The Official Paradigm Speakers Thread

[aces high]

Originally Posted by -DLS-

You've been on the AVS forums lately huh!? I've read some great things about Seaton Sound and also JTR's.

This guys setup is one of the most interesting threads I've found on that site! He went through a LOT of good - high end - speakers before going to JTR's!

I've been going back and forth lately about getting an amp and processor and not sure if it will give me what I'm looking for. I don't want to spend money on more gear just to have to sell it for a loss again, it gets pricey after a while. I like the look of the Seaton products better than JTR and there are some new products coming out with intro pricing. I'd like a couple of Submersive HP's and some of the Cat 8c's, I'd have to consult with Mark first. I still haven't decided yet, I may get an amp and pro just to see what the Studio's can do. I still have some time as the Cat 8's still are not for sale yet, but coming soon. Sometimes there are too many choices with this stuff. I plan on building a nice two channel system one of these days, so I want something that's best for HT at the moment. I just need to scrape together enough cash for what my ultimate sytsem.

[-DLS-]

Originally Posted by aces high

I've been going back and forth lately about getting an amp and processor and not sure if it will give me what I'm looking for. I don't want to spend money on more gear just to have to sell it for a loss again, it gets pricey after a while. I like the look of the Seaton products better than JTR and there are some new products coming out with intro pricing. I'd like a couple of Submersive HP's and some of the Cat 8c's, I'd have to consult with Mark first. I still haven't decided yet, I may get an amp and pro just to see what the Studio's can do. I still have some time as the Cat 8's still are not for sale yet, but coming soon. Sometimes there are too many choices with this stuff. I plan on building a nice two channel system one of these days, so I want something that's best for HT at the moment. I just need to scrape together enough cash for what my ultimate sytsem.

Yeah I hear what you're saying.. I'm just happy I didn't really take a loss from the previous gear I sold since I got them at really good prices. If I remember from your earlier posts me and you got pretty much the same deals on our previous and current Paradigms. Not many people can get deals like that so I doubt you would lose much trying to sell them - especially in mint condition and no wait time. You might even be able to make a bit of profit towards next purchase. My Monitors sold for exactly what I paid for them and I had a ton of calls even after that cuz they all thought that was a great deal for them used. If they only knew that it's what I paid new.. Even the Studios used are selling for more than what we paid new.. and that's US $$. If someone really wants them it'll be hard for most to find a better price lately anyway.

Do you know anyone or anyplace that will let you take home an amp to try out? I know it sucks being from Canada to try out Emo stuff since shipping back would be a B!tch if it doesn't work out. I am happy with my XPA-3 but I never tried the Studios without them - I bought them for my Monitors..

Yeah the Seatons are much nicer - I would do JTR's behind an AT screen only..

I'm also like you I want a separate 2 ch from my HT in a more relaxed room that I can sit back and have some drinks in..

[aces high]

Originally Posted by -DLS-

Yeah I hear what you're saying.. I'm just happy I didn't really take a loss from the previous gear I sold since I got them at really good prices. If I remember from your earlier posts me and you got pretty much the same deals on our previous and current Paradigms. Not many people can get deals like that so I doubt you would lose much trying to sell them - especially in mint condition and no wait time. You might even be able to make a bit of profit towards next purchase. My Monitors sold for exactly what I paid for them and I had a ton of calls even after that cuz they all thought that was a great deal for them used. If they only knew that it's what I paid new.. Even the Studios used are selling for more than what we paid new.. and that's US $$. If someone really wants them it'll be hard for most to find a better price lately anyway.

Do you know anyone or anyplace that will let you take home an amp to try out? I know it sucks being from Canada to try out Emo stuff since shipping back would be a B!tch if it doesn't work out. I am happy with my XPA-3 but I never tried the Studios without them - I bought them for my Monitors..

Yeah the Seatons are much nicer - I would do JTR's behind an AT screen only..

I'm also like you I want a separate 2 ch from my HT in a more relaxed room that I can sit back and have some drinks in..

