Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

We are all sick of you talking about adaptive streaming when you clearly have no idea how it works.

Originally Posted by sapiendut

Exactly. Just because YOU think streaming is fantastic, doesn’t mean that it is.

And you guys live in a Black Hole, Adaptive Streaming has come a long way. You're right having different size Files and changing them as needed would not be very efficient. Now the use of Processing Power and Server Software takes care of everything. The use of Processing Power breaks it down to Transcoding, Transrating, and Transizing. The need for multiple Source Files is eliminated, making it more efficient to deliver that Quality Content. Adaptive Bitrate Streaming minimizes cost, and utilizes the CDN to it's full potential. Streaming is Fantastic!

https://www.google.com/search?source...4dUDCAc&uact=5

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

And you guys live in a Black Hole, Adaptive Streaming has come a long way. You're right having different size Files and changing them as needed would not be very efficient. Now the use of Processing Power and Server Software takes care of everything. The use of Processing Power breaks it down to Transcoding, Transrating, and Transizing. The need for multiple Source Files is eliminated, making it more efficient to deliver that Quality Content. Adaptive Bitrate Streaming minimizes cost, and utilizes the CDN to it's full potential. Streaming is Fantastic!

The space between your ears is a black hole. Any knowledge attempting to enter that dead vacuum is instantly obliterated and is ejected as utter nonsense through your ever gaping pie hole.

You are completely clueless about adaptive steaming as you are about most everything else; you prove your ignorance about it every time that you bring it up. Most people have the good sense to stop making a bigger fool out of themselves after the first dozen or so people have proven them wrong, but not you. You always double down and make it worse.

Netflix streams at 16 Mbps for its 4k content and never any more than that. If I upgraded my internet service tomorrow to 1 Gbps, I would still only receive Netflix at 16 Mbps under ideal conditions the same as I do right now.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

As usual you have no idea what you are talking about. You constantly use terms that you don't understand. Transcoding, transrating, and transizing are all done before the video is presented to the viewer.

The studios provide the digital provider with a single high bitrate file. The digital provider transcodes that file into many bitrates (transrating) and resolutions (transizing). All the files are split up into 2-10 second chunks.

As you watch the video the digital provider dynamically streams the chunk of whatever the highest bitrate and resolution your network connection can support. This prevents buffering because it simply lowers your video quality if your connection slows down. But it means that the digital providers have to store lots of different size files (as I previously mentioned).

All of this is explained in detail at an article I found using your link. But I doubt you'll understand any of it.
https://www.wowza.com/blog/adaptive-bitrate-streaming

A cinder block will learn the lesson that you are teaching before he ever will. He can't even comprehend the articles that he himself links to; this happens every time that he dredges one up.

Whenever he tries to read something I am reminded of this scene from A Fish Called Wanda:



He think the mere act of reading something, and mouthing the words as he does so, magically imparts understanding. He couldn't pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Waboman

So what are we discussing here? Which is better, disc or digital? If you want quality, disc all day long. If you're after convenience it’s streaming. I like ‘em both. I love sinking into my chair, freshly made cocktail and streaming some 4K UHD Netflix and Prime shows. But if I’m going to watch a movie it’s 99% of the time I throw in a disc. Now if only I had a sexy fembot to put the movie in for me it’d be golden. Although I don’t think the Mrs would sign off on that.

Yep, that’s the discussion along with a huge dollop of keyboard warriors!

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Yep, that’s the discussion along with a huge dollop of keyboard warriors!

When I first saw your comment, I thought that it read "with a huge trollop of keyboard warriors!"

I like my first reading of it better.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Now the use of Processing Power and Server Software takes care of everything.

The new and powerful NAS servers can transcode a 2160 file to other resolutions on the fly. Never saw one that said it could do more than one at a time. But for numbers sake lets say a quantum computer* could transcode a 1000 streams at a time. Do you realize how many quantum computers the CDN's would need just to serve Netflix with their millions of streams?

I have posted several times that Netflix makes available cache servers to ISP's and many do utilize them. I have read Netflix's articles on the design and use of these cache servers and I can tell you they are doing good just to serve the files. There is no way these appliances are serving and transcoding.

*may not exist outside the lab.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

I’ve considered mounting an antenna up in the attic to see if my Samsung will pick up local stations.

If you ever decide to install an antenna I may be able to help with that, same with a dish. Would need the street you live on or close latitude & longitude coordinates. Because you do not want a dish mounted to your dwelling it can be pole mounted in your yard and hidden using vegetation.

I have a 1 meter dish (for AMC-21 satellite) mounted to the back of my house, it is not visible from any street and hidden from the neighbor that lives behind me.

I may be little rusty because we dumped cable TV in the early 90's, Dish Network in 2006 and broadcast TV in 2010.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Vilya

3D is so much fun and it is another area where streaming and digital utterly disappoints. I still buy a 3D blu-ray edition over a 4K edition almost every time as I enjoy it that much.

same here

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by alchav21

What about Disc, as the Market for Disc keeps going down Streaming looks even better. It looks like 4K will be the last Physical Media, and you guys say that compression is the downfall of Digital but putting 8k on that same Disc will be even worse. The "Shake Out" in Digital will be nothing like cramming content on a Physical Disc. Let's see what wins out, Physical or Digital!

like all your other posts this one makes no sense.

