PS3 to get DTS HD MA confirmed by PM!

[skrill]

Originally Posted by Grubert

But no PC, regardless of chipset, will uncompress .zip files differently than the others. In other words, if you take a .zip file and uncompress it on five different PCs, the uncompressed file will be bit-for-bit identical (and also identical to the original file).

My point exactly.

[Scorxpion]

Originally Posted by kolasi

great news. just hope its true.

You can expect everything from a PS3 and it is already confirmed by three insiders ,Patient is the key.

let's back to history of Playstation3 ,Do you expect it to upconvert your DVD video! Do you expect it to play Blu-RAY discs as it should be!Do you expect it to be profile 1.1 and 2.0...

Everything comes true and DTSHDMA audio is one of them...

[unreal1080p]

Originally Posted by Grubert

But no PC, regardless of chipset, will uncompress .zip files differently than the others. In other words, if you take a .zip file and uncompress it on five different PCs, the uncompressed file will be bit-for-bit identical (and also identical to the original file).

I think uncompressing a file on a PC vs. the subtleties of high end audio to the human ear as it pertains to the possible ill effects of the decompressing and recreating the original lossless experience of the original master are two vastly different things.

What i'm saying is SHIT happens and no amount of certifications or math can change that (not saying it happens all the time... just saying it happens). There is NOTHING wrong with compression and in theory lossless codecs "should" be just that... lossless... but experience has thought me not to blindly trust "theory" and "certifications" as there are always things in the implementation that can go wrong... which is why I rated Uncompressed PCM audio higher in my rankings then DTS-HD MA... it's a simple as that. I FULLY expect DTS-HD MA to sound EVERY BIT AS GOOD as LCPM but, it is entirely possible that something at the player level or the A/V receiver level may deter from that happening (hopefully not the case... but you never know...).

[skrill]

Originally Posted by unreal1080p

I never said DTS was'nt the authority on DTS. What i'm saying is don't blindly trust a device or chipset that says it's certified (regardless of what that certification may be). Who gave the certification? Are they truly and completely 100% certified? Many have used a partial certification to label their products fully certified and then never get called on it. What i'm saying is read many reviews after a product is released to see if it lives up to it's claims (in general) and actually funtions the way it's supposed to in REAL WORLD APPLICATIONS.

DTS would do the certification in this case. Before any player or receiver (or other component) gets to wear any Dolby or DTS trademark it must pass a certification process administered by the relevant trademark holder (and codec developer). In the case of my Onkyo TX-SR805 -- that product would have been certified by Dolby to decode TrueHD (and all other relevant Dolby codecs) and DTS to decode DTS-MA (and all other relevant DTS codecs). Onkyo doesn't get to simply put the badge on the case because they think it looks nice.

If a CE were to simply slap the badge on the device (without putting the device through the process), they would be in for a very rude legal battle with relevant trademark holder.

Do you question DTS, Inc.'s ability to certify products to decode a DTS codec?

[Grubert]

Originally Posted by unreal1080p

I think uncompressing a file on a PC vs. the subtleties of high end audio to the human ear as it pertains the possible ill effects of the decompressing and recreating the original lossless experience of the original master are two vastly different things.

What i'm saying is SHIT happens and no amount of certifications or math can change that (not saying it happens all the time... just saying it happens).

The original is PCM. PCM has no subtleties. It is a series of finite quantized digital samples.

[skrill]

Originally Posted by unreal1080p

I think uncompressing a file on a PC vs. the subtleties of high end audio to the human ear as it pertains to the possible ill effects of the decompressing and recreating the original lossless experience of the original master are two vastly different things.

What i'm saying is SHIT happens and no amount of certifications or math can change that (not saying it happens all the time... just saying it happens). There is NOTHING wrong with compression and in theory lossless codecs "should" be just that... lossless... but experience has thought me not to blindly trust "theory" and "certifications" as there are always things in the implementation that can go wrong... which is why I rated Uncompressed PCM audio higher in my rankings then DTS-HD MA... it's a simple as that. I FULLY expect DTS-HD MA to sound EVERY BIT AS GOOD as LCPM but, it is entirely possible that something at the player level or the A/V receiver level may deter from that happening (hopefully not the case... but you never know...).

You are confusing digitial bitstream to digital PCM codec decoding with digital-to-analog decoding.

The former is simply a compressed series of 1s and 0s to an uncompressed series of 1s and 0s. There is one right answer.

The later has many variables that will be heard in final playback. Again - I have always said quality DACs play a big role in the audio experience.

[unreal1080p]

Originally Posted by skrill

Do you question DTS, Inc.'s ability to certify products to decode a DTS codec?

No and this has nothing to do with DTS.

I'm questionning XYZ company from using XYZ certification without merit and without the company it's claiming to be certified from ever finding out. If they do find out i'm questionning the company from having the ressources or follow through to go after them.

We've veered away from my main point so much it's not funny.

My main point is that I put LCPM higher on my list because it does'nt have to go through decompression... END OF STORY. It does'nt mean that DTS-HD MA can't be just as good... it should... but nothing guarantees me that unless I have the right player and/or the right A/V receiver that it will... which is why one must research his future player and/or A/V receiver of choice to make sure they perform their "advertised" functions PROPERLY!

[Sonny]

Guy's ...or Gall's?? PM each other, your screwing up EVERYBODY's DTS-HDMA Happiness

[skrill]

Originally Posted by Sonny

Guy's ...or Gall's?? PM each other, your screwing up EVERYBODY's DTS-HDMA Happiness

Actually -- I am just trying to keep misinformation about DTS-MA decoding (particularly -- in-player decoding) from being spread. I think it is relevant to thread readers.

