I Have A Real Concern.....Thanks To CNET - Blu-ray Forum

WhoDat · 10-04-2007, 10:04 PM

Because I'm new to this whole thing I'm still trying to figure out the whole HD thingy. Now I chose Sony Blu simply because I wanted a PS3 and could really care less about an X-Box so it (Blu) came with the territory. However, I don't think I can continue to support Blu at the level that most do in order to get the point across to those other folks that we are in it to win. I mean, prices for players are dropping for the HD players etc... And Sony it seems is dragging their feet. How long can you support Blu before the monetary well runs dry? It may come to a point where I can only purchase 1BD a month and let’s not even talk about buying additional players for the extra bedrooms. Really, if HD starts selling disc at 15 bucks and Blu is still at the $24-30 price range...... if the HD players drop to $200 bucks and Blu is stuck on $400 - ? A first grader can do the math. Someone slap some sense into me, I'm freaking out here folks!!!!!

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6463_7-...5.html?tag=nav

Jish · 10-04-2007, 10:12 PM

Right now HD Media is for early adopters. Early adopters tend to be the people who are willing to pay more for the hardware and software.

The CE companies and studios have needed a new cycle for a couple years now - DVD players cost $30 and DVDs cost under $10. In order for any money to come back to the studios and hardware manufacturers it was time for the next generation.

HD DVD is trying to jump forward a few years and put out inexpensive hardware. They can do it because it is basically only one company and Toshiba is willing to take a loss. But notice that the other CEs are with Blu because they aren't willing to lose a chance to have a few years of profitability on HDM.

In terms of discs - you could buy the HD DVD player for $299 or whatever, but the discs are actually generally more expensive or the same price than Blu. Retail is usually at least $29.98 or $34.98 for a combo so the cheap player price won't help you for long.

fronn · 10-04-2007, 10:16 PM

The only thing they say that I have huge issues with is the "let's just skip this generation and go to downloadable" mentality they seem to have. Until we have 30+mbit/s connections that's totally unacceptable, especially considering we have two perfectly acceptable formats to do that job already out there (I may prefer Blu-Ray for obvious reasons, but I wouldn't mind if HD DVD wins... as long as one does).

haushausman · 10-04-2007, 10:17 PM

I find it amazing that people think HD anything would be cheap. The day I bought my HDTV I knew I was entering into a realm of high prices; but the return is quality.

Blu-ray is like the Mercedes of home theaters.... shit's expensive man.

If you can't handle it stick with DVDs for awhile... prices won't be dirt cheap until some better technology rivals Blu-ray.

bootman · 10-04-2007, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fronn

The only thing they say that I have huge issues with is the "let's just skip this generation and go to downloadable" mentality they seem to have. Until we have 30+mbit/s connections that's totally unacceptable, especially considering we have two perfectly acceptable formats to do that job already out there (I may prefer Blu-Ray for obvious reasons, but I wouldn't mind if HD DVD wins... as long as one does).

Many MSOs will offer +30 Mbits connections as an option in 2008 and have wide scale deployments in 2009.

Mericalis · 10-04-2007, 10:21 PM

Let me state this to you, don't buy more than what you can afford...that's a stupid investment to go into debt because of either formats. If you can only afford one BD a month, then find out what's coming up and save your money to buy whichever one you are wanting to buy. Both HD-format movies are higher in price, but it's something you contend with when you go for a higher quality format.

Luis_A51 · 10-04-2007, 10:40 PM

Dude man dont feel bad if you can only buy 1 bd a month and the only player you have is the PS3. Just enjoy it, you're doing your part!

CNET is telling people the obvious: Most people should wait until one format dies to start buying. But if you've already purchased a PS3, then you have nothing to worry about, enjoy the games and movies!

Also Bluray prices are dropping, but more importantly HDDVD prices arent actually dropping. The $200 HDDVD player isnt from Toshiba, its from VENTURER. Have you ever heard of them? Probably not since its one of the worst brands around (ive bought a venturer product, a cd player for about $20 4 years ago, and WOW was it ever garbage) Anyone in their right mind would avoid it.

Finally HDDVD will not have major movies at $15. Studios determine movie prices, not the hardware manufacturers. If HDDVD tries to force warner to sell there movies for $5-10 less then they'll probably switch to blue exclusive.

supersix4 · 10-04-2007, 10:42 PM

im at over 300 a mo. for my addiction and if they lose I'll still have a better product but i doubt our wonderful blu will go away! any help is good help there are probly lots of people who dont have the funds to blow 300 a mo. on blu-rays but 1 movie still helps the cause !

Kristin Simard · 10-04-2007, 10:50 PM

Blu is at the $20 USD price range. So is HD DVD where I shop.

