E3 2012: Interview: David Cage on why Beyond isn't another Heavy Rain
By Timm Clark for CVG UK
Most of E3's truly stunning games are destined for next-gen platforms, games like Star Wars: 1313 and Watch Dogs. David Cage's Beyond: Two Souls looked equally incredible, but here's the amazing bit: it's running entirely on the PS3. How is this possible, and how does it work?
"People think we are going to have twenty levels of Jodie running in the forest riding the bike, which is absolutely not the case," David Cage tells us before the interview has even begun. "Because it's the only time you're running in the forest, it's the only time you're chased, it's the only time you're on a bike. Our aim was to make the game fully organic."
"So you really get the feeling you're not in a videogame but you are in a cinematic experience. Although it's interactive all the time, don't misunderstand me. I'm not saying it's not interactive. I'm just saying its organic, it's different, it's diverse."
The game plays out across 15 years, so we'll get to see the main character as a little girl. Did you also use Ellen Page for her, or did you have a child actress?
[Show spoiler]
We used a tiny Ellen Page! Sorry, sorry. Ellen is playing the character of Jodie between 14 and an adult. And the young version is played by a young actress, who's an American actress. She's eight or nine years old.
So, will it be like Heavy Rain, with dynamic gameplay and storytelling, where if you fail to make one quick-time event something else happens?
[Show spoiler]It's not so much about quick time events. I mean, it's exactly the same way as Heavy Rain. This is what I've not explained. What I've shown you here is just one walkthrough. It's just one version of a scene, and depending how you play, you will see many different things. You can get arrested in this scene, for example, and unlock an entirely new part of the scene that you've not seen before. And this is true of each scene. Each scene can be played in different ways and you can see different things. But the scale of the full story is the same depending on the actions and decisions that you make. It's not about succeeding or failing, it's about what you do, what you decide, what you choose. You will have consequences in your life. So this is what is really important.
At the moment there seems to be the same sort of button prompts as Heavy Rain...
[Show spoiler]This has the same interface at the moment. That may still change before the end, (but) this is not the same gameplay. In Heavy Rain, where Jayden was chased in the market, for example, you were just evading the cops. He was running on his own, he was choosing his gun on his own, you were just choosing prompts. Here, when she's in the forest, you are controlling Jodie. When she runs on the slope, when she runs in the forest, when she runs in the train, wherever she is. You're in control all the time and the prompts are used much more like in God of War.
How large was that area?
Large.
Could she have run a long way left and right?
[Show spoiler]Of course, of course. Again, we just chose one path, we just showed one way, but you are almost free to go wherever you want all the time. This is something I can spend two hours explaining. You won't get it until you've played it, actually. But the big difference also with Heavy Rain is we have much more exploration in, beyond that we which we had on Heavy Rain. Heavy Rain was mainly set in small environments or in small houses.
Interesting. So there's going to be a greater sense of scale this time?
[Show spoiler]In Beyond you will have a mix of different types of areas. You will have a lot of exploration. There are many things that you will see and discover, and I think people will be surprised by the size of some areas and how detailed they can be, even though they are much, much bigger.
So, kind of following on from that, how did you approach this from a writing perspective? What kind of lessons did you take from Heavy Rain and Fahrenheit in terms of the way you make scenes work? And how has you philosophy changed since Heavy Rain?
[Show spoiler]I wouldn't say the philosophy has changed since Heavy Rain. It's a different story in a different style and a different genre, with a different balance of action and narrative and adventure. And it's just a different flavour, and I think improved in all areas. We will talk properly about the technology at some point, because that also improves the way it's filmed. But the idea is not to create another videogame, that plays like a videogame and looks like a videogame, where you got, you know, a character in cycles that moves like this. We want to create something that's fully organic, in a matter of animations but also in a matter of storytelling.
Can you expand on that?
[Show spoiler]So we tried to create something completely different where it becomes an emotional journey; where you leave with this character and you start your life, you spend time with them, you share how she feels, and your actions with her will have consequences. But you will also discover this entity, about what's on the other side, because this game is really about what's on the other side. This game is about death, it's about what will happen to us after we die. And depending on how you play, this is something Jodie may or may not discover.
How has your approach to scripting changed for Beyond?
[Show spoiler]What I tried to create is a story in which you feel you are free, and in which you feel that each time you do something there is a logical consequence to your actions. So this is how I feel. Now, what's new compared to Heavy Rain? Is there a sandbox aspect to it, where it's less driven. It's a little bit more open. It's not the case all the time, but what I tried to create is the illusion. Every time you forget that this is videogame with a programmer and in pixels, then (claps hands) I'll be happy. I'll make you forget that this is a game. I want you just to forget about everything and just be with Jodie.
So again, what is tricky for me is to tell you about these themes and tell you about emotions. We need to start with something, and starting with an action scene, which is probably the most unexpected thing from Quantic Dream, we just wanted to see how what we learned about narrative, about cinematography, could be applied to an action sequence. Could we really create the sense that this is a manhunt? That you need to run for your life, that you have dogs on you, and you have cops, but also (we wanted to create) a strange feeling of this tiny girl who seems so fragile and vulnerable, who has real power in her. This is all. These are some of the themes that we wanted to talk about.
You talk about the young character, but what about Aiden? Do we switch characters?
[Show spoiler]Sometimes the story triggers the fact that, yeah, you need to be Aiden. But sometimes you can switch. Most of the time you can switch. What I want to say is that Jodie evolves through time, but Aiden also changes. His personality will change depending on what you did - and you'll want to establish this relationship.
What about the relationship between the two? Can they talk to each other?
[Show spoiler]You know, I've always been fascinated by people talking to no-one, to an invisible friend. I think there's something really weird about this. This is where the idea came from with Jodie.
How do Aiden's powers work? When he was getting rid of the SWAT guys, how is that power limited? If you can just possess anyone it would be quite easy.
[Show spoiler]I try to have as little mechanics as I can, because I don't like mechanics. Mechanics are the opposite of life. Life is organic, it's chaotic. It's not like a set of rules, so this is what I try to do in my work. But we have a couple of rules, and one rule is that depending on the aura, the colour of the aura, you know what you can do with people. Orange auras allow you to possess them and red auras allow you to shock them - so you can kill them. But all this is not like a set of rules, it's not set in stone - it's our mechanics. What you can do with Aiden depends on the age of Jodie. His power grows. But it also depends on the mental state of Jodie. If she's really tired, if she's really in bad shape, Aiden's power gets lower and lower. So it really depends.
There's no actual physical skill to using him, though? If he's got an orange aura you can possess him. You don't have to do anything?
Yes, you have to play with sticks. There is a little timed gameplay with the sticks.
It seems like Aiden is only coming out when Jodie is about to get caught, like with the dogs. Does the player need to fail for Aiden to come out?
[Show spoiler]Something's that's established very early on in the story is Aiden cannot interact with living beings. So she cannot blast people, she can only blast objects. So that's the big difference. We really play with this rule and try to create different situations where Jodie has to get rid of the dogs on her own, or sometimes she can get different objects to get rid of people.
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Beyond: Two Souls
Hope it doesn't get pushed to 2014. Cage seemed awful vague about a release date around E3... "So, when's it coming out?" "2013." Gee, thanks for that.
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