The format war is great!

[cartier]

Originally Posted by mdm1699

Some say we need germs in order to strengthen our immune system.

This is true. Looks like someone has some knowledge of biology.

Originally Posted by mdm1699

I see what you are saying. However, it wasn't the format war that drove down the price of DVD players and increased functionality/features in those players. It was manufacturers competing against each other under one unified format. The presence of HD-DVD prevents this because everyone else is waiting for a winner. Mass adoption in hardware will lead to a decrease in price for software.

Looks like someone has at least some knowledge of economics too. I wish more people understood this and did not attribute the format war for lowering prices. It seams many fail to understand that if it was not for the format war there would be a much larger market for HD content and greater competition among manufacturers to produce better players and drive prices lower.

[so n so]

competition = lower prices

pluses & minuses to the war...

[MotionBlurr]

I remember the DVD players costing $200-300 several years ago. They were made of quality materials. My 1st Sony player was for $300. It was big and heavy and it wasn't even progressive scan but it was made of quality materials. Even the remote was a nice joystick style remote with nice buttons.

But competition made companies bring the price down so they started using cheaper materials. Even the new Sony DVD players look flimsy. I am surprised the remotes even come with batteries now.

[mdm1699]

Originally Posted by so n so

competition = lower prices

pluses & minuses to the war...

STOOOPPP IT. Sorry. They are not in business to lose money. Toshiba is losing money on it's players, which is why no one else is making them. However, they have a vested interest in the format, which is why no one else is making them.

Blu-ray players are expensive because their manufacturers don't want to lose money on their products. However, larger market drives down the price of components and consequently players. It annoys me to explain that.

[bkbluray]

The format war is creating tons of "fence-sitters" who aren't willing to make a decision for Blu or DUD because one of them will go out eventually.

Until Blu wins the war (aka Warner goes Blu-exclusive) there won't be a mass adoption.

[bkbluray]

Also, there are at least 10 more companies coming out with Blu-ray players this year. I think we will begin to see the same thing happen as with DVD. Prices of players will fall, quality will rise, and more and more movies will be sold.

[DealsR4theDevil]

Originally Posted by bkbluray

The format war is creating tons of "fence-sitters" who aren't willing to make a decision for Blu or DUD because one of them will go out eventually.

Until Blu wins the war (aka Warner goes Blu-exclusive) there won't be a mass adoption.

Really? you think that is all it would take? HD DVD survived when Universal was their only exclusive studio, I would have thought that 1 studio could not keep the format afloat. Its true thay had Warner and Paramount but Blu-ray had them to. We were in the ultimate position. We had every studio except for 1. HD DVD was missing out on soooooo much content and people still bought it. I dont know what its going to take to kill HD DVD but I doubt it will be as simple as Warner going Blu exclusive.

[mdm1699]

Originally Posted by DealsR4theDevil

Really? you think that is all it would take? HD DVD survived when Universal was their only exclusive studio, I would have thought that 1 studio could not keep the format afloat. Its true thay had Warner and Paramount but Blu-ray had them to. We were in the ultimate position. We had every studio except for 1. HD DVD was missing out on soooooo much content and people still bought it. I dont know what its going to take to kill HD DVD but I doubt it will be as simple as Warner going Blu exclusive.

Think of Toshiba as a tree. It doesn't have to die immediately. Kill the roots and death becomes a formality. Am I becoming a zealot? lol. I feel evil. Seriously, I am beginning to think that Warner is just as big of a culprit as Toshiba is. What is their vested interest in HD-DVD. They must be getting royalties from the sale of HD-DVD players. It cannot possibly be that they are focused on short-term numbers. They are a going concern. A healthy one as well. Something is amiss here. How many people(who we know are mostly men) would buy these players without titles like Matrix, BB, V.

[DealsR4theDevil]

Originally Posted by mdm1699

Think of Toshiba as a tree. It doesn't have to die immediately. Kill the roots and death becomes a formality. Am I becoming a zealot? lol. I feel evil. Seriously, I am beginning to think that Warner is just as big of a culprit as Toshiba is. What is their vested interest in HD-DVD. They must be getting royalties from the sale of HD-DVD players. It cannot possibly be that they are focused on short-term numbers. They are a going concern. A healthy one as well. Something is amiss here. How many people(who we know are mostly men) would buy these players without titles like Matrix, BB, V.

