"Right out of the box, this is a noticeably well-built player..."
Picture Quality:
Quote:
"So, here’s the big question: Does the Panny deliver the goods in picture quality? Quite simply, it certainly does. I decided to start my viewing on a down note with “The Fifth Element”. The Panasonic proves that the problem with this disc was the transfer and not Blu-Ray technology. All the same source problems that were detected on the Samsung player were present on the Panasonic. However, colors seemed to be better represented on the Panasonic and there was a definite increase in sharpness. There was slightly more of that 3D HD effect during the movie than on the Samsung. Overall, the picture seemed slightly more rich. I also didn’t really notice too much macroblocking. As a matter of fact, I only detected it once during the course of the move during a very hectic fight scene. On the Samsung, I noticed macroblocking much more frequently. Of course, all the dirt and grime on the print is still there on the Panasonic. It is still a very imperfect transfer and a sub-par entry for blu-ray, but the Panasonic did a nice job of making the good parts look slightly better.
I moved on from there to “Eight Below” which is included with the player. Now, this is what HD is all about! From moment one the Panasonic really impressed me. Colors were spot on without a hint of oversaturation. Whites never bloomed and blacks were rock solid. I noticed a small amount of film grain that was consistent with how a filmed piece is supposed to look. It was never distracting and very naturally presented. Fine details (The fur on the dogs) were immaculately rendered."
Well, the pictures of the unit itself are so dark no details can be made out of them. The pictures of the menus looks alright. Obviously, taking pictures of a television screen to show the playback isn't exactly the greatest way to judge anything either, but I appreciate his effort.
I think there was a thread on here where someone posted links to pics of the Panny (pre-releases) that were much better.
Last edited by GoldenRedux; 10-11-2006 at 05:45 PM.
Picture quality. I read the 1st review and I can tell you between this review and several other reviews of movies and the picture quality I have lost all respect for these reviewers. They are either being paid off, blind or have no idea what is going on. This along with using displays that are not even capable of producing the image resolutions needed. I can say that the Panasonic displays a great picture, better than the Samsung.
Okay, first impressions: player is a beauty out of the box. The remote is definitely not the greatest, though. The menu arrow pad doubles as a jog-shuttle dial, reminding me of an iPod. Jog-shuttle can be disabled in the setup menu. Boot and load time seems a bit slower than the August-built Samsung I had (which might itself be faster than the launch players), but definitely faster than the Toshiba. I found that the player is prone to some of the same HDMI handshake wackiness as the Toshiba, although nowhere near as jarring. The Samsung is better in this regard because with my set-up, I can switch to another source and not lose the HDMI connection with the Samsung. With the Toshiba and the Panasonic, I lose that connection. The Toshiba stops playback immediately and there is no resume play, which sucks big-time. The Panasonic continues playback when you switch sources away from it, but stops playback when you come back to it. Luckily, though, it DOES have resume play, making the player better than the Tosh in this regard. (Receiver, BTW, is a Pioneer Elite VSX-82TXS.)
Setup menus are pretty simple to use and navigate through. I like that you can set up DD, DD+ and DTS independently from each other, unlike the Samsung with its global audio output setting. Unlike the Samsung, PCM can be output as multichannel PCM, even though the player may be set for bitstream. (You don't have to go into the settings and change output to PCM in order to hear it like you do with the Samsung.) Unlike the Samsung, with its colored dots or hourglass, a simple message pops up "Now loading," which can be disabled. Also unlike the Samsung, 4:3 material can be setup to pillarbox or zoom automatically. And lastly, unlike the Samsung, the blue light on the front panel can be turned off by setting the display to "dim." Nice. (Believe me, dim is still pretty bright, especially in a dark room. Bright setting is ridiculously bright, and you'll want to turn that down.)
(And Chris, I didn't see anywhere a display for video codec. Sorry!)
