onkyo 705 and def techs

[gandytime]

First off let me say as a woman, sometimes it can be intimidating asking questions,on a male dominated forum, So work with me on this. I have the onkyo 705, when reading this forum most say to set your fronts to Full Band, which by the way are def tech bp10s and clr3000, but while reading on another site they say set EVERYTHING to 80hz, which will also turn on double bass, why such a difference? Is one just an opinion? Btw Audyssey set fronts at Full, also the 705 doesnt have large or small speaker settings.What gives with the different settings? Thanks.

[solarrdadd]

Originally Posted by gandytime

First off let me say as a woman, sometimes it can be intimidating asking questions,on a male dominated forum, So work with me on this. I have the onkyo 705, when reading this forum most say to set your fronts to Full Band, which by the way are def tech bp10s and clr3000, but while reading on another site they say set EVERYTHING to 80hz, which will also turn on double bass, why such a difference? Is one just an opinion? Btw Audyssey set fronts at Full, also the 705 doesnt have large or small speaker settings.What gives with the different settings? Thanks.

howdy, first off let me say you being a woman should have no bearing here. i would hope that we treat each other with respect as human beings, not because your a woman, because your a human being; i'd tell you the same thing if you were a man!

now, i have an onkyo and ran audyssey and it set all my speakers to full band except my surround back 2 channels which it set to 70hz and it also turned on double bass. some, if not most will tell you that is wrong. i won't tell you that. audyssey when doing it's calibration goes on what is fed to it from each of your speakers into that mic and it calculates how far from the mic your speakers are, how much high & low frequence your speakers are capable, modifies the EQ for room shape, size, furniture, etc., it may or may not also set double bass which means that the level of bass being sent to your front L & R is also being sent to the sub, hence the double. Oh, you can only have double bass enabled if your fronts are set to full band. oh, by the way, nice speakers!

small or large speakers was the original terms set to determine crossover frequency for speakers to send lower frequencies over to the subwoofer to not strain drivers in speakers that can't really play those low frequencies properly without undo rattle, vibration that muddies the sound and in some cases might damage the speaker. small usually meant that lower frequencies would be sent to the subwoofer, large usually meant that all frequencies would be sent to the speaker.

80hz it the THX recommended standard for crossover settings of speakers. it's neither right or wrong, it's a recommendation. some folks swear by it some don't some say 70, 60 some say 90 or 100, i say you should experiment and let your ears be the judge. read through post about receiver settings, speakers and their settings and get a better understanding of things and test things out for yourself and find what works best for you.

one other thing about the audyssey setting your speakers to full band, as i said it did the same for mine folks said that was wrong, however, what audyssey also did at the same time was lower each individual speaker level to compensate for setting it to full band. i have tried this setting as well as what i currently have my speakers setup as. i like them both and what i do is go back and forth every so often to keep things interesting for me.

you will get lots of opinions at this and other forums, think about them, try them out but ultimately, you and your ears must be the final judge on what sounds good to you. my only advise is always keep learning and always keep trying things. as long as you don't endager your hearing or your equipment, there is no absolute truth in this thing. if there was an absolute truth, we wouldn't need any of these forums, now, that's the truth!

best of luck, please keep us posted.

[ryandubbz]

I have onkyo 706 and Polk monitor 60's fronts are set at 60,
Center is at 120
Sourround is 120


Audessy also set my fronts to FUll band, but the speakers range are 44khz on up so i set them to 60, a good rule is to set your speakers a good 10-20khz higher than rated.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by ryandubbz

I have onkyo 706 and Polk monitor 60's fronts are set at 60,
Center is at 120
Sourround is 120


Audessy also set my fronts to FUll band, but the speakers range are 44khz on up so i set them to 60, a good rule is to set your speakers a good 10-20khz higher than rated.

UP do you, but setting your center channel (if its the CS1 or CS2) to 60 hz as well will give you a smoother sound transition across the front and better sound matching as sounds pan across the front sound stage.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by gandytime

First off let me say as a woman, sometimes it can be intimidating asking questions,on a male dominated forum, So work with me on this. I have the onkyo 705, when reading this forum most say to set your fronts to Full Band, which by the way are def tech bp10s and clr3000, but while reading on another site they say set EVERYTHING to 80hz, which will also turn on double bass, why such a difference? Is one just an opinion? Btw Audyssey set fronts at Full, also the 705 doesnt have large or small speaker settings.What gives with the different settings? Thanks.

