Ratatouille, why DD 5.1 sounds better PCM 5.1?

[GotToyota?]

So if my PS3 is hooked up to my receiver via digital optical, what should I set it to for both the BD sound and game sound?

I've had it on bitstream and I always set it to the uncompressed audio track on whichever movie I'm watching, because it seems to sound much better.

-Matt

[b00st]

Originally Posted by Gizmo99

Receiver: Yamaha Rx-v1800
Player : PS3
Connection: PS3 to Receiver over HDMI (HDMI 1.3)

My PS3 is set to BitStream in BluRay Audio Setting Menu. Watching the movie in DD 5.1 (turned it on through the BD disc) was much better (louder, pronounced and more clear) than when I turned on PCM from the BluRay Disc. Why is that? I thought PCM sounded much more superior than DD?

However, I tried changing the PS3 setting to LPCM (instead of bitstream) and turn on PCM from the BluRay Disc. The sound was pretty much but not as good as DD.

Outcome:

Ps3 set to PCM + BluRay Disc set to PCM = Pretty good
Ps3 set to BitStream + BluRay Disc set to PCM = weak
Ps3 set to PCM + BluRay Disc set to DD = weak
Ps3 set to BitStream + BluRay set to DD = The best

Question:

When both PS3 and Disc are matched (DD to DD , PCM to PCM). It sounded okay. But what does it mean when its mixed? Ie: when PS3=Bitstream and BD=PCM ? or when PS3=PCM and BD=DD ?


Also, what setting on the PS3 should I leave it to
Thanks

I have the same setup. 1800 connected to a PS3. i don't recall this being the case with ratatioulle...but i will double check tonight when i get home and post back up.

[Gizmo99]

Thanks! that would be great.

Try

1) PS3 set to PCM + PCM on BluRay and then compare
2) PS3 with BitStream + DD 5.1 on BluRay

PLEASE let me know what your results are

Originally Posted by b00st

I have the same setup. 1800 connected to a PS3. i don't recall this being the case with ratatioulle...but i will double check tonight when i get home and post back up.

[ClaytonMG]

There deffinately shouldn't be any difference between setting the PS3 to PCM and selecting PCM for the audio and then setting it to Bitstream and selecting PCM on the audio. Those 2 things should be the exact same thing.

I was testing Ratatouille yesterday actually and noticed some major differences between the Dolby EX track and the PCM track. The biggest difference I noticed is that the PCM track has much better imaging. If you take a listen to the parts where the narator is speaking, it comes out all 3 of the front channels. On the Dolby track, it doesn't sound right. On the PCM, it sounds much more together and solid. The Dolby track is louder, but once you level match, there shouldn't be any reason for the Dolby track to out perform the PCM track.

[ClaytonMG]

Originally Posted by kingofgrills

Ps3 set to PCM + BluRay Disc set to PCM = Ideal settings, lossless audio will match film master soundtrack
Ps3 set to BitStream + BluRay Disc set to PCM = PS3 decodes as 2 ch. PCM, then Yamaha decodes with Dolby Pro Logic IIX, the non-discrete surround format. It sucks.
Ps3 set to PCM + BluRay Disc set to DD = PS3 decodes lossy DD track to 2 channel PCM. Yamaha decodes with Dolby Pro Logic IIX. See above.
Ps3 set to BitStream + BluRay set to DD = Matches lossy compressed audio from DVD. Harsher midrange and treble with less dynamic range than linear PCM or Dolby TrueHD.

In a nutshell, keep your PS3 set to PCM, and always choose DolbyTrue HD or PCM 5.1 from your Blu-ray audio menu. Don't choose DTS-HD Master Audio tracks, because your PS3 cannot yet decode them.

All this is true for the most part. But if you are using HDMI and switch the audio out on the PS3 to PCM and listen to a PCM track, it doesn't decode it as 2 channels. It'll decode the full 5.1.