What is the worst-case scenario? That in 4 years Blu will die and HD DVD prevails? (Won't happen, but let's just say for nightmare's sake.)
Answer:
I just think of all those cheap Blu players and discs I'll be able to snap up on both the unsold and used marketplace!

But like I said, it won't happen. Prices will continue to go down anyway in a thriving market.

WhoDat · 10-04-2007, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mericalis

Let me state this to you, don't buy more than what you can afford...that's a stupid investment to go into debt because of either formats. If you can only afford one BD a month, then find out what's coming up and save your money to buy whichever one you are wanting to buy. Both HD-format movies are higher in price, but it's something you contend with when you go for a higher quality format.

I wont ever go into debt, just saying that because of the current cost I'll not go full force and spend blindly. If I can only carry one a month then so be it...but the urge to do more will always be there.

P.S. Thanks for that slap folks!

kamiller42 · 10-04-2007, 11:09 PM

1 BD a month is better than none. Don't worry. Everything counts in large amounts.

Blu-ray media has shown it can meet or beat HD DVD on price.

HD DVD sells the razor cheap and tries to make up for it on the blades.

WhoDat · 10-04-2007, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kamiller42

1 BD a month is better than none. Don't worry. Everything counts in large amounts.

Blu-ray media has shown it can meet or beat HD DVD on price.

HD DVD sells the razor cheap and tries to make up for it on the blades.

What happend on or around the 28th? No new releases or someting? Looks like a government end of fiscal year spending graph....

cartier · 10-04-2007, 11:31 PM

While a 1st grader can do the math, they can't do the economics.

Toshiba is probably not making money on the units they are selling, also there is no competitive pressure from other HD-DVD player manufacturers to push down prices or create any type of economies of scale for production within a company. This means that Toshiba is artificially setting low prices in the hopes of increasing demand.

Even when Venture enters the market will someone really buy a $200 player from a no name brand. Most likely not, maybe for $50 but the reality is most people have a low price thresh hold for non name brand products.

People take two approaches to low priced merchandise that should have a useful life of a few years, like electronics. 1) The technology can't be great if it is that cheap or 2) For that price they must have used substandard parts. In either scenario the saying "you get what you pay for" prevails.

Just because it costs less does not make it better for consumers. You tend to learn this after 1st grade which is one reason why 1st graders are not considered to be sound decision makers. However, you are free to let a 1st grader make all of your decisions for you just don't be surprised if they don't make much sense.

Moefiz · 10-04-2007, 11:48 PM

The thing that I can't understand is that you will spend an average of 2500 for a HDTV with that you have to get cables also get hd service from a cable company with that add a reciver and speeker set up..so far to be modest lets say $4000...now add a nice stand into the mix or a wall mount you are looking about 5000 when you are done(now this is a modest assumption) when all done you put a $300 HD player that can't even put out 1080p...now remember you spend 2500 on a HD tv 1080p...

My friend 1 disc a month is good better than non....no use to give up a cause that you invest so much in....

GreenMotion · 10-05-2007, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moefiz

The thing that I can't understand is that you will spend an average of 2500 for a HDTV with that you have to get cables also get hd service from a cable company with that add a reciver and speeker set up..so far to be modest lets say $4000...now add a nice stand into the mix or a wall mount you are looking about 5000 when you are done(now this is a modest assumption) when all done you put a $300 HD player that can't even put out 1080p...now remember you spend 2500 on a HD tv 1080p...

My friend 1 disc a month is good better than non....no use to give up a cause that you invest so much in....

I concur with your post.

My breakdown was as follows:
- $2800 50-inch Panasonic Plasma
- $1000 Receiver
- $500 for 6 sony floor speakers
- $150 for sony center speaker
- $100 cables
- $60 surge protector
- $600 PS3
- $25 PS3 remote
- $600 TV Stand

That is $5835, not counting the 80 BDs I have currently.

The monthly portion of my cable HD service is probably around $30. (box rental + box service + hd channels addon)

To be honest, I am kinda perplexed looking at these numbers now. I had never before added it up. But anyway, after spending that much, do you really think I would buy a $200 HD-DVD player?

ps3andlovinit · 10-05-2007, 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhoDat

Because I'm new to this whole thing I'm still trying to figure out the whole HD thingy. Now I chose Sony Blu simply because I wanted a PS3 and could really care less about an X-Box so it (Blu) came with the territory. However, I don't think I can continue to support Blu at the level that most do in order to get the point across to those other folks that we are in it to win. I mean, prices for players are dropping for the HD players etc... And Sony it seems is dragging their feet. How long can you support Blu before the monetary well runs dry? It may come to a point where I can only purchase 1BD a month and let’s not even talk about buying additional players for the extra bedrooms. Really, if HD starts selling disc at 15 bucks and Blu is still at the $24-30 price range...... if the HD players drop to $200 bucks and Blu is stuck on $400 - ? A first grader can do the math. Someone slap some sense into me, I'm freaking out here folks!!!!!

