The Shining 4K UHD (1980)

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by philthehip

I still prefer the shorter cut, I feel it is a more suspseneful movie, but I don't think I could argue it is a better cut, just literally the one I prefer. I like that it is less a ghost story and more ambiguous about the source of the evil.

But again, I think the various reasons people give for their preferred cut all carry merit. It really is a shame that Warner almost silently changed the brief for the 4K release as in the Uk it was billed as both in 4K, and then yeah, it just changed without further mention, and Warner have rebuffed any questions from me, and I am sure others as to why they just flipped the screws and shafted those of us who were looking forward to the shorter cut in 4K.

Was the uk one billed as having both or was that just borne from the confusion that Warners' typically woolly press release created? (Where people even thought they were referring to the version with the original ending)

[Christian Muth]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I doubt they physically cut the OG mag tracks while the US version would continue to remain in circulation (not sure you're saying that but I'll say it anyway) but yeah, it also helped that the movie was cut A/B in visual terms because when doing the shorter version they could unpick all the dissolves and whatnot, they could create pre-print elements for the shorter cut that weren't destructive to the OG version.

That the movie wasn't re-edited at source is most likely why the short version isn't in 4K, as the negative is conformed for the longer cut. It wouldn't have taken a lot of work for Warners to digitally re-edit that scan to match the short version of coursh, but that's aksing too much!

As for version vs version, the shorter cut is what I grew up watching and thought the longer version to be rather boring when I first saw it. I've cheerleaded for the short version for years. But damn, the long version has worked its way into my brain via osmosis or some shit as when I watch the short cut now I'm like "wait, they cut THAT scene?!?".

Not the originals, I would assume they made a copy of the mag originals and cut that, but the cuts seem to be strategically placed in such a way that they could simply make the edits without having to actually remix, as pointed out in the link I shared, as well.

Like you, I also assume they made the visual cuts to an IP, which would also explain why edits are placed right before and right after dissolves in many places since they'd be baked into the IP.

Chris

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Was the uk one billed as having both or was that just borne from the confusion that Warners' typically woolly press release created? (Where people even thought they were referring to the version with the original ending)

I don't recall the press release implying that both cuts would be included, but I remember HMV saying it would.

Lol, found it:

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

From HMV:

[Christian Muth]

Originally Posted by philthehip

I still prefer the shorter cut, I feel it is a more suspseneful movie, but I don't think I could argue it is a better cut, just literally the one I prefer. I like that it is less a ghost story and more ambiguous about the source of the evil.

[Show spoiler]

But again, I think the various reasons people give for their preferred cut all carry merit. It really is a shame that Warner almost silently changed the brief for the 4K release as in the Uk it was billed as both in 4K, and then yeah, it just changed without further mention, and Warner have rebuffed any questions from me, and I am sure others as to why they just flipped the screws and shafted those of us who were looking forward to the shorter cut in 4K.

I've seen it said elsewhere that the shorter cut is "more ambiguous" re: whether the ghosts are real, but I don't see that at all. The moment

[Show spoiler]Wendy starts seeing them (not to mention the elevator full of blood)

, any ambiguity is out the window re: whether the ghosts are real or not, not to mention

[Show spoiler]Jack being let out of the locked pantry.

If anything, the short cut is a more straight-forward haunted hotel story since Jack's alcoholism and violent past is almost completely eliminated from that cut, save that one brief mention of him having previously injured Danny when he's "drinking" at the bar which comes out of nowhere in the European cut.

This discussion reminds me of when Netflix accidentally put the European cut of THE SHINING up for a while streaming here in the U.S.

Chris

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

I don't recall the press release implying that both cuts would be included, but I remember HMV saying it would.

Lol, found it:

Thanks. Even then, does such short copy say that both cuts were going to actually be *in* 4K? That was borne out from HMV looking at the preliminary cover art which included the 'extended cut' banner that Warners' PR department kept copying and pasting from the Grindelwald cover, who did the same with The Mule I seem to remember. There was never any official promise from Warners that it would have both cuts, never mind both in 4K, only an assumptive social media post from a lone retailer, so it's no wonder they've rebuffed such questions: they've got nothing to answer for and haven't "shafted" anyone.

