Star Trek: The Original Motion Picture Collection (1979-1991)

[KC-Technerd]

Originally Posted by yellowcakeuf6

The 4.1 is really the same thing with left and right surrounds getting an identical mono signal like the original theatrical Dolby Stereo (matrix) track and the 70mm "6"-track. This was not a split surround (SS) film. A stereo surround signal for this film would be revisionist. It would be fine to have a 5.1 lossless with stereo surrounds as long as the original 4-track is also included IMO, which could also be lossless.
What issue are you having with 4.1 tracks on your system?

I'm not asking for stereo surround. I'm simply asking for the single surround channel to be identically duplicated on both surround left and surround right channels (monaural carried by two channels). When encoded in 5.1 I'm able to direct the left surround channel to both left surround and left surround back speakers, and right surround channel to both right surround and right surround back speakers. This allows me to play the single monaural surround channel on an array of four speakers around the sides and back of the room, to replicate the array of surround speakers around the sides and back of movie theaters. When encoded in 4.1, I am unable to identically reproduce the surround channel on all four surround speakers. I am left with the options of only producing the surround channel on the left and right surround speakers, leaving the surround back speakers unused, or use Pro-Logic IIx which I believe will direct the sound only to the surround back speakers (monaural channel from directly behind).

It is my receiver that gives me the capability of using the surround and surround back speakers in combination to replicate a theatrical array of surround speakers, but also limits that capability to 5.1 channel encodes. I don't know of any home audio equipment where 4.1 encoded as 5.1 (monaural surround duplicated on left surround and right surround channels) results in a downside. There should be absolutely no difference between a single surround source encoded as a single surround channel played on left and right surround speakers, and a single surround source encoded as identical left and right surround channels played on left and right surround speakers respectively.

[milojthatch]

Originally Posted by vertigop1ayer

I think the difference is in how they may calculate a return on their investment.

From what we've heard, it appears that TNG was tasked with having physical media sales exceed the cost of the restoration (at minimum) to count as being "worth it".

However, in the streaming world it's not so much about the physical media. It's about having a piece of content that more people are willing to watch (and spend time on your service) because it actually looks good. If your Star Trek franchise has a bunch of content that doesn't look good, then fewer people will explore the franchise and it's then empirically providing the business with less value.

In that scenario, the physical media sales (if it's still meaningfully around by that point) are simply gravy. But none of this is guaranteed to happen any time soon, or ever. I personally am reasonably optimistic that it'll happen at some point, just not right now*.

*My opinion doesn't mean anything but I am not buying the rumor that DS9 is in the process of being restored. I sincerely hope I am wrong.

Yes. I support the idea that for streaming, ViacomCBS needs to restore DS9 and Voyager in HD. If streaming really is where the money is at now and going forward, they really need their full "crown jewel" franchise in HD. People will binge TOS, TNG, etc, but if they get to DS9 and Voyager and they are not in HD, that could be a turn off for many these days, which is not a good thing for VicaomCBS as that represents 14 seasons of TV that could be binged.

And hey, if they are going to all that work anyway, they might as well release both on Blu-ray and make some of that restoration money back. There are still many fans like myself that will buy both shows on Blu-ray if they put them out. My thought is they should release both shows in HD as exclusives on Paramount+ for like a year or something (which I bet would drive more eyeballs to their service than anything from Secret Hideout, but I digress), and then a year later, release both shows as "Complete Series Sets" on Blu-ray. They'd bring in much needed eyeballs on their streaming service AND make some money back on the restoration process later with the discs.

Originally Posted by Aclea

The original Trek movies are actually problematic sellers - they never did very well internationally outside of a handful of territories like the UK, making the vast majority of their money in the US (just $24m of The Voyage Home's $133m gross came from outside the US: in many territories they even reduced 'Star Trek' to a small print afterthought on the poster. The Search for Spock only did $10.5m overseas against $76.5m domestic while even Wrath only did $19m overseas against $79m domestic). With home video sales mirroring that, they have to rely heavily on US sales without the probability of foreign sales picking up the slack. And with TOS fans (and TNG ones too) not getting any younger and that fanbase shrinking and with 4K making up such a small percentage of the also shrinking physical market, it's not a sure thing anymore.