With the Samsung, the resolution of the player would sometimes change alternately between 1080p and 1080i during the handshake process, probably because of some weirdness with EDID and being passed through my receiver. I could never figure out why exactly. It's almost as if an auto resolution setting was overriding whatever choice I made in the setup menu, except that the Sammy doesn't have an auto setting. I like that the Panasonic has that auto setting, but also offers a manual selection. I can set my resolution manually and never have to worry about it switching on its own again. Nice!
Now for the good stuff: PQ. I have a Samsung HL-S6187 1080p DLP, and I'm sitting about 10-11 feet back. Previously, I thought I had a modded Samsung player with NR chip off because I swore I had better PQ over the launch player I tried. (I also had the colored dots and 4:3 pillarbox rather than the launch player's hourglass and 4:3 stretch.) I'm pretty sure now that the player I thought had improved PQ, in fact, doesn't. The Panasonic made Underworld:Evolution and even Lord of War pop with a crisp, super-detailed picture. It definitely felt like the PQ we were all expecting back in June. Extremely pleased. I also tried Corpse Bride, and immediately noticed the infamous posterization on the Warner Bros. logo was diminished substantially. There was still some posterization on the end fade out, but definitely an improvement over the Samsung. Tears of the Sun looked even more razor-sharp than before, if you can believe it. On Good Night and Good Luck, a weird peculiarity. With the Samsung, I had no menu selection highlight on the special features page, and every time I made a move with the remote, I'd get the red stop symbol. No such problems with the Panasonic, to my relief. Generally, I felt that PQ was improved over the Sammy-- not a huge, earth-shattering difference, but I'd really like to see if Peter Bracke and other critics feel compelled to reevaluate their PQ criticisms and revise their scores slightly upward as a result of this player.
One thing I don't feel comfortable commenting on is noise or grain levels, as I don't always expect a super-clean image like Revenge of the Sith or Chronicle of Riddick. I am much more concerned about apparent detail in the image, and I feel that there is definitely more detail in the Panasonic's image than the Samsung's. (And if you're a Samsung owner, don't fret. Just get that firmware upgraded!)
Another area I'm not comfortable commenting on is audio. I just don't think I have as discerning an ear as others. To me, DD and DTS are more than adequate, and they sound great on this player. I've spent time bouncing between DD+ and DTHD on some HD DVDs and cannot for the life of me hear any difference. And although PCM sounds great, there seems to be some deep bass missing on Underworld:Evolution in Marcus' voice when he interrogates Kraven that's definitely there on the DD track. I noticed the same thing on the Sammy. I understand the idea of lossless codecs and why that is more desirable in theory, but I guess practical benefits of lossless audio is one of those areas where YMMV, depending on your equipment, type of connection, hearing ability, etc. I am sending away for the DTHD and DTS-HD firmware upgrade, but if I never knew about it, I doubt I'd miss it.
In the box, there's a mail-in card for that firmware upgrade, another sheet of paper directing you to a Panasonic website for BD-J firmware download (which I haven't looked for yet), an extended warranty offer that I will look into, a free copy of Eight Below which shockingly looked and sounded amazing, and the offer for Great Raid and Gone in 60 Seconds. The Disney offer can be completed online with the player's serial number, and the card claims one week delivery. We'll see.
All in all, an improvement over the Samsung and a step in the right direction. Yes, it's pricey, but if you shop around or wait for 12% coupons from BB, like I did, you definitely won't regret it.
In hindsight, I'd have to say the June launch was a bit of a stop-gap or a dry run. With this player and the Sony and Sharp players due later this month, as well as the PS3 and the coming of the BD50, this format war is officially on. Blu-Ray has finally shown up in numbers-- better late than never.
Thanks for the thoughts and the confirm. If I knew whether the Sony would display codecs or not, I'd be able to make a decision now of what to buy.
The June launch has been talked about as a stopgap measure in a number of circles and it's pretty apparent based on software alone. Sony didn't have that much really ready or many players to test it against and the lack of product from other distributors besides lionsgate for awhile kept the idea that Q4 is where it will all really begin.