As stated, woman or not, you deserve to ask questions and get answers to them without feeling intimidated. It is nice to have more and more women on the site.

There is a gentleman on here named Big Daddy, he has the Def Tech 2000 Supertowers, and he has said that even with the built in subwoofers he still sets them to small, and crosses them over. I don't recall where he crossesover, but I think it is between 40-60 hz. He says he does because the dedicated subs can perform low bass frequencies better then the fronts set to large and using the built-in subs, with just the LFE going to the dedicated subs.

I have seen Big Daddys setup in person, and I must say that his 11.6 setup is actually quite amazing and sounds phenominal. You may look for him to respond so that you cna get a better feel for what he is doing and also, he can provide some scientific background with his Engineering degree.... if you need to go that indepth....

[gandytime]

Thank you all for your positive input it's nice to be able to bounce things off others.(Male or female) I will try it set to a couple of different things,as stated in one of my earlier post my husband bought me a SVS sub for my birthday/Christmas present and I just wanted to make sure I was getting the best sound without damaging anything, btw when I called onkyo to ask about the large or small speaker setting the Rep. just kept saying "Ma'am none of the new onkyo's have large or small,just leave it at whatever Audyssey sets it at and go from there".Soooo if you don't use Audyssey how do you know whether your speakers are set for large or small? Hmmmmm

[callas01]

Originally Posted by gandytime

Thank you all for your positive input it's nice to be able to bounce things off others.(Male or female) I will try it set to a couple of different things,as stated in one of my earlier post my husband bought me a SVS sub for my birthday/Christmas present and I just wanted to make sure I was getting the best sound without damaging anything, btw when I called onkyo to ask about the large or small speaker setting the Rep. just kept saying "Ma'am none of the new onkyo's have large or small,just leave it at whatever Audyssey sets it at and go from there".Soooo if you don't use Audyssey how do you know whether your speakers are set for large or small? Hmmmmm

that doesn't make sense, there are a ton of owners on the site that have onkyo 605,705, 805 and 606,706, 806, that all have their receivers set to small and crossovers at 80 hz. Perhaps one of them can help you to where the settings can be found.

Wow, nice sub.... does your husband like HT as much as you?

[gandytime]

My husband hasn't a clue about any HT equipment, but I am not into jewelry purses,clothes so when asked what I want this year I am able to choose whatever,because not only am I happy, our family and friends get to enjoy as well. And I did say to the onkyo rep nevermind I'll just go on blu ray.com

[solarrdadd]

Originally Posted by callas01

that doesn't make sense, there are a ton of owners on the site that have onkyo 605,705, 805 and 606,706, 806, that all have their receivers set to small and crossovers at 80 hz. Perhaps one of them can help you to where the settings can be found.

Wow, nice sub.... does your husband like HT as much as you?

howdy, i have an 805 and there is no such listing on the speakers as large or small with Onkyo it is "full range" which would be considered small and then they go into freq. ranges from 40 up to 200hz on mine. so crossovers and small/large on onkyo receivers are the same, i.e. full band, then 40 - 200hz there is no actual small setting but small would be approx 80-200hz.

[gandytime]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

howdy, i have an 805 and there is no such listing on the speakers as large or small with Onkyo it is "full range" which would be considered small and then they go into freq. ranges from 40 up to 200hz on mine. so crossovers and small/large on onkyo receivers are the same, i.e. full band, then 40 - 200hz there is no actual small setting but small would be approx 80-200hz.

Thank You! What you have stated is pretty exact in what I said to onkyo rep and he said one has NOTHING to do with the other.Again I asked what #would be considered small thats when he said keep whatever Audyssey sets it at.So considering all I have read Full Band would be small and that is what all your speakers should be set at right? Fronts Full and surrounds from 40-200hz?

[SlmShdy1]

I believe that Full Band is the same as setting your speakers to Large. Small would be like setting your speakers at 80Hz or more. I have my speakers set to 80Hz even though Audyssey likes to set them to Full Band. I know for sure that my speakers aren't large. When my speakers are set to Full Band and if they receive any low frequencies, then distortion will sometimes occur. I set them to 80Hz so that all low frequencies are sent to my sub. Your Def Techs, however, might be able to handle Full Band.