[philthehip]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Was the uk one billed as having both or was that just borne from the confusion that Warners' typically woolly press release created? (Where people even thought they were referring to the version with the original ending)

Unfortunately I don't have the Warner page any longer after a HDD crash. I have a habit of keeping details until after release because I run a research archive for studying J.R.R. Tolkien, so I tend to grab any and all info and crosscheck it later in case there are snippets I want to keep, I do it for everything. Warner Bros. did imply that the shorter cut would be the main cut on the UK release with the extended cut suggested as a second cut, then a month (iirc) later they subtly changed the brief.

[CreasyBear]

Originally Posted by Christian Muth

I've seen it said elsewhere that the shorter cut is "more ambiguous" re: whether the ghosts are real, but I don't see that at all. The moment

[Show spoiler]Wendy starts seeing them (not to mention the elevator full of blood)

, any ambiguity is out the window re: whether the ghosts are real or not, not to mention

[Show spoiler]Jack being let out of the locked pantry.

If anything, the short cut is a more straight-forward haunted hotel story since Jack's alcoholism and violent past is almost completely eliminated from that cut, save that one brief mention of him having previously injured Danny when he's "drinking" at the bar which comes out of nowhere in the European cut.

This discussion reminds me of when Netflix accidentally put the European cut of THE SHINING up for a while streaming here in the U.S.

Chris

The blood coming out of the elevator is a vision, not real.

[philthehip]

Originally Posted by Christian Muth

I've seen it said elsewhere that the shorter cut is "more ambiguous" re: whether the ghosts are real, but I don't see that at all. The moment

[Show spoiler]Wendy starts seeing them (not to mention the elevator full of blood)

, any ambiguity is out the window re: whether the ghosts are real or not, not to mention

[Show spoiler]Jack being let out of the locked pantry.

If anything, the short cut is a more straight-forward haunted hotel story since Jack's alcoholism and violent past is almost completely eliminated from that cut, save that one brief mention of him having previously injured Danny when he's "drinking" at the bar which comes out of nowhere in the European cut.

This discussion reminds me of when Netflix accidentally put the European cut of THE SHINING up for a while streaming here in the U.S.

Chris

Well, as I said, I don't think any interpretation re: the two cuts is wrong, and it make the movie more interesting in my opinion as one can come at this movie in such different ways.

[BladeRunner2007]

Both cuts are great and both have their merits. However, I much prefer the longer US cut, as I love the atmosphere of the Overlook Hotel so much, I never want to "leave" it. The longer cut soakes me in. I can otally lose myself in it and I love every second of it. As strange as this sounds, The Shining is one of my 3 comfort movies.

[happydood]

Originally Posted by BladeRunner2007

Both cuts are great and both have their merits. However, I much prefer the longer US cut, as I love the atmosphere of the Overlook Hotel so much, I never want to "leave" it. The longer cut soakes me in. I can otally lose myself in it and I love every second of it. As strange as this sounds, The Shining is my comfort movie.

You've always been the caretaker here.

[Filmmaker]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Thanks. Even then, does such short copy say that both cuts were going to actually be *in* 4K? That was borne out from HMV looking at the preliminary cover art which included the 'extended cut' banner that Warners' PR department kept copying and pasting from the Grindelwald cover, who did the same with The Mule I seem to remember. There was never any official promise from Warners that it would have both cuts, never mind both in 4K, only an assumptive social media post from a lone retailer, so it's no wonder they've rebuffed such questions: they've got nothing to answer for and haven't "shafted" anyone.

It literally says “The release includes both…cuts of the movie for you to watch forever, and ever, and ever in beautiful HDR.” Though, yes, this may be more HMV’s fault than Warner’s.

[philthehip]

Originally Posted by Filmmaker

It literally says “The release includes both…cuts of the movie for you to watch forever, and ever, and ever in beautiful HDR.” Though, yes, this may be more HMV’s fault than Warner’s.