That's right, historically Star Trek films make their money in the US. I remember reading so many years ago how they hired focus groups during the JJ Trek films to try and raise the box office internationally. Clearly didn't work so well by the time they got to the third one. However, I can also agree, it never made sense to me why Star Trek film haven't always done better overseas. There has as pointed out clearly a sizable Star Trek fan community in Europe and Australia.

[yellowcakeuf6]

Originally Posted by KC-Technerd

I'm not asking for stereo surround. I'm simply asking for the single surround channel to be identically duplicated on both surround left and surround right channels (monaural carried by two channels). When encoded in 5.1 I'm able to direct the left surround channel to both left surround and left surround back speakers, and right surround channel to both right surround and right surround back speakers. This allows me to play the single monaural surround channel on an array of four speakers around the sides and back of the room, to replicate the array of surround speakers around the sides and back of movie theaters. When encoded in 4.1, I am unable to identically reproduce the surround channel on all four surround speakers. I am left with the options of only producing the surround channel on the left and right surround speakers, leaving the surround back speakers unused, or use Pro-Logic IIx which I believe will direct the sound only to the surround back speakers (monaural channel from directly behind).

It is my receiver that gives me the capability of using the surround and surround back speakers in combination to replicate a theatrical array of surround speakers, but also limits that capability to 5.1 channel encodes. I don't know of any home audio equipment where 4.1 encoded as 5.1 (monaural surround duplicated on left surround and right surround channels) results in a downside. There should be absolutely no difference between a single surround source encoded as a single surround channel played on left and right surround speakers, and a single surround source encoded as identical left and right surround channels played on left and right surround speakers respectively.

That's why I said they were the same thing.

The only thing you could do is a hassle. You would have to run the speakers in series or parallel, depending on your amplifier capabilities, LS to LSB and RS to RSB and set output to 5.1 (no back surround speakers).
This is something I would do for the hell of it, but is probably not worth it for the odd disc for most people.

[StopSnitchinStopLyin]

Originally Posted by Gacivory

Shhhh. People on here treat GeekGab as gospel. You’ll break their little hearts if they see their god bleed.

https://www.amazon.fr/dp/B096TN7QM9

[Socko]

4 out of 6 movies. Why?!?

Will they do another release with 5 out of 6 movies and even later 6 out of 6

[adamclark83]

The other day when I was reciting Star Trek VI's dialogue, I noticed something during Valeris's questioning after she got caught in sickbay:

"Did you not wish Gorkon dead? Let them die you said."

Now, Kirk uttered "Let them die!" at the start of the film after the briefing, there were no recording devices in the room, so how would Valeris know he said that?

[Moe UK]

Originally Posted by Socko

4 out of 6 movies. Why?!?

That was my very first thought.

[LeftHandedGuitarist]

Originally Posted by adamclark83

The other day when I was reciting Star Trek VI's dialogue, I noticed something during Valeris's questioning after she got caught in sickbay:

"Did you not wish Gorkon dead? Let them die you said."

Now, Kirk uttered "Let them die!" at the start of the film after the briefing, there were no recording devices in the room, so how would Valeris know he said that?

That's often bugged me too! It could be a production mistake or the result of deleted scenes that may have explained it. Since Kirk says it shortly after Valeris's co-conspirators have left the room it's entirely possible that one of them was just eavesdropping .

[Croweyes1121]

Originally Posted by LeftHandedGuitarist

That's often bugged me too! It could be a production mistake or the result of deleted scenes that may have explained it. Since Kirk says it shortly after Valeris's co-conspirators have left the room it's entirely possible that one of them was just eavesdropping .

This is an OLD memory, but I think I recall this being explained somewhat in the novelization. Kirk has a thought when she says that, something like “the conspirators must’ve had Starfleet Command bugged, no one could have heard that conversation”. Same with Kirk’s personal log being used against him at trial. I think the book mentions something to the effect that they were hacked and were supposed to be off-the-record personal thoughts not ordinarily admissible (another indication that the trial was a sham).

[Jlouisbarrett]

That Amazon.it link is still working for me… the title says, “4 Originals Film II: Wrath of Khan III: In Search of Spock + Star Trek IV: Return to Earth [4K Ultra HD].”