[Gizmo99]

Thanks for sharing your results.

The chapter I tested this was with the called "Paper" something. Its when the rat gets chased by that cook while its trying to escape with the paper.
I tested it with PCM versus DD and the DD track sounded more loud (as you said) and more vocals came through the center channel.

I will give it a try after volume match tonight.

Originally Posted by ClaytonMG

There deffinately shouldn't be any difference between setting the PS3 to PCM and selecting PCM for the audio and then setting it to Bitstream and selecting PCM on the audio. Those 2 things should be the exact same thing.

I was testing Ratatouille yesterday actually and noticed some major differences between the Dolby EX track and the PCM track. The biggest difference I noticed is that the PCM track has much better imaging. If you take a listen to the parts where the narator is speaking, it comes out all 3 of the front channels. On the Dolby track, it doesn't sound right. On the PCM, it sounds much more together and solid. The Dolby track is louder, but once you level match, there shouldn't be any reason for the Dolby track to out perform the PCM track.

[Canada]

PCM 5.1 if you can get it should bury DD 5.1 and and incase it in concreat. To me the PCM track on Ratatouille was head and shoulders above the Dolby Digital.

[Canada]

Originally Posted by GotToyota?

So if my PS3 is hooked up to my receiver via digital optical, what should I set it to for both the BD sound and game sound?

I've had it on bitstream and I always set it to the uncompressed audio track on whichever movie I'm watching, because it seems to sound much better.

-Matt

exactly what I found when I was watching the movie over optical.

[saprano]

pcm is pcm, there is no decoding involved its already uncompressed. were as trueHD and dts-hd are losless compressed formats and need decoding when sent to the receiver to turn it back into its original form.(uncompressed)

[saprano]

infact there should be no change when swiching the ps3 between bitstream and linear pcm for the reson's i said above.

[lildon24]

i got a TX-705.. i dont understand why folks having problems with lossless PCM vs lossy Dolby Digital 5.1 about the same film i owned.

Set it to PCM Multichannel on digital input of your receiver of HDMI with PS3...

While watching film.. make sure the option is set to Linear PCM.

If you going to watch a regular DVD with DD5.1/EX or DTS5.1/DTS-ES 6.1, you can set it to bitstream and the light will show up since it aint no blu-ray movie playing

If you gonna watch Blu-ray, set it to LPCM

or if the blu-ray only have lossly DD5.1 or DTS5.1 u can set it to bitstream

LPCM always does the lossless sound quality since it is the PS3 that doesnt decode lossless through bitstream.

Look for a different blu-ray player with lossless bistream.

I am fine with my PS3 cause it is future proof.

[jd13]

Originally Posted by kingofgrills

Ps3 set to BitStream + BluRay Disc set to PCM = PS3 decodes as 2 ch. PCM

This is absolutely not a true statement. If you choose the PCM track while your PS3 is set to bitstream, it sends out the multichannel PCM track. That only happens if you are hooked up via toslink.

[jd13]

Originally Posted by Gizmo99

What happens if I set my PS3 to PCM and I have bitstream on my BluRay

Not sure I understand. If you are asking, what happens when I set my PS3 to PCM and choose the DD track on the BD, then what would happen is the PS3 decodes the DD and sends it out as multichannel PCM.

[jd13]

Originally Posted by JimSD

These 2 pieces of advice seem to contradict. I have mine set like jd13 for exactly the same reasons and I'm pretty sure I'm getting multi-channel PCM to my Onkyo 705 receiver when I choose an LPCM track on a BD. Did I misinterpret kingofgrills post?

Exactly JIM. I replied to that statement toward the end of the thread. His statement is just wrong.

If anyone has questions on this, they really need to go to AVS Forum to the One-and-Only PS3 as Blu-Ray Player Thread

Sorry I have to say this, but there is a great deal of correct information there since it focuses less on the coolness of BD and more on the technical side of things.