Terminator 3 was released for Blu-ray because of profile 1.1 PIP stuff. Maybe Batman Begins and the others will follow shortly.

[bkbluray]

Originally Posted by mdm1699

Think of Toshiba as a tree. It doesn't have to die immediately. Kill the roots and death becomes a formality. Am I becoming a zealot? lol. I feel evil. Seriously, I am beginning to think that Warner is just as big of a culprit as Toshiba is. What is their vested interest in HD-DVD. They must be getting royalties from the sale of HD-DVD players. It cannot possibly be that they are focused on short-term numbers. They are a going concern. A healthy one as well. Something is amiss here. How many people(who we know are mostly men) would buy these players without titles like Matrix, BB, V.

I agree, quite a few of the titles DUD fans brag about are the "timed" exclusives for HD-DVD such as Matrix, Batman Begins, V. I have no doubt that they got some cash from producing the Matrix on HD-DVD.

[bkbluray]

Originally Posted by DealsR4theDevil

Really? you think that is all it would take? HD DVD survived when Universal was their only exclusive studio, I would have thought that 1 studio could not keep the format afloat. Its true thay had Warner and Paramount but Blu-ray had them to. We were in the ultimate position. We had every studio except for 1. HD DVD was missing out on soooooo much content and people still bought it. I dont know what its going to take to kill HD DVD but I doubt it will be as simple as Warner going Blu exclusive.

Warner holds a much larger sway than Universal does. Besides for Bourne, I can't think of too many other Universal titles that are "must own". As for Warner, they own the rights to the best selling HD movie (300) and they have an extensive library of TV shows and blockbuster movies. If Warner went Blu-exclusive it would mean you couldn't get 300, the Departed, etc. on HD-DVD anymore.

[br85]

Originally Posted by DealsR4theDevil

Really? you think that is all it would take? HD DVD survived when Universal was their only exclusive studio, I would have thought that 1 studio could not keep the format afloat. Its true thay had Warner and Paramount but Blu-ray had them to. We were in the ultimate position. We had every studio except for 1. HD DVD was missing out on soooooo much content and people still bought it. I dont know what its going to take to kill HD DVD but I doubt it will be as simple as Warner going Blu exclusive.

Yeah but have a look at what actually sells on HD-DVD . The only HD DvDs getting decent sales are (in order and popularity on the top 100 hd/bluray list:Transformers(#1), Planet Earth(#6), 2001:a space odyssey(#15), The Shining(#34), Top Gun(#56), Blade Runner(#57), 300(#58), Shrek 3(#59), A Clockwork Orange(#63), Heroes s1(#66), Batman Begins(#70), Harry Potter gift set(#71), Digital Video Essentials(#73), Eyes wide Shut(#79), face off(#84), The Borne Identity(#87), Matrix Trilogy(#93), Eagles Farewell tour(#94), The Borne Supremacy(#96), Oceans Trilogy(#97), Knocked Up(#98).

That's a pretty small number out of the top 100. And guess what? All the movies in bold are Warner. If they went blu there would be nothing left except 1 movie for HD DvD: Transformers. Oh the future would be entirely blu if warner was ours alone...

[RUR]

Originally Posted by mdm1699

Some say we need germs in order to strengthen our immune system. HD-DVD was a band-aid and is now a barrier to progress. As for sales, that is why we have laws against price-fixing.

Originally Posted by cartier

This is true. Looks like someone has some knowledge of biology.

Read Guns, Germs and Steel by Jared Diamond. Winner of the Pulitzer Prize and a ripping good read.

[NutsAboutPS3]

You have to distinguish between genuine price reductions that arise from improved manufacturing efficiency as more units are sold, and artificial short term price reductions that arise from companies selling at a loss. Companies exist to make money, they are only selling at a loss now in the expectation they can recoup those losses later. Consumers will have to foot the bill for this format war at a later date.

IMO we would be better off without the format war. Without the war, adoption would be greater as people could buy into a single format with confidence, leading to more rapid genuine price reductions arising from economies of scale in a larger market.

The best thing we can all do is to exclusively support Blu-ray to bring about a single dominant format as quickly as possible.