[gandytime]

Originally Posted by SlmShdy1

I believe that Full Band is the same as setting your speakers to Large. Small would be like setting your speakers at 80Hz or more. I have my speakers set to 80Hz even though Audyssey likes to set them to Full Band. I know for sure that my speakers aren't large. When my speakers are set to Full Band and if they receive any low frequencies, then distortion will sometimes occur. I set them to 80Hz so that all low frequencies are sent to my sub. Your Def Techs, however, might be able to handle Full Band.

Thank You for clearing that up for me!!!! I have been going back and forth between Full band and 80Hz as I said in earlier post, because of the different responses that were posted between here and another forum. You all are the best

[BIslander]

"Large" means the processor sends all frequencies to the speaker. The sub only does LFE.

"Small" means the processor reroutes frequencies below the crossover to the sub. The crossover can be anywhere. The level doesn't matter (60Hz, 80Hz, 120Hz). Small merely means that some of the lower frequencies are being redirected from the main channel to the sub - in other words, small engages bass management.

Onkyo chooses to use different terms. But, the setting that sends all frequencies to a speaker equals "large" and any other setting that redirects some low frequencies to the sub equals "small".

Very few speakers can handle deep bass as well as a subwoofer, which is why nearly all speakers should be set to small.

[Big Daddy]

Audyssey does not set the speakers to Large or Small. Aduyssey reports the frequency response of the speakers to the receiver and the the receiver sets the speakers to Large and Small based on some stupid rules. For example, many receivers set the front speakers to large, if Audyssey reports a low frequency extension below 80Hz. Audyssey has tried to convince receiver manufacturers to lower this arbitrary frequency and has succeeded with some of them.

According to Audyssey, if you have a subwoofer, your speakers are SMALL by default. As Callas said in his post, I set my front Def Tech super towers with 15" built-in subwoofers to small with a crossover frequency of 40-60Hz.

Some people are offended when their speakers are set to small. Remember that this is not a personal statement against you or your speakers. Perhaps, small and large are the incorrect words and should be modified as follows:

SMALL = Speakers are bass managed
LARGE (Full Band) = Speakers are not bass managed

For additional information, please read A Guide to Bass Management.

[aramis109]

I have smaller fronts than you but I set mine on 80hz all the way around and it sounds very even and full to me. If I had supertowers I'd set them to full or try what BD does- I kind of like that idea. I don't know that I'd ever set speakers to full band in an HT setup. If I had a 2-channel setup or listened to more music it might be a different story.

BTW I posted in another thread but I love the fact that you're the "take charge" person in the HT and love to have another DT owner on the forums.

[Blu_Ray_Fan]

Originally Posted by callas01

I have seen Big Daddys setup in person, and I must say that his 11.6 setup is actually quite amazing and sounds phenominal.

Technically there is no such thing as "11.6", 7.1 with more speakers maybe? I'm sure it DOES sound AMAZING tho!

And OP, see sig for specs but I have mine set "full" for front 3 and "small" x-overd at 80hz for rears and double bass "on". It sounds good to me?? Funny thing tho, my 805 set my center to small and fronts to full?? Best advise I can give, set it to what sounds good to you...

[aramis109]

Originally Posted by Blu_Ray_Fan

Technically there is no such thing as "11.6", 7.1 with more speakers maybe? I'm sure it DOES sound AMAZING tho!

And OP, see sig for specs but I have mine set "full" for front 3 and "small" x-overd at 80hz for rears and double bass "on". It sounds good to me?? Funny thing tho, my 805 set my center to small and fronts to full?? Best advise I can give, set it to what sounds good to you...

Technically there's no such thing as 7.1 half the time either. Callas is more than aware of the distinction but it's the easiest way to describe a setup quickly and clearly.

Double bass is a mess and I would never use it, especially on your speakers (same fronts as mine). They can't go that low and you're going to get distorted and muddy bass with them playing the same time as your sub. Agree with you though to do whatever sounds best to you.