I've bought four complete systems from the same dealer so now I get pretty good prices. For two channel I would like to try some tube gear to get that warm relaxing sound, but for HT I want an all out assault on the senses. Next weekend I'll see if I can do an in-home audition of a power amp. How loud do you listen to your system? I like mine too be LOUD!! Not all the time though but when it's called for I want it to deliver. Do you find your Paradigms do well with loud volumes or is there any distortion and driver compression? I think part of my problem is still powering them with a receiver, but the Seaton's may be too good to pass up. I'll take the next couple of weeks and try to power them properly and see how they sound vs what I want. If it sounds like 90% or more I'll just keep what I have. It's problably a good think I can't audition the Seatons, I won't know what I'm missing. But they have been calling my name lately and it scares my bank account.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by -DLS-

Yeah I think $1350 is too much for a demo pair with Damage. Some sell here(Canada) lately for much less in like new or even mint condition.

The Totems are nice speakers but not for everyone but each model is supposed have a different sound from each other. I don't listen to much jazz or classical music which is from I know what the Totems do really well with.. also acoustic and vocals but that's also an area the Studio do very good at. Totems are known to be pretty laid back which is probably why you felt you didn't get that "bite" like the Paradigms give. The Tribes though are great HT speakers especially for on-walls. They were only powered with 60wpc from a NAD receiver and they sounded BIG!

With your dual subs now I think the 20's would do fine then if you want you can always move them back if you want bigger fronts and can do 7.2.

DLS,

I played Alternative Rock on the Totem Sttafs and the Arros. Now the Arros sound a bit narrow because of their diminutive size, however they both played John Mayer and Incubis and other rock music I played especially well. They do all sound a little different, from the ones I had heard.

Now as you know, I obviously like the more laidback sound(Energy Owner), so the Totems are high on my list. Now the Dynaudios have better mid-range and more of a neutral sound, and I think they have some of the best mid-range that I have heard around $1500-2000.... Dynaudio is by far the most coherent speaker I have heard. This is a major reason why I am between these to speaker companies.

[aces high]

Originally Posted by callas01

DLS,

I played Alternative Rock on the Totem Sttafs and the Arros. Now the Arros sound a bit narrow because of their diminutive size, however they both played John Mayer and Incubis and other rock music I played especially well. They do all sound a little different, from the ones I had heard.

Now as you know, I obviously like the more laidback sound(Energy Owner), so the Totems are high on my list. Now the Dynaudios have better mid-range and more of a neutral sound, and I think they have some of the best mid-range that I have heard around $1500-2000.... Dynaudio is by far the most coherent speaker I have heard. This is a major reason why I am between these to speaker companies.

Have you ever heard Totems with any tube gear? When I'm ready to do my two channel system something warm and laid back would be what I'm looking for.

[-DLS-]

Originally Posted by aces high

I've bought four complete systems from the same dealer so now I get pretty good prices. For two channel I would like to try some tube gear to get that warm relaxing sound, but for HT I want an all out assault on the senses. Next weekend I'll see if I can do an in-home audition of a power amp. How loud do you listen to your system? I like mine too be LOUD!! Not all the time though but when it's called for I want it to deliver. Do you find your Paradigms do well with loud volumes or is there any distortion and driver compression? I think part of my problem is still powering them with a receiver, but the Seaton's may be too good to pass up. I'll take the next couple of weeks and try to power them properly and see how they sound vs what I want. If it sounds like 90% or more I'll just keep what I have. It's problably a good think I can't audition the Seatons, I won't know what I'm missing. But they have been calling my name lately and it scares my bank account.

I don't know what loud is to you but at my seating position with an SPL meter I can listen to average 95db's with up to 115db peaks. I don't do that often but to me that is loud. my normal listening is between 80-90 db's depending on the music or movie. At louder volumes I don't get any compression or distortion.. I only sit about 7-8 feet from the mains, 6 feet from the CC-690 and 5 feet from the Studio 40's so 100db's usually is between -10 and -15 on my Marantz I l watch movies mostly between -15 to -20. Just watched Bourne Identity yesterday and it has a wicked audio track! I watched that LOUD and the speakers handled everything nicely!

Anyway hope it all works out for you. My room is probably alot different from yours but I still do think an amp might help even with an SC-07 since you got a full 7.1 setup.. How do the 100's sound alone in Pure Direct - that should be alot of juice going to them?