It can be called "moving the goalpost", but in the long run - or hell, by january - this past June will not be a memory for me anymore. I'll have a choice of a number of solid players and lots of great looking software.
I do hope that HD Digest does go back and re-evaluate with the Panny though; they did it for HD DVD when the TrueHD upgrade came out. They should do it with a better player here.
I do hope that HD Digest does go back and re-evaluate with the Panny though; they did it for HD DVD when the TrueHD upgrade came out. They should do it with a better player here.
Beautiful Dreamers....
They are one sided over there, I wouldn't count on it.
You bastard!!!! Now I want one!!! Interesting on how you think maybe your Samsung didnt have DNR off after all.... Did you get rid of the Sammy?? I would like a review of PQ comparison after this firmware comes!!!
Thanks!! Enjoy!!!
I returned the Sammy and got the Panny. Sorry, the only comparisons I can do between the two are in my mind. But as I told my friend, if you're liking the Sammy PQ now, then you'll probably love it after that firmware upgrade!
I returned the Sammy and got the Panny. Sorry, the only comparisons I can do between the two are in my mind. But as I told my friend, if you're liking the Sammy PQ now, then you'll probably love it after that firmware upgrade!
Nice to know that we have a good blu-ray player. If we can get blu-ray movies in the 50GB size, then everything looked good. Reading the review on the panny player, the player looked like it was built well and nice to see that it supports 7.1 surround sound. I think with out a doubt that October is and will be the month for blu-ray to finally start taking shape.
Oh, BTW, I know this will be corrected soon on the Samsung, but it sure is nice to be able to play DTS tracks without the frame-drop glitch.
And here's a gripe about the Panny that I didn't mention before, albeit it it's a small one: the front display only shows the current time position in the movie and nothing else. No chapters, titles, resolution, etc., that you've come to expect on a front display. Minor gripe, and you can hit the OSD button and get that information there anyway.
Another gripe: the remote doesn't have an eject button and the front lid on the player isn't motorized. (I see this as a related gripe.) Again, not a huge deal, but still needed to be said.
Got mine this afternoon and have spent less than an hour playing with it.
So far, very pleased. Very minor quibbles for the most part. I actually like the remote once you adjust to the layout, but I have to say, don't most of us who are really into this have specialized universal remotes we program anyway? I love my MX-500 and don't really care what comes with a playback device.
The lack of an eject button threw me at first but with it basically being a safety precaution against ejecting when the front panel is up, it's not something I really complain about. The plus of the panel, for me as a parent, outweighs the extra minor effort of flipping that down before ejecting via the front panel. Having no buttons on the front means it's less of a draw for my 4 and 6 year old kids.
Did some A/B comparisons on Fifth Element on the scene where Leeloo escapes to the building exterior. It looks a touch sharper but what's more noticeable I think is the vibrancy and pop of the colors. The yellow in her hair is much more vibrant here and the taxi's going by are stronger. Not a huge improvement but I wasn't expecting one since this is a flawed transfer.
Eight Below however is a real treat. In playing it both in the Samsung and the Panasonic (just swapping the cable and disc back and forth - zero hdmi handshake issues! Take that Toshiba!) there is a noticeable difference. In the trailer promo section, when it has the line-up of all the discs in their cases, the Samsung doesn't have the same pop in the blues there as the Panasonic. In watching the film, during the opening scenes, you have them in the shack. When it goes from the black to the wood image, watch the bottom of the screen. On the samsung, you can see some very very minor gradient/posterization going on as it brings the full image into view. On the Panasonic, that isn't a problem and it's a beautiful solid black. A minute or two later, when the guys are checking the temperature at the pole, the Samsung looks a touch fuzzier and softer. The Panasonic is much sharper and more detailed.
