

It is logical to Lucas. You just don't like it.

It makes sense to him.

Something is either logical or it isn’t. If Lucas thinks his reasons for withholding the unaltered OT are logical, I’ve yet to hear those reasons. I’ve heard him say a bunch of weird contradictory stuff in the past.

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

I have no idea how Hitchcock, Ford, Chaplin, etc, would feel about any home entertainment technology. Maybe Chaplin was spinning in his grave at the notion of VHS. Maybe Hitchcock would never have wanted his movies watched anywhere except on a cinema screen.

Remastering a movie is altering it from the way it is. Adding a 5.1 track is overwriting the original artists work. It is all the same thing.

I’ll agree that a revisionist 5.1 track can be just as distracting as adding in new effects, but I don’t mind as long as the original track is included.

Originally Posted by ManOfTheForest

Was CG blood added to Psycho? When did that happen? The blu-ray?

No, but if it was it would be no different from cleaning up dirt and scratches according to you. I’m fine with mild things being done to make a film look better than it did on VHS or DVD or even its theatrical run as long as they don’t drastically alter the film and are merely small cosmetic things. Sometimes errors or artifacts are more obvious in an HD presentation than they are when projected on film in a theater.

[ManOfTheForest]

Originally Posted by drush9999

Disney can't stop them being out there, the best way to combat piracy is to release these in 4K themselves

I'm sure Disney's legal department is more than up to the task of making things difficult for those involved.