TONIGHT Is The Night To Email Your State's Attorney General

[beatboy77]

Tonight we got confirmation that Toshiba paid Paramount to not release on the Blu-ray format anymore. Seems like this may possibly be an illegal act by both companies.

I am going to email my State Attorney General's office tonight with excerpts from the article and try to get a legal clarification about the legalities of this "deal." I do feel we the consumers were the victims of a "bait and switch" type business scheme on the part of Paramount. Paramount made official announcements and participated in active marketing of Blu-ray products and then just suddenly pulled the plug. It can be understandable that many people bought Blu-ray products based on the promises of Paramount.

I encourage you guys to email your State Attorney Generals as well with questions about the legalities of this "deal."

~Josh

[Escalus]

What about us Canadians!

[beatboy77]

Originally Posted by Escalus

What about us Canadians!

You should email your government's legal departments in the same manner. Heck an International investigation sounds like a GREAT idea!

~Josh

[dialog_gvf]

Competition Bureau Canada

Competition Act

Gary

[Existentialist]

Originally Posted by beatboy77

I am going to email my State Attorney General's office tonight with excerpts from the article...

~Josh

Sorry if I missed something but can you provide a link to this article...thanks

[BluDrew]

Originally Posted by beatboy77

Tonight we got confirmation that Toshiba paid Paramount to not release on the Blu-ray format anymore. Seems like this may possibly be an illegal act by both companies.

I am going to email my State Attorney General's office tonight with excerpts from the article and try to get a legal clarification about the legalities of this "deal." I do feel we the consumers were the victims of a "bait and switch" type business scheme on the part of Paramount. Paramount made official announcements and participated in active marketing of Blu-ray products and then just suddenly pulled the plug. It can be understandable that many people bought Blu-ray products based on the promises of Paramount.

I encourage you guys to email your State Attorney Generals as well with questions about the legalities of this "deal."

~Josh

BB, this happens all the time, it's called business. It'll happen with Blu-ray and HD DVD and Burger King and Taco Bell... If we try to run around getting them to investigate HD DVD they'll turn around and start investigating Blu-ray too and will want the books opened to examine the Disney, Fox, Blockbuster and Target deals. I think you're barking up the wrong tree. Best thing to do is just go out and support Blu-ray! You ever stop to think that maybe TONIGHT is the night for you to take a break?

And which article were you referring to anyway?

[ReduxInflux]

where is this article and what laws were violated?

[EricJ]

Originally Posted by beatboy77

Tonight we got confirmation that Toshiba paid Paramount to not release on the Blu-ray format anymore. Seems like this may possibly be an illegal act by both companies.
I am going to email my State Attorney General's office tonight with excerpts from the article and try to get a legal clarification about the legalities of this "deal."
We will get back to Mrs. Avery on Thursday night and inform her of the many emails to various state's Attorney Generals.

(Obscure Twilight Zone in-joke: )
...Or what, you're going to make Toshiba two feet tall at 4 o'clock?

("I have evidence that you are evil--I repeat, Evil, Mrs. Avery."
Sheesh, and I thought I was spending too much time on this board!)

[Papi4baby]

While i see why you choose to do this, good luck getting anything to happen. It is the way companies operate. Illegal you say yes, but they will just write it off as incentives or some other bs and get away with it. Plus there's no proof.

P.S. Internet hear say is not proof.

[BluDrew]

Originally Posted by ReduxInflux

where is this article and what laws were violated?

Far as I know no laws were violated. Paramount gave their reasons (as much as I disagree with them) and also had some good incentives apparently to support HD DVD exclusively. BD can survive without Paramount anyway as far as I'm concerned.

[MouseRider]

Interestingly, there is nothing new about this type of deal, right or wrong.

A few years ago, DTS did something similar by providing assistance and incentives to studios who were willing to add DTS soundtracks to their DVD releases & highlight them on the packaging.

[Fozziwig]

Originally Posted by MouseRider

Interestingly, there is nothing new about this type of deal, right or wrong.

A few years ago, DTS did something similar by providing assistance and incentives to studios who were willing to add DTS soundtracks to their DVD releases & highlight them on the packaging.

Would you be good enough to post examples where DTS paid a company to stop putting Dolby soundtracks on DVD's?

Or any example where one company paid another company to immediately cease production of a competitors product (even though the company being paid was doing better with that product than the one it was going to continue with).

Some of you are saying this happens all the time so let's see the examples please.

[tumbleweeds blow through]

You see, paying for additional promotion, incentives, prominent placing in store, preferential advertising is one thing. Paying a company to stop production of a competitors product because you don't like it is something else.