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6463_7-...5.html?tag=nav

that's ok..I don't think your concern is real even if it's a real concern.

kowhite · 10-05-2007, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhoDat

Really, if HD starts selling disc at 15 bucks and Blu is still at the $24-30 price range...... if the HD players drop to $200 bucks and Blu is stuck on $400 - ?

I think the first thing to point out is that HD-DVD doesn ot have a software pricing advantage, and I don't think you should be expecting them to either.

reellis · 10-05-2007, 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhoDat

What happend on or around the 28th? No new releases or someting? Looks like a government end of fiscal year spending graph....

Amazon listed the Harry Potter Set for $105 which skewed the chart on those immediate pre-orders.

mikesoba · 10-05-2007, 01:05 AM

Has anyone pointed out the cheap Toshiba player is only 1080i? To get the 1080p Toshiba will be another 100 bucks US.

whippersnapper · 10-05-2007, 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhoDat

Because I'm new to this whole thing I'm still trying to figure out the whole HD thingy. Now I chose Sony Blu simply because I wanted a PS3 and could really care less about an X-Box so it (Blu) came with the territory. However, I don't think I can continue to support Blu at the level that most do in order to get the point across to those other folks that we are in it to win. I mean, prices for players are dropping for the HD players etc... And Sony it seems is dragging their feet. How long can you support Blu before the monetary well runs dry? It may come to a point where I can only purchase 1BD a month and let’s not even talk about buying additional players for the extra bedrooms. Really, if HD starts selling disc at 15 bucks and Blu is still at the $24-30 price range...... if the HD players drop to $200 bucks and Blu is stuck on $400 - ? A first grader can do the math. Someone slap some sense into me, I'm freaking out here folks!!!!!

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6463_7-...5.html?tag=nav

Dude, you have joined the Blu army. An army of folks buying one Blu-ray movie a month will swamp whatever tries to pass for competition. Welcome to Blu and enjoy the ride!!

10-04-2007, 10:04 PM	#1
WhoDat Active Member Member since:Aug 2007 Blu-ray reviews:3	I Have A Real Concern.....Thanks To CNET Because I'm new to this whole thing I'm still trying to figure out the whole HD thingy. Now I chose Sony Blu simply because I wanted a PS3 and could really care less about an X-Box so it (Blu) came with the territory. However, I don't think I can continue to support Blu at the level that most do in order to get the point across to those other folks that we are in it to win. I mean, prices for players are dropping for the HD players etc... And Sony it seems is dragging their feet. How long can you support Blu before the monetary well runs dry? It may come to a point where I can only purchase 1BD a month and let’s not even talk about buying additional players for the extra bedrooms. Really, if HD starts selling disc at 15 bucks and Blu is still at the $24-30 price range...... if the HD players drop to $200 bucks and Blu is stuck on $400 - ? A first grader can do the math. Someone slap some sense into me, I'm freaking out here folks!!!!! http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6463_7-...5.html?tag=nav

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10-04-2007, 10:12 PM	#2
Jish Member Member since:Jul 2007 Blu-ray collection:454	Right now HD Media is for early adopters. Early adopters tend to be the people who are willing to pay more for the hardware and software. The CE companies and studios have needed a new cycle for a couple years now - DVD players cost $30 and DVDs cost under $10. In order for any money to come back to the studios and hardware manufacturers it was time for the next generation. HD DVD is trying to jump forward a few years and put out inexpensive hardware. They can do it because it is basically only one company and Toshiba is willing to take a loss. But notice that the other CEs are with Blu because they aren't willing to lose a chance to have a few years of profitability on HDM. In terms of discs - you could buy the HD DVD player for $299 or whatever, but the discs are actually generally more expensive or the same price than Blu. Retail is usually at least $29.98 or $34.98 for a combo so the cheap player price won't help you for long.

10-04-2007, 10:16 PM	#3
fronn Expert Member Member since:Sep 2007 Location:St. Paul, Minnesota Blu-ray collection:- DVD collection:- Blu-ray reviews:1	The only thing they say that I have huge issues with is the "let's just skip this generation and go to downloadable" mentality they seem to have. Until we have 30+mbit/s connections that's totally unacceptable, especially considering we have two perfectly acceptable formats to do that job already out there (I may prefer Blu-Ray for obvious reasons, but I wouldn't mind if HD DVD wins... as long as one does).

10-04-2007, 10:17 PM	#4
haushausman Special Member Member since:Jan 2007 Location:Chicago Home Theater Gallery:12 Blu-ray collection:343 Blu-ray reviews: 5	I find it amazing that people think HD anything would be cheap. The day I bought my HDTV I knew I was entering into a realm of high prices; but the return is quality. Blu-ray is like the Mercedes of home theaters.... shit's expensive man. If you can't handle it stick with DVDs for awhile... prices won't be dirt cheap until some better technology rivals Blu-ray.

