As predicted, Vizio being sued by known universe for non-payment of royalties

[WickyWoo]

I must say that I agree that companies should be paid for their innovations. Why did they wait this long to sue? Why not sue the makers of the components that go into the Vizio TVs? Mandatory digital switchover.

Probably because they finally started including digital tuners in their sets (that would be where an MPEG2 decoder would come in), and they wanted to wait long enough for the damages they can claim to be decent sized to pay for itself.

Doesn't stop companies from outsourcing there. Why? If they don't then we wouldn't spend on their overpriced products manufactured here. I feel like a hypocrite sometimes. Still, I am a consumer. I love my Dr Martens boots and wouldn't trade them for the world......$120...made in China. Where was the savings passed to me ? Bloody....

The geographic location has nothing to do with it. It's the known business practices. As I said, Apex and Cyberhome pulled the exact same things, and like Vizio, they were a front of various Chinese OEMs

[m_tyson]

Vizio LCD TV maker Amtran says it paid royalties for MPEG-2 patents

Latest news
Max Wang, Taipei; Rodney Chan, DIGITIMES [Wednesday 11 June 2008]

Taiwan-based Amtran Technology, a major shareholder of US-based LCD TV vendor Vizio and also a major manufacturer for the brand, has stressed that it has already paid the royalties for MPEG-2 video compression technology.

Amtran was commenting on a lawsuit filed in the US against Vizio by competitors who accused it of violating MPEG-2 patents.

Amtran said for MPEG-2 it already paid the licensing fees to MPEG LA between the end of 2007 and the beginning of 2008.

But the company said it had yet to learn the details of the lawsuit, and therefore would not further comment on the issue. The lawsuit would not affect Vizio's TV sales in the US in the short term, it added.

Amtran has reported NT$5.34 billion (US$157.788 million) in May sales, up 5.5% from the same month in 2007.

[nitteo]

Originally Posted by mdm1699

Hey leave India out of this buddy . How do we say generic drugs for the parents and grandparents! HELLO!

My generic Cialis works well, thank you. Actually, my wife thanks you.

[Bobby Henderson]

Anyone looking to defend China and India in this thread ought to think about the fortune we have to spend for filling our gas tanks now.

A few fat cats in the United States made themselves even more filthy rich by outsourcing any industry they could to China and India. The results are the economies in both countries have over-heated with growth. The governments of both countries heavily subsidize commodities like gasoline. So demand there is soaring for cheap fuel while we get hit with ever rising prices for food, utilities, fuel and many more things. That's the price we're now having to pay for all those cheap products at Wal-Mart.

[m_tyson]

Originally Posted by BigBLUballz

Wonder if that is a loophole and can hold up

Not just a loophole. Patent holders are only entitled to collect royalties once on each component, and companies which subsequently use the parts in other products aren't liable for any additional royalties. This is known as patent exhaustion, and has been the rule in patent law for over 150 years. The plaintiffs, who are looking to lose more ground to Vizio in 2008, know this and brought suit anyway...

[mdm1699]

Originally Posted by Bobby Henderson

Anyone looking to defend China and India in this thread ought to think about the fortune we have to spend for filling our gas tanks now.

A few fat cats in the United States made themselves even more filthy rich by outsourcing any industry they could to China and India. The results are the economies in both countries have over-heated with growth. The governments of both countries heavily subsidize commodities like gasoline. So demand there is soaring for cheap fuel while we get hit with ever rising prices for food, utilities, fuel and many more things. That's the price we're now having to pay for all those cheap products at Wal-Mart.

I guess we should still be driving Model Ts or buggies here in the good ole USA Let me guess.......it doesn't apply to us and you probably work on Wall Street. I didn't know that they are/were the reason we crave gas-guzzlers, energy-sucking electronics, and oversized houses that use more and more resources to maintain.

[WickyWoo]

Taiwan-based Amtran Technology, a major shareholder of US-based LCD TV vendor Vizio and also a major manufacturer for the brand, has stressed that it has already paid the royalties for MPEG-2 video compression technology.

They wouldn't bother to bring the suit unless they have them cold

If they can't produce the cancelled checks, along with books that match the shipped unit figures (which undoubtedly don't match from the public records), theyr'e screwed

Read "major shareholder" as "owner" BTW.

[m_tyson]

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

They wouldn't bother to bring the suit unless they have them cold

If they can't produce the cancelled checks, along with books that match the shipped unit figures (which undoubtedly don't match from the public records), theyr'e screwed

Read "major shareholder" as "owner" BTW.