[MouseRider]

Unfortunately, you cannot stop putting Dolby soundtracks on DVDs, because DD is part of the DVD standard.

Notice I said "similar" and not "exactly like". I made the comparison based on the fact that an incentive was given to get a company to do something that, left of their own devices, they might not have.

[GasCat]

It is your choice if you want to create a consumer complaint. You are paying people to work for your interests as a consumer.

Add your state to following search words and find the person to send your complaint:
Consumer protection state

California
http://www.dca.ca.gov/consumer/complaints.shtml
http://www.dca.ca.gov/online_service...omplaint.shtml

Conneticut
http://www.ct.gov/dcp/site/default.asp

New York
http://www.consumer.state.ny.us/

New Jersey - Office of Consumer Protection
http://www.njconsumeraffairs.gov/ocp.htm

From Pennsylvania:
http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/consumers.aspx?id=255

By law, the Attorney General's Bureau of Consumer Protection is authorized to perform the following duties:

Investigate commercial and trade practices in the distribution, financing and furnishing of goods and services for the use of consumers;
Conduct studies, investigations and research into matters affecting consumer interests and make such information available to the public;
Advise the Legislature on matters affecting consumer interests, including the development of policies and the proposal of programs to protect consumers;
Investigate fraud and deception in the sale, servicing and furnishing of goods and products, and strive to eliminate such illegal actions;
Promote consumer education and publicize matters relating to consumer fraud, deception and misrepresentation.

[Fozziwig]

Originally Posted by MouseRider

Unfortunately, you cannot stop putting Dolby soundtracks on DVDs, because DD is part of the DVD standard.

Notice I said "similar" and not "exactly like". I made the comparison based on the fact that an incentive was given to get a company to do something that, left of their own devices, they might not have.

I find your definition of recent events extremely generous to P/DW & Toshiba (AKA Microsoft). Perhaps you would consider acting as their defence council?

It seems as though you accept that Toshiba have paid another company to stop completely production, promotion & distribution of a product that Toshiba are in competition with. However, you think this all perfectly normal and happens all the time?

On the Dolby argument (as you missed my hypothetical point), let's reverse it then. In your world it would be perfectly acceptable for Dolby to pay large sums of money to studios to stop putting DTS tracks on DVD's. That would be an equivalent example of the P/DW deal.

[Lord_Stewie]

Originally Posted by beatboy77

Tonight we got confirmation that Toshiba paid Paramount to not release on the Blu-ray format anymore. Seems like this may possibly be an illegal act by both companies.

I am going to email my State Attorney General's office tonight with excerpts from the article and try to get a legal clarification about the legalities of this "deal." I do feel we the consumers were the victims of a "bait and switch" type business scheme on the part of Paramount. Paramount made official announcements and participated in active marketing of Blu-ray products and then just suddenly pulled the plug. It can be understandable that many people bought Blu-ray products based on the promises of Paramount.

I encourage you guys to email your State Attorney Generals as well with questions about the legalities of this "deal."

~Josh

In the US companies have the rights to compete freely, almost most of business deals done are illegal anywhere else, but the US. and regarding the email, I won't waste time writing one. for two reasons.
1) It is a business act, accepted by the USA rules and regulations.
2) whats done is done, and nothing can be done about it.

I although value your idea and thought regarding this matter, BUT THERE IS NO POINT TO IT. This deal wouldn't have taken place if it wasn't acceptable by the US business Rules and Regulations.

corporate deals are done every day, even if you don't hear about it on the news. I mean Miramax was bought out by disney wasn't it. if not here is a link about disney buying out ABC in 1995.
http://www.seeing-stars.com/Studios/DisneyStudios.shtml

[GasCat]

Originally Posted by shadblz

In the US companies have the rights to compete freely, almost most of business deals done are illegal anywhere else, but the US. and regarding the email, I won't waste time writing one. for two reasons.
1) It is a business act, accepted by the USA rules and regulations.
2) whats done is done, and nothing can be done about it.

I although value your idea and thought regarding this matter, BUT THERE IS NO POINT TO IT. This deal wouldn't have taken place if it wasn't acceptable by the US business Rules and Regulations.

corporate deals are done every day, even if you don't hear about it on the news. I mean Miramax was bought out by disney wasn't it. if not here is a link about disney buying out ABC in 1995.
http://www.seeing-stars.com/Studios/DisneyStudios.shtml

1. How do you know that? You don't even know what the deal was.
2. Completely wrong, I guess I have lived a bit longer than yourself. Things go down in business which are later found to be illegal every day.

ABC/Miramax was a merger that was approved of by the government. This was not Universal purchasing Paramount. It was <Mystery Company> pays Paramount.