[sphdle1]

I think the war needs to continue a 'short' while longer to get prices of equipment down even more & quality to its best, so that people will spend the money on Blu-ray players (those that aren't gamers & just watch movies). I think many are tempted by the lower priced HDDUD players, but don't want to buy them(because they know blu is eventually going to win or they see how blu has so many more titles to choose from), and are waiting for Blu players to come down in price even more before they can afford to jump from DVD to High Def.
Once the prices of Blu players are down low enough, you will see a sharp rise in player and disc sales for Blu-ray. I think we'll see some good gain this coming Christmas season, but I think it will be next Christmas 2008 when the Blu player prices are low enough & title selection is even that much better & Blu titles continue to increase their lead over HDDUD (with help from studios such as WB, Universal, etc.), and the increase will be exponential...thus Jan 2009 the war will be over, prices will be way down, selection and quality way up, and everyone wins (except for the poor souls who bought HDDUD players and discs). They're gonna be pissed, but will get over it once they take time to drop their egos, get a Blu player & watch a BD with Full TrueHD sound uncompressed, and start digging into the more vast selection of titles, especially the ones they couldn't get before. Many parents will start buying Blu players & discs because of all the Disney movies out alone that their kids can & want to watch(but up to that time were just getting them on DVD), and since we'll see more DVD rental stores starting to have more shelf space for new Blu disc releases, it won't take long to go toe to toe with DVD, and even surpass them.

Myself, I'm not on the fence waiting, I'm just not in a financial position to get a Blu player and a bunch of disc's yet, like I hope to do. I hope to soon get past my financial woes and start digging in. Can't wait.

It's funny, because my favorite color was always blue, long before I heard of Blu-ray, but that not why I'm going Blu (though I do think the name is so much more futuristic). It's because of the so many things that the Blu technology has going for it over HDDUD(with which DUD would just in the end stagnate advancement).

Blu is the future...all the way!

[gand41f]

Originally Posted by NutsAboutPS3

You have to distinguish between genuine price reductions that arise from improved manufacturing efficiency as more units are sold, and artificial short term price reductions that arise from companies selling at a loss. Companies exist to make money, they are only selling at a loss now in the expectation they can recoup those losses later. Consumers will have to foot the bill for this format war at a later date.

IMO we would be better off without the format war. Without the war, adoption would be greater as people could buy into a single format with confidence, leading to more rapid genuine price reductions arising from economies of scale in a larger market.

The best thing we can all do is to exclusively support Blu-ray to bring about a single dominant format as quickly as possible.

Truer words have never been spoken. I recommend everyone to read and understand this post before posting about the "format war" again.

enjoy
gandalf

[mdm1699]

Originally Posted by RUR

Read Guns, Germs and Steel by Jared Diamond. Winner of the Pulitzer Prize and a ripping good read.

My next read. I am tempted to ask what it is about but I want to be objective.

[tru2blu707]

well...another thing about this war also is that alot of people, instead of picking one side....has decided to buy BOTH formats(met someone at circuit city yesterday who had both players) and he specifically stated that the quality of blu rays is much better than HD DVD...but he just wanted to be cautious and bought a HD DVD player also...which just prolongs the war even more...

[PS3_Kiwi]

Blu-ray supporters can thank HD DVD for prolongiing the war, as it has got Sony and the rest of the BD supporters to get off their butts and really start to push our favoured format. But now is the time for HD DVD to gracefully admit defeat, get the hell out of our lives, and let us enjoy 100% studio support (Let's admit it. We do want Transformers, Batman Begins, etc.). So here's hoping that it will be all over by early 2008. Go Blu!

[bkbluray]

Originally Posted by tru2blu707

well...another thing about this war also is that alot of people, instead of picking one side....has decided to buy BOTH formats(met someone at circuit city yesterday who had both players) and he specifically stated that the quality of blu rays is much better than HD DVD...but he just wanted to be cautious and bought a HD DVD player also...which just prolongs the war even more...

Agreed. Sure, it might seem like a smart move on the consumer's part to buy into both formats, but besides the fact that it's much more costly to own both, it only prolongs to war. When I decided which format to support, I knew that I didn't want both. I knew I was on the right team, which is why I only support Blu.