[-DLS-]

Originally Posted by callas01

DLS,

I played Alternative Rock on the Totem Sttafs and the Arros. Now the Arros sound a bit narrow because of their diminutive size, however they both played John Mayer and Incubis and other rock music I played especially well. They do all sound a little different, from the ones I had heard.

Now as you know, I obviously like the more laidback sound(Energy Owner), so the Totems are high on my list. Now the Dynaudios have better mid-range and more of a neutral sound, and I think they have some of the best mid-range that I have heard around $1500-2000.... Dynaudio is by far the most coherent speaker I have heard. This is a major reason why I am between these to speaker companies.

Yeah I really wanna hear the Dyns.. They have one dealer that I know of in Edmonton but it's not usually the area we visit but I'll see If I can sneak away for a bit next time. It's good with the Totem dealer since they got the whole line so I can just bring whatever speakers in their nice demo room to do a good comparison.

I listen to different music from Rock Alternative as well, some Classic rock, some Modern Jazz, Coffee House type, Electronic, House, Latin, Reggae, R&B, Hip Hop, Even Old School West Coast Gangsta Rap when sh!t was good! Right now the 100's are pretty good all around I'm not sure why I even want another 2 channel setup. Just to have something upstairs away from the HT I guess. But I do wanna make it nice since it is only gonna be 2 speakers..

[aces high]

Originally Posted by -DLS-

I don't know what loud is to you but at my seating position with an SPL meter I can listen to average 95db's with up to 115db peaks. I don't do that often but to me that is loud. my normal listening is between 80-90 db's depending on the music or movie. At louder volumes I don't get any compression or distortion.. I only sit about 7-8 feet from the mains, 6 feet from the CC-690 and 5 feet from the Studio 40's so 100db's usually is between -10 and -15 on my Marantz I l watch movies mostly between -15 to -20. Just watched Bourne Identity yesterday and it has a wicked audio track! I watched that LOUD and the speakers handled everything nicely!

Anyway hope it all works out for you. My room is probably alot different from yours but I still do think an amp might help even with an SC-07 since you got a full 7.1 setup.. How do the 100's sound alone in Pure Direct - that should be alot of juice going to them?

Home Theater Mag measured the SC-07 at two channels driven 148w per channel 0.1% distortion, five channels driven 120w per channel 0.1% distortion, seven channels driven 106w per channel 0.1% distortion all these measurements are at 8ohms. The 100's have dips below 4ohms which is where I think the Pioneer struggles, it just can't supply enough current. I sit about 11 ft away from my display, all three fronts are the same distance away. I can take it up to about -10 for two channel and -14 for movies before it begins to complain. It's THX Ultra 2 certified which means it can play ref levels from 10ft away in a 3200 cubic ft room, my room is 3400 cubic ft and I sit 1 ft further back. That's only with THX certified speakers which roll off at 80hz, so I'm right on the edge of what it can do. When I had Monitors it drove them all day long to really high levels without even getting warm, now it starts to heat up pretty good .Next weekend I'll try to borrow an amp and see how it sounds, all the while lusting after the Seatons.

[i JACK o]

Originally Posted by aces high

I'm thinking of selling my 7.1 Studio v5 setup and just wondering what the asking price should be. The speakers are between 1yr and 2 months in age. I'm just looking for some opinions on what it's worth, I have an idea of what I want but that does always translate into what it will sell for. The system is as folllows Studio 100 v5, cc690 v5, adp 590 v5, Studio 20 v5 with j29 stands and Sub 15 with the Perfect Bass Kit. I would also like to include my Pioneer Elite SC-07. I would prefer to sell it as a package but would part it out for the right price, all the speakers are rosenut finish and are in mint condition. The Paradigms sound great but I'm thinking of going with something else, but that all depends on how much I can get for this system. I think I would like to try a Seaton Sound system next.

idk if youll be able to sell it as a package, youd probaly make more off selling seperate. if the package deal doesnt work out for you id loveeee to take that 690 off your hands, maybe keep me in mind

[aces high]

Originally Posted by i JACK o

idk if youll be able to sell it as a package, youd probaly make more off selling seperate. if the package deal doesnt work out for you id loveeee to take that 690 off your hands, maybe keep me in mind

I'm going to test it with an amp first and maybe another one of these.