The release date is September 8, 2021. Interesting.

[Spud_Almighty]

Originally Posted by Bolty

That link is no longer active. It was a mistake

It's working right now...

[albertbj]

Originally Posted by Bolty

Wow I can't believe the conspirators would bug a meeting that they were told not to bug. This is a huge plot hole

I seriously doubt that the conspirators were specifically told not to bug the meeting, so it's fine. Plot hole solved...or "filled"...or whatever.

[Croweyes1121]

Speaking of errors in Trek VI, one that's always annoyed me is the misquote from Kirk's personal log at his trial.

Log: "I can never forgive them for the death of my boy".
Trial: "I've never been able to forgive them for the death of my boy".

Just drives me crazy.

[Bolty]

Star Trek 6 has more editing errors than the other five movies combined. They were really rushing to get this one finished in time and they moved the date up by a week at the last moment.
When McCoy starts to say "he's on about something" his lips don't move for the first half of the sentence. When McCoy says "hold him!" when they're working on gorkon his lips don't move. The Excelsior first officer is in two places at once during the opening explosion scene. The cook in the galley does an about face two times when Valeris shoots the pot.
And yes they didn't double-check to see that the quote at the trial matched the quote that he gave to his personal log. They were rushing like crazy to get this movie out

[Spasmo]

Originally Posted by adamclark83

The other day when I was reciting Star Trek VI's dialogue, I noticed something during Valeris's questioning after she got caught in sickbay:

"Did you not wish Gorkon dead? Let them die you said."

Now, Kirk uttered "Let them die!" at the start of the film after the briefing, there were no recording devices in the room, so how would Valeris know he said that?

Something I only recently noticed while watching the bluray - there's actually someone else in the meeting room while Kirk and Spock are having their conversation! I don't have the exact time index but during some of the Kirk long shots you can see someone in a Starfleet uniform standing in the far back on the right. Judging from the pose I don't think this was just someone accidentally in the shot. Not necessarily saying this was a conspirator but certainly adds to the speculation doesn't it?

Another possibility:

[Show spoiler]Doesn't Cartwright touch Kirk on his way out when he says "I don't know whether to thank you or not" Perhaps he planted a device on him?

[Bolty]

Originally Posted by albertbj

I seriously doubt that the conspirators were specifically told not to bug the meeting, so it's fine. Plot hole solved...or "filled"...or whatever.

I was actually joking in my post. Just because the aide said "no recording devices" - anybody conspiring to start a war would not go along with that request.
What is even stranger is that if you go back to that scene where Kirk and Spock are the only two people left supposedly in the room having their contentious conversation there is clearly a female sitting in the background not fifteen feet away behind Kirk!
And guess what she is the very same aide-de-camp that told the assembled officers that there was no recording devices allowed. Everybody else leaves the meeting room but she stays sitting in her chair behind Kirk eavesdropping on their conversation.

Edit: I see that somebody has beat me to the punch on the mysterious woman hiding in the shadows behind Kirk! And for sure it is the same lady who is the aide to the CinC

[Croweyes1121]

Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country - Official® Teaser [HD] - YouTube

This is still my favorite trailer for any trek film, even though it contains not one bit of footage from the film it's advertising. It's just fantastic.

[Bolty]

Absolutely! This teaser trailer and the trailer for Wrath of Khan are perhaps the two most exciting trailers I ever experienced. I was so thrilled with the fact that they actually used footage from the TV series in the trailer.

[Jlouisbarrett]

There’s a nice HD scan of a 16mm print of that trailer here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNZ6...ature=youtu.be

[Chumley]

Originally Posted by adamclark83

The other day when I was reciting Star Trek VI's dialogue, I noticed something during Valeris's questioning after she got caught in sickbay:

"Did you not wish Gorkon dead? Let them die you said."

Now, Kirk uttered "Let them die!" at the start of the film after the briefing, there were no recording devices in the room, so how would Valeris know he said that?

The conversation was recorded by the same person who recorded footage of the Enterprise blowing up in Search for Spock and gave it to the Klingons to use in Voyage Home.