But that's fine -- I've made my point.

[bajor27]

This is amazing news as I plan on buying a new surround sound system this year, and woiuld love to actually be able to hear it.

[cjb110]

Originally Posted by unreal1080p

I think uncompressing a file on a PC vs. the subtleties of high end audio to the human ear as it pertains to the possible ill effects of the decompressing and recreating the original lossless experience of the original master are two vastly different things.

What i'm saying is SHIT happens and no amount of certifications or math can change that (not saying it happens all the time... just saying it happens). There is NOTHING wrong with compression and in theory lossless codecs "should" be just that... lossless... but experience has thought me not to blindly trust "theory" and "certifications" as there are always things in the implementation that can go wrong... which is why I rated Uncompressed PCM audio higher in my rankings then DTS-HD MA... it's a simple as that. I FULLY expect DTS-HD MA to sound EVERY BIT AS GOOD as LCPM but, it is entirely possible that something at the player level or the A/V receiver level may deter from that happening (hopefully not the case... but you never know...).

Actually you do know, because they are lossless, its what the word means when applied to codecs. There has been no information lost or added during the compression or decompression. So LPCM, DTS-HD MA and TrueHD can all produce a digital signal that are bit for bit identical. So in terms of what's best audio wise its none of them and all of them.

Your point about implementation going wrong, isn't the fault of the codec just the lazy engineers and testers , so shouldn't not affect your rating if your doing it on quality alone.

In terms of what's best for BluRay well that's harder, its either DTS-HD MA or TrueHD. Why? Because they take up less space, which the studio can then fill with extras (or annoying additional language tracks! ).

If we then ranked just for the PS3 then until we get this wonderful new firmware, TrueHD is the best.

[unreal1080p]

Originally Posted by cjb110

Your point about implementation going wrong, isn't the fault of the codec just the lazy engineers and testers , so shouldn't not affect your rating if your doing it on quality alone.

I never said it would be the fault of the codec. I have and always maintained that DTS-HD MA "should" sound 100% the same as LCPM. I FULLY agree that IF it did go wrong, it would be the fault of lazy engineers and testers and/or greedy company executives trying to cut corners... for example: submitting a pristine model "A" prototype for DTS certification while turning around unbeknownst to DTS and produce a lesser quality "cut corners" version of the original prototype and mass produce and sell THAT version to the general public

Originally Posted by cjb110

In terms of what's best for BluRay well that's harder, its either DTS-HD MA or TrueHD. Why? Because they take up less space, which the studio can then fill with extras (or annoying additional language tracks! ).

I think, once the PS3 gets the DTS-HD MA update, that Blu-Ray movies should do away with Dolby TrueHD all together (Dialnorm is DA DEVIL! ) and concentrate on DTS-HD MA & LCPM with a preference for DTS-HD MA (good for the economy since consumers need to get players and A/V receivers compatible with the new codec... plus it leaves more space on the disc for extras in HD and what not).

Nerd Fight over

[mugen302005]

Sorry to interrupt your discussion, I'm at awe because I didn't know my ps3 could decode dolby true HD through pcm hdmi connection to a reciver capable of it. That alone would be nice but now you're talking about dts mater HD! That would be awesome news!!!

[Simplayer]

Originally Posted by unreal1080p

(Dialnorm is DA DEVIL! )

Why do you think that? The way I understand it is that it adjust the volume of the entire track so that dialogue is always at the same decibel level movie to movie. No compression or range control or anything like that, just sort of turning the volume up or down for you.

[Driver_King]

Originally Posted by paulyg

Does any one want to buy my 604? I've got the original box and the 604 is like brand new. My 705 already shipped. I'll make you a good deal

How much, if you're still wanting to sell it?

[Clark Kent]

Originally Posted by Simplayer

Why do you think that? The way I understand it is that it adjust the volume of the entire track so that dialog is always at the same decibel level movie to movie. No compression or range control or anything like that, just sort of turning the volume up or down for you.

It affects sound quality slightly when it is enabled on soundtracks. While the encoding tools for DTS-HD MA have Dial Norm as an option, it is turned off by default and the encoder has to specifically switch it on. Unfortunately the encoding tools for Dolby TrueHD leave Dial Norm on as a default. I've seen estimates that enabling Dial Norm on something like Dolby TrueHD can reduce the effective wordlength from 24 bit to 23 bit of the original soundtrack. Whenever the sound is altered it can affect fidelity.

[Simplayer]

Hm. Why would it do that?

[unreal1080p]

There is no need to understand the fine details of "why" --> some people argue that it makes no difference while others argue that it does and I don't think the matter will ever be settled... therefore, sufficient to know that most Dolby TrueHD soundtracks have dialnorm and that DTS-HD MA or LCPM are preferable to it because they don't and therefore are 100% identical to the original master (unlike Dolby TrueHD).

Read the reviews of "300" as it pertains to audio quality of the Dolby TrueHD soundtrack (HD DUD version) vs. the Uncompressed PCM soundtrack of the Blu-Ray version... NUFF SAID!

[Simplayer]

Why is always important.

[JasonR]

Originally Posted by unreal1080p

There is no need to understand the fine details of "why" --> some people argue that it makes no difference while others argue that it does and I don't think the matter will ever be settled... therefore, sufficient to know that most Dolby TrueHD soundtracks have dialnorm and that DTS-HD MA or LCPM are preferable to it because they don't and therefore are 100% identical to the original master (unlike Dolby TrueHD).

Read the reviews of "300" as it pertains to audio quality of the Dolby TrueHD soundtrack (HD DUD version) vs. the Uncompressed PCM soundtrack of the Blu-Ray version... NUFF SAID!

But Unreal, isn't DD+ all we really need?