Paramount is a subsidiary of Viacom which is a publically traded company. Have you ever heard of business transparency? The reason for transparency is to make investors feel secure. They are not the Pentagon, it has to show up on their balance sheet.

Here is a big problem. If you as a consumer can not count on companies to act independently of one another then there will be a breakdown at the consumer level. People will be afraid to make purchases of goods.

Companies listen to their customers and are driven by customer needs. That's what capitalism is all about. We are the "invisible hand" which decides if a product is successful or a failure. This deal is closer to communism where decisions are made for the consumer.

Consumer protection.
Let's say you bought a HDTV. Tomorrow you wake up and 6 manufacturers are only going to produce the "SuperHDTV". They also paid money to cable companies who agree to only air "SuperHDTV" shows. Your HDTV is now worthless. This scenario will not happen, you know why? The FCC protects you and other companies from from such a thing happening.

We lost a few bucks due to this transaction. The discs we have are a little bit harder to get rid of compared to before. Retailers losses are nuch higher. All the planning that went into the movie releases, the transactions which must now be reversed because the pre-releases not coming, etc. Collectively, it likely goes into the millions. Blu-Ray manufacturers can't be forgot when it comes to lost revenue. This isn't an "oh well" thing for many of these companies.

I guess you never saw David Horowitz's "Fight Back". "I can't take five minutes to write a letter to someone who is working for me." That is seriously sad, my friend.

[Lord_Stewie]

Originally Posted by GasCat

1. How do you know that? You don't even know what the deal was.
2. Completely wrong, I guess I have lived a bit longer than yourself. Things go down in business which are later found to be illegal every day.

ABC/Miramax was a merger that was approved of by the government. This was not Universal purchasing Paramount. It was <Mystery Company> pays Paramount.

Paramount is a subsidiary of Viacom which is a publically traded company. Have you ever heard of business transparency? The reason for transparency is to make investors feel secure. They are not the Pentagon, it has to show up on their balance sheet.

Here is a big problem. If you as a consumer can not count on companies to act independently of one another then there will be a breakdown at the consumer level. People will be afraid to make purchases of goods.

Companies listen to their customers and are driven by customer needs. That's what capitalism is all about. We are the "invisible hand" which decides if a product is successful or a failure. This deal is closer to communism where decisions are made for the consumer.

Consumer protection.
Let's say you bought a HDTV. Tomorrow you wake up and 6 manufacturers are only going to produce the "SuperHDTV". They also paid money to cable companies who agree to only air "SuperHDTV" shows. Your HDTV is now worthless. This scenario will not happen, you know why? The FCC protects you and other companies from from such a thing happening.

We lost a few bucks due to this transaction. The discs we have are a little bit harder to get rid of compared to before. Retailers losses are nuch higher. All the planning that went into the movie releases, the transactions which must now be reversed because the pre-releases not coming, etc. Collectively, it likely goes into the millions. Blu-Ray manufacturers can't be forgot when it comes to lost revenue. This isn't an "oh well" thing for many of these companies.

I guess you never saw David Horowitz's "Fight Back". "I can't take five minutes to write a letter to someone who is working for me." That is seriously sad, my friend.

I understand what you are saying to me, but hypothetically speaking, lets say we go ahead and contest, emails, boycotting, protesting, and complain. nothing will be done about it. I am an employee of National amusements which is owned by Viacom. as an employee, i am not happy of the decision paramount made. BUT ITS DONE. when talking about "fighting back." it doesn't necessarily means by emailing them. I am fighting back daily, if not, then weekly, by purchasing BD disc, i have made a statement that is my allegiance and loyalty goes to BD. Tell me how many times MS commited such an unfair deal. even if it is illigal there is always a loophole to get around to it. check this link for example: http://money.cnn.com/2007/08/24/maga...ion=2007082417

after all it is business, and businesses such as paramount/dreamworks will go after where they think the money is. in this case since they are getting incentives, even with knowing the fact that BD is better they forgot their BD supporters and still WENT for it.

[beatboy77]

Guys,

I appreciate the many posts in this thread offering both sides of the possible legalities of this deal. However what makes this deal a bit different then most is this:

Toshiba paid Paramount to stop producing for its competitor, Blu-ray (BDA).

This to me this seems like a violation of anti-trust and competitor laws. I may be wrong though as I am not an attorney.

I am just saying it may be in our best interest to fire off an email to each of our respective State's Attorney Generals to question this "deal." We have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

I sent my email last night. Who else has done the same?

~Josh

[Existentialist]

Josh,

Could you please provide a link to this article. No offense, but I would like to read it myself and draw my own conclusion before making wild accusations to my AG.

Thanks,

Exi