1) Market size is extremely important for streaming but no where near as important for physical media. Let me explain it this way last year my nephew graduated from University. I was at his graduation and taped it on my HD camcorder. I then burnt that film on BDs for my nephew, three sisters, my dad and myself, it cost me less then 2$ a disk even in extremely limited run it is possible to make a profit using physical media, on the other hand streaming requires a lot of expensive infrastructure, you need a data center that runs 24/7, you need an internet connection.... all of those have high costs. It is not a big issue if you have a lot of people sharing that cost but you need a lot of people sharing that cost for it to be profitable.

2) I remember people saying DVD would be the last physical media and then BD will be the last physical media. UHD BD just came out, can we wait a few years before we start wondering if it is the last physical format?

3) you are so intent on posting garbage that vou can't have logical consistency even in one sentence. IF UHD-BD is the last physical media then there is no 8 on disk the resolution a.... are all part of the media. Now let's assume like you do, that there is an 8k media, if it is the same specs (BW/Capacity) then I the point is moot nothing has changed except the resolution. If the BW goes up, then the answer is simple disk capacity is meaningless, like there has been with a few longer BDs you just split them on two disks. Now if we are talking BW then wake me up and we can have this discussion when Netflix ups its bandwidth by more then 10x

[sapiendut]

Even if studio is putting 8K material on 100 Gb disc, the bitrate is still 5x higher than the current max bitrate of the best streaming currently ... your point, alchav21?

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by flyry

Idc if digital purchases are niche i will continue to do so. Getting UHD john wick 3 tomorrow. They won't take away that revenue stream even if most casuals don't want to own anything

you see that is what is insane and does not make any sense what so ever. If it costs the studio 2$ to press the disk and I buy it for 20$ they made money. The issue with streaming is that every month the streaming company has to pay big bucks for t the computers and big bucks for the internet connection. Now if the numbers for StreamHere (fictitious streaming company) are you willing to pay 100$ a month to have access to your e films? how about 1k$? 10k$?… someone has to pay for all those fixed costs. That is why so many have shut their doors.

Streaming is in essence like a Ponzi scheme, as long as there are enough people willing to put in money everything looks good, but if there is not then it comes crashing down because your old purchase $ was spent and it is is dependent on someone buying something new to add new money to keep it going.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

Totally, but is it enough for the average consumer to notice?

does it matter? they are not the ones watching the film I am and it is more that enough for me to notice.

My gut says no. Otherwise we wouldn’t be a niche market compared to the alternatives that the masses flock to despite them being an inferior product

I don't think that is true. I can tell the difference between my old Hyundai Elantra and a BRAND NEW Ferrari Monza SP2 but that does not mean I will run out and get one. I know that the sandwich shop I have lunch at twice a week does not compare in quality , ingredients or prep to a Micheline star restaurant but that does not mean I will stop going there and eat at fancier places. There is a HUGE difference between indifference and not being able to tell the difference.


I think for most people, for the masses it is all about having an excuse to sit and veg.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

Preaching to the choir on that point Vilya. I’ve considered mounting an antenna up in the attic to see if my Samsung will pick up local stations.’

if you are serious about looking start with
1) http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opti...pper&Itemid=90
it shows you the "main" stations , direction and how powerful of an antenna you need to get each station

2) https://tvlistings.zap2it.com/ it is a TV guide. if you have been out of OTA for a while, when TV went digital the ATSC standard added the ability for sub channels

that way you will have a rough idea of what you can get and what you need to get it.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Okay you answered your own question, if it's from the same Master then Streaming and Digital should be the same. Now with Adaptive Streaming the Providers could put the same File and should get identical results.

what does Adaptive Streaming have to do with anything?
what I mean is this Kaleidascape offers BD quality digital copies of films. why? because they deal with discerning customers willing to pay an arm and a leg for that copy. Adaptive streaming is only interesting IF the service provider wants to offer lower quality to users that might need it some times. Netflix does not offer that quality because their customers don't want (for example) to pay 100$ a month to rent films and need to wait a few hours for the DL to finish.

On paper Physical should be better than Streaming, but in real time testing is it?

absolutely, no doubt about it that it looks and sounds much better.

I know Disc people like to parrot bad Streaming write-ups,

if that was the case why don't you show us as a streamer the bad disk write ups that show the contrary? I am a disk person, not just because of quality but also ownership but there are many others that are renters and don't mind streaming in this thread why do they say the same thing?

but I don't see any of that in my Streaming Quality!

I get it, as the only person on this site that won't buy a UHD BD player or disks (because the movies cost 80$ and prices keep on getting higher) you are the only one apt to compare ( the imaginary none viewed) disk to streaming and you can't see the difference.

[Vilya]

[octagon]

Originally Posted by sapiendut

Exactly. Just because YOU think streaming is fantastic, doesn’t mean that it is.

It doesn't? Then what would?

What determines whether or not streaming is fantastic?

Originally Posted by sapiendut

Just because the masses thinks General Tso’s Chicken is Chinese Food, it doesn’t make it so.

And what if the masses think General Tso's Chicken is delicious?

Would they be wrong?

[The_Donster]

And with 6 do you get egg rolls

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by The_Donster

And with 6 do you get egg rolls

Yes, yes you do:

[oak table]

I couldn't believe it tonight when I saw two teen aged girls renting from Redbox. I guess not all hope is lost for physical media.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by oak table

I couldn't believe it tonight when I saw two teen aged girls renting from Redbox. I guess not all hope is lost for physical media.

Minds are lost, but never hope.