Gave a spin to the first 10 minutes of Aeon Flux as well. Looks fantastic, very vibrant and smooth. Best of all with both movies, no edge enhancement. That's been getting to me more and more with live action films in the last couple of years since getting used to HD material.
For reference, I have a Panasonic 50" LCD with DVI (single cable connector for HDMI-DVI) and my set is *not ISF calibrated*. It's been done with Avia and Video Essentials every year during a clean-up phase. I like to think of it as a "real world" set in that regard. 99.99% of the population will never have it properly calibrated by a specialist. A small amount will use Avia or VE. I have the mindset of not having it at factory overkill and cleaned-up which is better than most.
I'll be doing much more detailed thoughts and pictures over the weekend for an article in my site, and will link here when complete.
Got mine this afternoon and have spent less than an hour playing with it.
So far, very pleased. Very minor quibbles for the most part. I actually like the remote once you adjust to the layout, but I have to say, don't most of us who are really into this have specialized universal remotes we program anyway? I love my MX-500 and don't really care what comes with a playback device.
Yep. I never use the remotes that come with these things. At the moment, I use a Sony RM-AX4000.
Quote:
The lack of an eject button threw me at first but with it basically being a safety precaution against ejecting when the front panel is up, it's not something I really complain about.
I don't really understand the point of an eject button on the remote for a single-disc player. Don't you still have to get up to change the disc anyhow? When you get up and walk over to the unit, you hit the button.
Quote:
Did some A/B comparisons on Fifth Element on the scene where Leeloo escapes to the building exterior. It looks a touch sharper but what's more noticeable I think is the vibrancy and pop of the colors. The yellow in her hair is much more vibrant here and the taxi's going by are stronger. Not a huge improvement but I wasn't expecting one since this is a flawed transfer.
Eight Below however is a real treat. In playing it both in the Samsung and the Panasonic (just swapping the cable and disc back and forth - zero hdmi handshake issues! Take that Toshiba!) there is a noticeable difference. In the trailer promo section, when it has the line-up of all the discs in their cases, the Samsung doesn't have the same pop in the blues there as the Panasonic. In watching the film, during the opening scenes, you have them in the shack. When it goes from the black to the wood image, watch the bottom of the screen. On the samsung, you can see some very very minor gradient/posterization going on as it brings the full image into view. On the Panasonic, that isn't a problem and it's a beautiful solid black. A minute or two later, when the guys are checking the temperature at the pole, the Samsung looks a touch fuzzier and softer. The Panasonic is much sharper and more detailed.
Gave a spin to the first 10 minutes of Aeon Flux as well. Looks fantastic, very vibrant and smooth. Best of all with both movies, no edge enhancement. That's been getting to me more and more with live action films in the last couple of years since getting used to HD material.
For reference, I have a Panasonic 50" LCD with DVI (single cable connector for HDMI-DVI) and my set is *not ISF calibrated*. It's been done with Avia and Video Essentials every year during a clean-up phase. I like to think of it as a "real world" set in that regard. 99.99% of the population will never have it properly calibrated by a specialist. A small amount will use Avia or VE. I have the mindset of not having it at factory overkill and cleaned-up which is better than most.
I'll be doing much more detailed thoughts and pictures over the weekend for an article in my site, and will link here when complete.
Thanks for the quick report Chris. You all are really making me anxious to get this player already.
All countries
Argentina
Austria
Belgium
Brazil
Bulgaria
Chile
China
Colombia
Cyprus
Czech Republic
Estonia
Denmark
Finland
Greece
Hong Kong
Hungary
Iceland
Indonesia
Ireland
Israel
India
Latvia
Lithuania
Malaysia
New Zealand
Norway
Philippines
Poland
Portugal
Romania
Russia
Singapore
South Africa
South Korea
Sweden
Switzerland
Taiwan
Thailand
Turkey
Ukraine
United Arab Emirates
The Panasonic DMP-BD10 Review Thread -v. 2.4 Firmware available now-
Linear Mode