[Blu_Ray_Fan]

Originally Posted by aramis109

Technically there's no such thing as 7.1 half the time either. Callas is more than aware of the distinction but it's the easiest way to describe a setup quickly and clearly.

I wasn't doubting him, just clarifying we are all on the same page and somebody that isn't as knowlegable doesn't get confused.

Originally Posted by aramis109

Double bass is a mess and I would never use it, especially on your speakers (same fronts as mine). They can't go that low and you're going to get distorted and muddy bass with them playing the same time as your sub. Agree with you though to do whatever sounds best to you.

"Double bass" doesn't add any more bass to the front speakers, just adds whats output on the fronts ALSO goes to the sub in addition to the LFE. If fronts are set to "full" double bass doesn't make a difference to the fronts.

And I get NO "muddy bass" or distortion as you speak of. I have had my front BP6's for 6 years and still sound great. BTW (if you don't remember) I'm the guy you IM'd a few months back before you bought yours asking me how I like mine. There nothing "new" to me and I've had 3 receivers hooked up to them and have tried everything possible with them. The way I have them set sounds GREAT in my room.

[ReverendSlim]

Originally Posted by Big Daddy

Audyssey does not set the speakers to Large or Small. Aduyssey reports the frequency response of the speakers to the receiver and the the receiver sets the speakers to Large and Small based on some stupid rules. For example, many receivers set the front speakers to large, if Audyssey reports a low frequency extension below 80Hz. Audyssey has tried to convince receiver manufacturers to lower this arbitrary frequency and has succeeded with some of them.

Chris Kyriakakis with Audyssey has previously confirmed that the x05 Onkyos had 80Hz per Onkyo as the threshold for "full range", despite Audyssey advising them to use 40Hz. The newer Onkyos (such as the TX-NR1007 I just replaced my 705 with) do not have this issue and will set the speakers according to their actual -3dB point. I was running Polk RTi70 mains, a CSi40 center and RTi28 surrounds with my 705 and it read them all as full range. Per Audyssey's suggestion, they were quickly dialed back to 80Hz.

To the OP: The 705 doesn't really have the power to properly drive those DefTech towers, so I would definitely set a crossover and let the subwoofer handle the deep bass duties. I'd say Big Daddy's suggestion of a 40-60Hz crossover would be wise if you do any 2-channel music listening, otherwise I'd stick to 80Hz. With my RTi70 towers, 80Hz ended up being the best all-around solution and blended well with my SVS 20-39CS+. A guideline I like to follow with setting crossovers is that you should never set a crossover lower than 1.5x the speaker's spec'd -3dB point. Sticking to that rule usually gives you enough room before the speaker's in-room response rolls off enough to mess up the transition from speaker to subwoofer. That said, considering the higher resolution that Audyssey's MultEQ XT has for equalizing the subwoofer, I'd advise to set all speakers to 80Hz across the board so that the brunt of the bass is coming from the subwoofer, which receives the most correction during the EQ'ing.

If you have any more specific questions, I wrote the Audyssey portion of the Onkyo TX-SR705 FAQ over at AVS, and I'd be happy to help.

[ReverendSlim]

Originally Posted by Blu_Ray_Fan

"Double bass" doesn't add any more bass to the front speakers, just adds whats output on the fronts ALSO goes to the sub in addition to the LFE. If fronts are set to "full" double bass doesn't make a difference to the fronts.

And I get NO "muddy bass" or distortion as you speak of. I have had my front BP6's for 6 years and still sound great. BTW (if you don't remember) I'm the guy you IM'd a few months back before you bought yours asking me how I like mine. There nothing "new" to me and I've had 3 receivers hooked up to them and have tried everything possible with them. The way I have them set sounds GREAT in my room.

The reason people say not to use Double Bass is because of the potential cancellation issues that can crop up from producing the same sound from multiple point sources in the room. The odds of both mains being perfectly in phase with your subwoofer at each listening position as the frequency drops is ridiculously slim, whereas setting a crossover typically ensures a solid phase transition across the crossover range so long as speaker distances are set correctly. That's why people with dual subwoofers either co-locate them to prevent them from canceling each other out, or they run them as stereo subs off of their mains. Either way, if you like the way it sounds in your room, that's fine. The vast majority (including myself) would advise against it.