[-DLS-]

Originally Posted by aces high

Home Theater Mag measured the SC-07 at two channels driven 148w per channel 0.1% distortion, five channels driven 120w per channel 0.1% distortion, seven channels driven 106w per channel 0.1% distortion all these measurements are at 8ohms. The 100's have dips below 4ohms which is where I think the Pioneer struggles, it just can't supply enough current. I sit about 11 ft away from my display, all three fronts are the same distance away. I can take it up to about -10 for two channel and -14 for movies before it begins to complain. It's THX Ultra 2 certified which means it can play ref levels from 10ft away in a 3200 cubic ft room, my room is 3400 cubic ft and I sit 1 ft further back. That's only with THX certified speakers which roll off at 80hz, so I'm right on the edge of what it can do. When I had Monitors it drove them all day long to really high levels without even getting warm, now it starts to heat up pretty good .Next weekend I'll try to borrow an amp and see how it sounds, all the while lusting after the Seatons.

Yeah if it didn't get warm with the Monitors and does now with the Studios it should tell you something.. Last summer I was actually gonna get an XPA-2 or two XPA-1's for the 100's and let the XPA-3 handle the center and surrounds. I don't know why I wanted it - the XPA-3 handles the 100's just fine.. I guess all the talk and reading on the forums can do that to you. For you though it sounds like you would benefit from adding one for sure..

I still wonder though since they have no problems at the loudest volumes now - if more power will make that much of a difference. Instead of buying amp amp/s I switched my receiver from a Yamaha HTR-6190(130wpc) to a Marantz SR8002(125wpc) and I think the difference that switch made is probably bigger than the XPA-2 and maybe even the XPA-1's could have done for my system. I guess others have claimed that the different amps have a different sound to them - I think the pre/pro though would have more of an affect on that though. I've tried higher end bi-wire cables, isolation/dampening and other little tweaks but the most effective changes for me were simple things like speaker placement.. room acoustics has also helped alot in my room. My room could probably do alot better with bass and sub placement but it sounds good enough that I don't wanna mess around with it since space is limited.

How big is your room? Can't remember if you already mentioned it..

Originally Posted by aces high

I'm going to test it with an amp first and maybe another one of these.

How do those sound? I was thinking of picking up used but mint dual Sub 12's with a PBK kit off a member on the other forum but I would have to get rid of my subs first which might be hard to do. You think $2200cdn is a good deal for the duals with the kit?

[i JACK o]

what finishis it in? if its 2200cdn after shipping then id say its a good deal, the sub 12 retails for 2000$ in the states.

[-DLS-]

Originally Posted by i JACK o

what finishis it in? if its 2200cdn after shipping then id say its a good deal, the sub 12 retails for 2000$ in the states.

Both Black wood finish.. And no shipping just a 3 hour drive to the city.

I know it's a good price off MSRP but I'm wondering if it's a good price compared to getting dual SVS or others in the same price range. I've never heard the Sub 12's and don't know anyone with experience with them vs the other ID brands.

I think I'm gonna go snoop around the subwoofer forums..

[i JACK o]

Originally Posted by -DLS-

Both Black wood finish.. And no shipping just a 3 hour drive to the city.

I know it's a good price off MSRP but I'm wondering if it's a good price compared to getting dual SVS or others in the same price range. I've never heard the Sub 12's and don't know anyone with experience with them vs the other ID brands.

I think I'm gonna go snoop around the subwoofer forums..

one of my friends have dual pb-13 ultras and to be honest, they out preform my servo v2's

but the sub 12s do look awesome and would match your front stage, but im not sure if you would take looks over performance

[solarrdadd]

Originally Posted by i JACK o

one of my friends have dual pb-13 ultras and to be honest, they out preform my servo v2's

but the sub 12s do look awesome and would match your front stage, but im not sure if you would take looks over performance

we make the mistake of doing that with women everyday!

I say remember that old starfish chicken of the sea tuna commercial,

"sorry Charlie, we don't want tuna with good taste, we want tuna that taste good!"

words to live by for me!

[i JACK o]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

we make the mistake of doing that with women everyday!

