Poll: Should Sony use DTS-HD Master Audio or Dolby TrueHD? - Page 80 - Blu-ray Forum

ClaytonMG · 07-16-2009, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ganthc

You know, I think that they never changed the decoder then, because that same condition plagued ALL the hd-dvd players I had (hd-a2, hd-a35, and hd-xa2). That's not to say that DD+ tracks were terrible, but they were obviously not as good as lossless audio, unless the master itself was just weak to begin with (like Liar, Liar was not going to be that much better in DTS-HDMA). Still, I noticed that DD+ really didn't have the bass punch that comes with DTS, and this is with sound leveling.

Interesting... I was level matching too and I noticed the same thing. I don't have any Dolby Digital Plus audio tracks I could test on Blu-ray (there's not much a point to them) so it's hard to say what's causing it. But I will say I noticed a larger difference between DD+ and DTS than I did between DD at 640kbps and DTS at 1.5mbps which shouldn't really be the case unless it's more the mixes than the codecs...

davcole · 07-16-2009, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClaytonMG

I test U-571 (after hooking my HD DVD player back up in the theater room)... The DTS track on the HD DVD had better bass response and sounded more solid to me. The DD+ track seemed to be lacking in the low deep bass and the surrounds didn't seem quite as loud. It's really making me think that my HD DVD player isn't decoding DD+ properly. And then of course the DTS-HD MA on the Blu-ray was better than the DTS track on the HD DVD.

That was my finding as well when I had the HD DVD of U-571. I remember being more impressed with the DTS. Then of course when I got the DTS-MA, it was a noticeable improvement.

ganthc · 07-16-2009, 07:27 PM

I do keep my hd-xa2 hooked up because it does offer the best upconversion for dvds on the occasions I do watch them (i.e. watching TV shows through Netflix, like The Wire). I have to say that picture quality was never the problem with hd-dvd, but the audio was never as good as blu-ray, mainly due to the use of DD+. However, when they used TrueHD, it was just as good (Bourne Ultimatum was a delight in TrueHD) as blu-ray. I haven't had a chance to really go through the Bourne movies yet to see comparisons. I am interested in maybe doing a comparison between DTS core (disabling the decoding of DTS-HDMA) and DD+ on the first two Bourne movies. They should be the same master.

PeterTHX · 07-16-2009, 09:22 PM

Does the XA-2 transcode to DTS?

Are you decoding to PCM? What speaker setup are you using (all set to large, etc). DRC?

It sounds like a bug in the decoder, not applying the proper LFE level to DD+ soundtracks.
I remember there were firmware updates to address the issue.

Other sites that reviewed these DD+ titles preferred them to either the DD or DTS DVD versions.

ganthc · 07-16-2009, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Does the XA-2 transcode to DTS?

Are you decoding to PCM? What speaker setup are you using (all set to large, etc). DRC?

It sounds like a bug in the decoder, not applying the proper LFE level to DD+ soundtracks.
I remember there were firmware updates to address the issue.

Other sites that reviewed these DD+ titles preferred them to either the DD or DTS DVD versions.

In all cases, the player did the decoding and output the audio as PCM. There was no bitstreaming involved. And I would agree that the decoder was probably the problem, but each player had the latest firmware update and the problem still existed. Granted, I am not saying that the audio was DVD level here, but there were noticeable differences even when you cranked up the sound between the formats.

ClaytonMG · 07-17-2009, 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Does the XA-2 transcode to DTS?

Are you decoding to PCM? What speaker setup are you using (all set to large, etc). DRC?

It sounds like a bug in the decoder, not applying the proper LFE level to DD+ soundtracks.
I remember there were firmware updates to address the issue.

Other sites that reviewed these DD+ titles preferred them to either the DD or DTS DVD versions.