[jd13]

Originally Posted by GotToyota?

So if my PS3 is hooked up to my receiver via digital optical, what should I set it to for both the BD sound and game sound?

I've had it on bitstream and I always set it to the uncompressed audio track on whichever movie I'm watching, because it seems to sound much better.

-Matt

Toslink, aka digital optical, cannot handle next generation sound streams. It sounds loud and cool because your receiver is matrixing a 2.0 channel PCM. You should leave it on bitstream and always choose the legacy, DD 5.1, DTS, DD EX, soundtracks to get the best sound from your movie.

[jd13]

Originally Posted by ClaytonMG

There deffinately shouldn't be any difference between setting the PS3 to PCM and selecting PCM for the audio and then setting it to Bitstream and selecting PCM on the audio. Those 2 things should be the exact same thing.

I was testing Ratatouille yesterday actually and noticed some major differences between the Dolby EX track and the PCM track. The biggest difference I noticed is that the PCM track has much better imaging. If you take a listen to the parts where the narator is speaking, it comes out all 3 of the front channels. On the Dolby track, it doesn't sound right. On the PCM, it sounds much more together and solid. The Dolby track is louder, but once you level match, there shouldn't be any reason for the Dolby track to out perform the PCM track.

Thanks for your comments, Clayton. I mirrored them. There seems to be some confusion about the sound output on this thread.

[jd13]

Originally Posted by saprano

infact there should be no change when swiching the ps3 between bitstream and linear pcm for the reson's i said above.

-Over HDMI-

Except that the PS3 decodes the Dolby TrueHD internally. To get this track, you must set PS3 to PCM, otherwise you are only getting the DD 5.1 core. Otherwise, your statement is correct. Right now, this is the one exception. If Sony gets on the ball with internal DTSHD decoding, there will be 2 exceptions.

-Over optical/toslink-

Not enough bandwidth for Dolby TrueHD. You will only get DD 5.1 core so leave it at bitstream.

[jd13]

Originally Posted by lildon24

LPCM always does the lossless sound quality since it is the PS3 that doesnt decode lossless through bitstream.

That made about 50% sense

[mikenike]

Originally Posted by jd13

-Over HDMI-

Except that the PS3 decodes the Dolby TrueHD internally. To get this track, you must set PS3 to PCM, otherwise you are only getting the DD 5.1 core. Otherwise, your statement is correct. Right now, this is the one exception. If Sony gets on the ball with internal DTSHD decoding, there will be 2 exceptions.

-Over optical/toslink-

Not enough bandwidth for Dolby TrueHD. You will only get DD 5.1 core so leave it at bitstream.

Dolby TrueHD does not have a "core" track, only DTS-HD MA. When you choose a TrueHD track, but bitstream it, the PS3 will play a separate legacy track. That's why any BD with a TrueHD track must always have a legacy track, whether or not it is labeled on the box. However, whenever a movie has a DTS-HD MA track, the PS3 will always play that track as a degraded form. DTS-HD MA is based purely on building upon older technology, and this is one reason why it has taken so long for a decoder for the PS3 to come out; it's too complex. TrueHD is a little easier for the PS3 to work with: If you can play TrueHD, do so, but if you can't, play something else.

[saprano]

Originally Posted by jd13

-Over HDMI-

Except that the PS3 decodes the Dolby TrueHD internally. To get this track, you must set PS3 to PCM, otherwise you are only getting the DD 5.1 core. Otherwise, your statement is correct. Right now, this is the one exception. If Sony gets on the ball with internal DTSHD decoding, there will be 2 exceptions.

-Over optical/toslink-

Not enough bandwidth for Dolby TrueHD. You will only get DD 5.1 core so leave it at bitstream.

yea thats what i was talking about, you only have change settings when the sound format is in trueHD or any other track that requier's decoding. but if the movie is in uncompressed pcm you wont have to change anything because their's nothing to decode, its raw data.