I say remember that old starfish chicken of the sea tuna commercial,

"sorry Charlie, we don't want tuna with good taste, we want tuna that taste good!"

words to live by for me!

maybe ill get wiser with age but at the moment i lean towards looks and try my best not to sacrifice too much in the performance department

[Ryan Peddle]

Originally Posted by aces high

Home Theater Mag measured the SC-07 at two channels driven 148w per channel 0.1% distortion, five channels driven 120w per channel 0.1% distortion, seven channels driven 106w per channel 0.1% distortion all these measurements are at 8ohms. The 100's have dips below 4ohms which is where I think the Pioneer struggles, it just can't supply enough current. I sit about 11 ft away from my display, all three fronts are the same distance away. I can take it up to about -10 for two channel and -14 for movies before it begins to complain. It's THX Ultra 2 certified which means it can play ref levels from 10ft away in a 3200 cubic ft room, my room is 3400 cubic ft and I sit 1 ft further back. That's only with THX certified speakers which roll off at 80hz, so I'm right on the edge of what it can do. When I had Monitors it drove them all day long to really high levels without even getting warm, now it starts to heat up pretty good .Next weekend I'll try to borrow an amp and see how it sounds, all the while lusting after the Seatons.

Ace, how long have you had the 100s? I have had mine now for 3 months and a bass is slowly coming out of them. And I drive them bi-amped with my M25. Si basically each speaker is seeing 160w to the tweeter (or whatever the tweeter asks for) and 160w to the mid and woofers.

Looking at the spec of my M25 vs the SC07 is impressive. 7 X 160 watts Full Disclosure Power, 20Hz - 20kHz, at less than 0.03THD with all channels driven simultaneously into 8/4 Ohms. And I honestly hear no distortion at extremely loud (louder than I would listen) volumes.

But power might not be the whole problem. I still feel there is more to get out of these speakers. One thing I know for sure is that I get good bass at higher volumes, but it is tougher to get a lower volumes.

I use my Sub12 for movies all the time (unless the wife goes to bed), and when I listen to music, the sub12 goes off and the 100s are in LARGE mode.

A co-worker of mine has Monitor Audio speaker (the model that would be considered the equivalent to the 100s) and he has said on a number of occasions that he gets stunning bass out of his speaker alone, but it took over a year of owning them to really start to lossen up and play really deep and loud. So I simply keep using them in large mode and pump of music when I can and keep letting them break in.

[callas01]

Originally Posted by aces high

Have you ever heard Totems with any tube gear? When I'm ready to do my two channel system something warm and laid back would be what I'm looking for.

Yeah I heard them only on tube gear with lossless music being played from a laptop and via cd music I had with me..... I loved the Sttafs.... They are excellent... the bass is very good, Mid-range is very good, quick, accurate, slightly warm but mostly uncolored, the highs are laidback but very detailed and get all the highs out of music. I loved the Sttafs.... the Arros would be great in a small room, they have bass that you wouldn't expect to come from a 4.5" driver... highs are very good and the mid-range is very good, not as good as the Sttafs, but very good for any $1300 speaker I have heard.

The Dynaudio Excites were still a little Dark sounding because they hadn't yet been fully broke in, but they had very good mid-range, they take about 200-300 hrs to break in, and I was told they were about 100-150 hrs, the mid-range was equal to the totems, but the bass wasn't fully broke-in.... but it was still pretty damn good. the highs were excellent. When I asked the dealer to hear the Dyn... he just smiled and said, the best mid-range, and most coherent speaker you can get. And they sounded awesome, even without full break in.

[lDlisturb3d]

Hey guys bad news, until i can afford the Studio series i think im going to with PSB, they look awesome i just need to hear them now, But ive heard nothing but good things from them.

Please state your opinion. Im all ears for ideals.

[azereus]

Originally Posted by lDlisturb3d

Hey guys bad news, until i can afford the Studio series i think im going to with PSB, they look awesome i just need to hear them now, But ive heard nothing but good things from them.

Please state your opinion. Im all ears for ideals.

I don't really see that being bad news at all, as long as you get something you're happy with.

I auditioned PSB when I bought my speakers and I really liked what I heard. The only thing that ruled them out was a problem I had with the dealer, not the speakers themselves.

What models are you looking at?