Mine was decoding to PCM connected over HDMI. I do remember the firmware upgrades. But I don't exactly trust Toshiba with them. Pretty much every one of my combo discs froze up in certain spots, until firmware upgrade 2.00. After that, they all worked fine until the next firmware upgrade. Now they're all back to freezing up in the same spots. So maybe at one time it was corrected, but then they changed something again and it quit working? Not sure... But it is seeming like LFE isn't being properly applied to DD+ on my HD DVD player or some sort of bug close to that.

trans22 · 07-17-2009, 07:26 PM

I read the post by PENTONMAN saying that we would see this fall if SONY will be changing to DTS, I want to ask if anybody knows if SONY will be changing and if they are what do you think the first title will be that they will release?

BozQ · 07-17-2009, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trans22

I read the post by PENTONMAN saying that we would see this fall if SONY will be changing to DTS, I want to ask if anybody knows if SONY will be changing and if they are what do you think the first title will be that they will release?

You see, Sony?
Before you even announced anything in black and white, people are already excited and looking forward to seeing a change to DTS-HD in future releases.

What are you waiting for?

saprano · 07-17-2009, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trans22

I read the post by PENTONMAN saying that we would see this fall if SONY will be changing to DTS, I want to ask if anybody knows if SONY will be changing and if they are what do you think the first title will be that they will release?

There is no if. they are going to DTS. thats why he said we will be seeing the results in movies this fall. there would be no results to see in any movie if they weren't changing anything.

In my opinion anyway.

Scorxpion · 07-17-2009, 08:59 PM

Angels and Deamons is a good start,and i bet on it will be a first title or a sign shifting toward DtsHD master audio.

PeterTHX · 07-18-2009, 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BozQ

You see, Sony?
Before you even announced anything in black and white, people are already excited and looking forward to seeing a change to DTS-HD in future releases.

What are you waiting for?

Hmmm...Angels & Demons in DTS vs Star Trek in TrueHD...

Watchmen in DTS vs Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen in TrueHD...

Now who's going to sell more copies?

Good, popular titles sell more copies, not codecs. UP will sell well, and not because it's in DTS-HD.

will0775 · 07-18-2009, 11:48 AM

Good point.

D · 07-20-2009, 08:18 PM

Well, it seems that judging from the titles coming from Sony, that they decided to stay with True HD?

BozQ · 07-20-2009, 09:55 PM

It won't matter. As long as their movies are good, I'll get it.
Besides, I can trust Sony quite easily that their Audio and Video are mostly good. There are plenty of review sites and forums to get feedback too.

KubrickFan · 07-20-2009, 10:01 PM

These types of decisions take a while to be fully implemented, most discs take at least a couple of months to be released. It took a while for Warner to release all their movies with lossless audio as well.

saprano · 07-21-2009, 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Good, popular titles sell more copies, not codecs. UP will sell well, and not because it's in DTS-HD.

UP is DTS-MA? isn't that dreamworks?

Quote:

Originally Posted by db01

Well, it seems that judging from the titles coming from Sony, that they decided to stay with True HD?

The new titles coming in september probably were already done a long time ago waiting for release. penton said fall so maby after november? i dont know.

saprano · 07-21-2009, 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Watchmen in DTS vs Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen in TrueHD...

The watchmen has a excellent DTS track according to many reviews. transformers has yet to be released.

Anthony P · 07-21-2009, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saprano

UP is DTS-MA? isn't that dreamworks?

no Pixar

ClaytonMG · 07-21-2009, 02:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saprano

The watchmen has a excellent DTS track according to many reviews. transformers has yet to be released.

He meant as far as sales since DTS doesn't really help sales. (I am sure it does help sales, just probably about as much as Dolby does.)

davcole · 07-21-2009, 04:03 AM

I'm not sure I by the fact that DTSMA improves sales. While some have a preference for DTSMA and feels it has a sonic advantage, I don't see anyone passing over a wanted film just cause it's coded in TRUEHD.

No, I don't think the studios reasoning is for improves sonics or supposedly superior codec.