Yeah to be fair, Warner never said in any press-release that they were releasing both cuts in 4K, but the confusion definitely came from them though. Even down to different images and minutes reflecting different versions, plus leaning heavily toward the extended cut being included, and even after we were talking about it here, Warner persisted with the suggestion of both cuts. Then suddenly they altered it, very quietly.

It left a bad taste for me, because it didn't show much respect to Kubrick. He could have said lets have a single cut in all markets and he never did. he was happy with the two cuts. Warner should have made the effort and released both in 4K.

The UK reading (on the Warner shop) as 4K UHD + Blu-Ray + Extended Edition is very clearly not what we got. The image existed based on the info Warner gave to whoever produced the images, so therefore Warner misled us.

[Christian Muth]

Originally Posted by CreasyBear

The blood coming out of the elevator is a vision, not real.

The point being, she is suddenly seeing the same things that Danny was seeing in his premonitions. There is no "ambiguity" in either cut of THE SHINING- the supernatural happenings are supposed to be real.

Chris

[philthehip]

Originally Posted by Christian Muth

The point being, she is suddenly seeing the same things that Danny was seeing in his premonitions. There is no "ambiguity" in either cut of THE SHINING- the supernatural happenings are supposed to be real.

Chris

Thank you for interpreting the movie for us

Could you watch that new Northman for me? It looks shite but it apparently has some nods to Tolkien I might be interested in. Appreciate it man.

[KubrickKurasawa]

Originally Posted by philthehip

Thank you for interpreting the movie for us

Could you watch that new Northman for me? It looks shite but it apparently has some nods to Tolkien I might be interested in. Appreciate it man.

Danny and Halloran love burnt toast, and ice cream.

[B25]

Brits liking the shorter cut of The Shining is akin to Yanks liking the US versions of Beatles albums. I suppose it makes sense if that's what you grew up with, but come on!

[MechaGodzilla]

Originally Posted by B25

Brits liking the shorter cut of The Shining is akin to Yanks liking the US versions of Beatles albums. I suppose it makes sense if that's what you grew up with, but come on!

Hey, it's not just the Brits! The rest of us Europeans got that cut, too.

To be honest, I don't really know which version I prefer. I don't watch this film often enough.

[KevinStriker]

Originally Posted by Christian Muth

I read an account, I believe from Leon Vitali, that Warner Brothers asked Kubrick to cut the film down to a more "commercial" length for the European release after THE SHINING "underperformed" at the U.S. box office (it was a hit, but not the blockbuster they wanted), and Kubrick obliged, so it wasn't some big artistic decision on his part, it was purely for commercial considerations, and he never heard Kubrick give a preference for either version. I find it very interesting that the Euro cut comes in at just under 2-hours, a certifiable "commercial" length, and also the cuts were made in such a way that the film didn't require any remixing. They were able to just cut the mixed mag tracks. They discuss that in the link at the bottom of this post. That suggests that Kubrick was looking to cut down the length in the most economical way possible, not necessarily making profound artistic choices in his recut. He was making the cuts in such a way that simply cutting the existing mixed mag tracks could be done without there being abrupt, jarring sound edits audible (although the removal of Wendy seeing the room of skeletons does lead to a bit of a "stutter" in the music track).

I much prefer the longer edit, but there are a couple cuts to the European version that I find effective and an improvement. In particular, the hard cut from Wendy saying "It's just a matter of settling back into the habit of writing every day" and Jack's reaction, directly to the camera slowly pulling back from his ignored typewriter in the Colorado Lounge while he throws the tennis balls against the wall works beautifully. But on the whole, the longer U.S. cut is better IMO.

https://blah-ray.blogspot.com/search...D%20%281980%29

Chris

One I always cite is Tony showing Danny the vision of blood, and once the blood splashes over the camera lens and into a black screen, we get a hard cut to CLOSING DAY

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by MechaGodzilla

I don't watch this film often enough.

Damn Swede.

[MechaGodzilla]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

Damn Swede.

Now I want to put on a bear suit and go fellate someone.