10-04-2007, 10:21 PM	#6
Mericalis Expert Member Member since:Aug 2007 Location:Texas Blu-ray collection:232 DVD collection:6 Blu-ray reviews:5	Let me state this to you, don't buy more than what you can afford...that's a stupid investment to go into debt because of either formats. If you can only afford one BD a month, then find out what's coming up and save your money to buy whichever one you are wanting to buy. Both HD-format movies are higher in price, but it's something you contend with when you go for a higher quality format.

10-04-2007, 10:40 PM	#7
Luis_A51 Blu-ray Guru Member since:Jun 2007 Location:Calgary, AB Blu-ray reviews:4	Dude man dont feel bad if you can only buy 1 bd a month and the only player you have is the PS3. Just enjoy it, you're doing your part! CNET is telling people the obvious: Most people should wait until one format dies to start buying. But if you've already purchased a PS3, then you have nothing to worry about, enjoy the games and movies! Also Bluray prices are dropping, but more importantly HDDVD prices arent actually dropping. The $200 HDDVD player isnt from Toshiba, its from VENTURER. Have you ever heard of them? Probably not since its one of the worst brands around (ive bought a venturer product, a cd player for about $20 4 years ago, and WOW was it ever garbage) Anyone in their right mind would avoid it. Finally HDDVD will not have major movies at $15. Studios determine movie prices, not the hardware manufacturers. If HDDVD tries to force warner to sell there movies for $5-10 less then they'll probably switch to blue exclusive.

10-04-2007, 10:42 PM	#8
supersix4 Blu-ray Archduke Top contributor Member since:Mar 2007 Blu-ray collection:572 Blu-ray reviews: 53 Trading Score:3	im at over 300 a mo. for my addiction and if they lose I'll still have a better product but i doubt our wonderful blu will go away! any help is good help there are probly lots of people who dont have the funds to blow 300 a mo. on blu-rays but 1 movie still helps the cause !

10-04-2007, 10:50 PM	#9
Kristin Simard Special Member Member since:Aug 2007	Blu is at the $20 USD price range. So is HD DVD where I shop. What is the worst-case scenario? That in 4 years Blu will die and HD DVD prevails? (Won't happen, but let's just say for nightmare's sake.) Answer: I just think of all those cheap Blu players and discs I'll be able to snap up on both the unsold and used marketplace! But like I said, it won't happen. Prices will continue to go down anyway in a thriving market.

10-04-2007, 11:09 PM	#11
kamiller42 Active Member Member since:Sep 2007 Blu-ray collection:1 Blu-ray reviews:1	1 BD a month is better than none. Don't worry. Everything counts in large amounts. Blu-ray media has shown it can meet or beat HD DVD on price. HD DVD sells the razor cheap and tries to make up for it on the blades.

10-04-2007, 11:31 PM	#13
cartier Expert Member Member since:Jun 2007 Location:Pacific NW	While a 1st grader can do the math, they can't do the economics. Toshiba is probably not making money on the units they are selling, also there is no competitive pressure from other HD-DVD player manufacturers to push down prices or create any type of economies of scale for production within a company. This means that Toshiba is artificially setting low prices in the hopes of increasing demand. Even when Venture enters the market will someone really buy a $200 player from a no name brand. Most likely not, maybe for $50 but the reality is most people have a low price thresh hold for non name brand products. People take two approaches to low priced merchandise that should have a useful life of a few years, like electronics. 1) The technology can't be great if it is that cheap or 2) For that price they must have used substandard parts. In either scenario the saying "you get what you pay for" prevails. Just because it costs less does not make it better for consumers. You tend to learn this after 1st grade which is one reason why 1st graders are not considered to be sound decision makers. However, you are free to let a 1st grader make all of your decisions for you just don't be surprised if they don't make much sense.

10-04-2007, 11:48 PM	#14
Moefiz Blu-ray Knight Member since:Jul 2007 Blu-ray collection:288 DVD collection:20 Blu-ray reviews: 15 Trading Score:70	The thing that I can't understand is that you will spend an average of 2500 for a HDTV with that you have to get cables also get hd service from a cable company with that add a reciver and speeker set up..so far to be modest lets say $4000...now add a nice stand into the mix or a wall mount you are looking about 5000 when you are done(now this is a modest assumption) when all done you put a $300 HD player that can't even put out 1080p...now remember you spend 2500 on a HD tv 1080p... My friend 1 disc a month is good better than non....no use to give up a cause that you invest so much in....

10-05-2007, 01:05 AM	#19
mikesoba Active Member Member since:Jun 2007 Location:South Bay, California Blu-ray collection:258	Has anyone pointed out the cheap Toshiba player is only 1080i? To get the 1080p Toshiba will be another 100 bucks US.

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