View Poll Results: Should SPE Drop Dolby TrueHD and use DTS-HD Master Audio?
Yes, Drop TrueHD for DTS-HD MA	899	58.76%
No, I like things the way they are	152	9.93%
Wouldn't matter to me either way	450	29.41%
Other	29	1.90%
Voters: 1530. You may not vote on this poll

07-21-2009, 04:03 AM	#1600
davcole Power Member Member since:Aug 2007 Location:Cincinnati, Oh 4K collection:138 Blu-ray collection:407 Digital collection:25 Blu-ray reviews: 146 Trading Score:9	I'm not sure I by the fact that DTSMA improves sales. While some have a preference for DTSMA and feels it has a sonic advantage, I don't see anyone passing over a wanted film just cause it's coded in TRUEHD. No, I don't think the studios reasoning is for improves sonics or supposedly superior codec. Last edited by davcole; 07-21-2009 at 11:34 AM.

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07-16-2009, 07:27 PM	#1583
ganthc Active Member Member since:Sep 2007 Location:Vienna, VA 4K collection:17 Blu-ray collection:651 Blu-ray reviews:2	I do keep my hd-xa2 hooked up because it does offer the best upconversion for dvds on the occasions I do watch them (i.e. watching TV shows through Netflix, like The Wire). I have to say that picture quality was never the problem with hd-dvd, but the audio was never as good as blu-ray, mainly due to the use of DD+. However, when they used TrueHD, it was just as good (Bourne Ultimatum was a delight in TrueHD) as blu-ray. I haven't had a chance to really go through the Bourne movies yet to see comparisons. I am interested in maybe doing a comparison between DTS core (disabling the decoding of DTS-HDMA) and DD+ on the first two Bourne movies. They should be the same master.

07-16-2009, 09:22 PM	#1584
PeterTHX Banned Top contributor Member since:Sep 2006 Blu-ray collection:563 Trading Score:14	Does the XA-2 transcode to DTS? Are you decoding to PCM? What speaker setup are you using (all set to large, etc). DRC? It sounds like a bug in the decoder, not applying the proper LFE level to DD+ soundtracks. I remember there were firmware updates to address the issue. Other sites that reviewed these DD+ titles preferred them to either the DD or DTS DVD versions.

07-17-2009, 07:26 PM	#1587
trans22 Active Member Member since:May 2009 Location:united kingdom 4K collection:6 Blu-ray collection:87 Blu-ray reviews:9	I read the post by PENTONMAN saying that we would see this fall if SONY will be changing to DTS, I want to ask if anybody knows if SONY will be changing and if they are what do you think the first title will be that they will release?

07-17-2009, 08:59 PM	#1590
Scorxpion Blu-ray Guru Member since:Dec 2006 Location:Middle East,Lebanon Blu-ray collection:57	Angels and Deamons is a good start,and i bet on it will be a first title or a sign shifting toward DtsHD master audio.

07-18-2009, 11:48 AM	#1592
will0775 Member Member since:May 2008 Location:miami,fl Home Theater Gallery:29 Blu-ray collection:101	Good point.

07-20-2009, 08:18 PM	#1593
D Blu-ray Ninja Top contributor Member since:Feb 2008 Location:Roaming the Highlands Home Theater Gallery:1 Blu-ray reviews:1	Well, it seems that judging from the titles coming from Sony, that they decided to stay with True HD?

07-20-2009, 09:55 PM	#1594
BozQ Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Jun 2007 Location:Singapore 4K collection:- Blu-ray collection:-	It won't matter. As long as their movies are good, I'll get it. Besides, I can trust Sony quite easily that their Audio and Video are mostly good. There are plenty of review sites and forums to get feedback too.

07-20-2009, 10:01 PM	#1595
KubrickFan Blu-ray Samurai Top contributor Member since:Mar 2009 Blu-ray collection:319	These types of decisions take a while to be fully implemented, most discs take at least a couple of months to be released. It took a while for Warner to release all their movies with lossless audio as well.

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