The suit was filed on June 2, hoping to take advantage of a ridiculous ruling by the Court of Appeal in the Quanta case. Now, the U.S. Supreme Court has "owned" the plaintiffs with the June 9 ruling in Quanta, reversing the Court of Appeal and setting things straight. I suspect Vizio is fine and the plaintiffs are looking for ways to save face.

[WickyWoo]

Waiting for a ruling in that case certainly would explain why it took so long, but it still doesn't change what almost certainly went on. These are standard business practices for the last 10 years by these companies, nothing has changed

Why do you think they don't have a repair network up and running? Because they don't plan on being around long enough to make it worthwhile to train outside techs.

[m_tyson]

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

Waiting for a ruling in that case certainly would explain why it took so long, but it still doesn't change what almost certainly went on. These are standard business practices for the last 10 years by these companies, nothing has changed

Why do you think they don't have a repair network up and running? Because they don't plan on being around long enough to make it worthwhile to train outside techs.

Because outside techs and brick & mortal repair shops are inefficient - for both manufacturer and consumer - and going the way of the dodo. Fedex/UPS door to door, print your own labels, and let the courier return the product for repair/replacement rather than lugging a 4 foot, 75 pound hunk of electronic in your own gas-guzzler down to the local mini-mall in your spare time.

[JJ]

JJs dos centavos:

Vizio made decent lower-tier televisions that never gave me any problems when I had it or the other people I know who had it. Then again, they weren't what you would call videophiles, and although I know better now - they are content with their purchase. Costco still sells them by the truckload. But then again, this has always been my stubborn standpoint with Vizio, despite what I've heard on these forums against them. They are acceptable enough for everyday people who want an HDTV and don't have the budget.

Now, as far as this lawsuit is concerned - if this is indeed the case, then it is a sad thing to bring Vizio down. But if it is a ploy as someone else said - to bring the "little guy" down - that's a different matter. Profit is profit - I particularly liked the comparison to automobile manufacturers and the whole Honda vs. Lexus thing. You pay for what you get.

[WickyWoo]

Because outside techs and brick & mortal repair shops are inefficient - for both manufacturer and consumer - and going the way of the dodo. Fedex/UPS door to door, print your own labels, and let the courier return the product for repair/replacement rather than lugging a 4 foot, 75 pound hunk of electronic in your own gas-guzzler down to the local mini-mall in your spare time.

Definately not, especially for large items like TVs. They're going to spend at least $60-80 to package and send your TV back and forth, which is probably more alone than they'd end up actually paying the local tech in fees.

Let me put it this way

For Christmas, I got a defective Pioneer upconverter DVD player. My brother did not keep the receipt for the item, and couldn't remember when he bought it, so BB wouldn't take a return for an exchange.

So it just took them 2 months to send the part out, and pay the tech $30 to install it. If they'd just shipped me the stupid board I could have put it in for free in 10 minutes and saved them a lot of money.

It costs $20 to even ship a DVD player back and forth via FedEx. How is that more efficient, especially with shipping prices only likely to go up?

Ubiquitous equipment like HDTVs are quickly becoming is simply too large of a volume for them to handle. While the installed base is small, it is cheaper to use their own hub places rather than mass tech training, but 2-3 years from now? Not so much

[BettiePage]

Originally Posted by Bobby Henderson

Anyone looking to defend China and India in this thread ought to think about the fortune we have to spend for filling our gas tanks now.

A few fat cats in the United States made themselves even more filthy rich by outsourcing any industry they could to China and India. The results are the economies in both countries have over-heated with growth. The governments of both countries heavily subsidize commodities like gasoline. So demand there is soaring for cheap fuel while we get hit with ever rising prices for food, utilities, fuel and many more things. That's the price we're now having to pay for all those cheap products at Wal-Mart.

ummm gas wouldnt be so expensive if you'd allow off shore oil drilling in the coastal states that now prohibit it and open up alaska to drilling as well... the US is sitting a loads of petro but wont drill for it and instead is dependent on foreign oil of it's own accord.

its fairly unrealistic for a 1st world nation to criticize other countries for industrializing as they grow.

[Luis_A51]

Originally Posted by BettiePage

ummm gas wouldnt be so expensive if you'd allow off shore oil drilling in the coastal states that now prohibit it and open up alaska to drilling as well... the US is sitting a loads of petro but wont drill for it and instead is dependent on foreign oil of it's own accord.

its fairly unrealistic for a 1st world nation to criticize other countries for industrializing as they grow.

Hes not criticizing them for indrustrializing, hes criticizing the governments for subsidizing fuel. Huge difference, and a valid point.

Also I doubt those offshore deposits would even make a dent on US oil consumption, let alone world wide. Oil is sold on an open market.

[SpikesBluBlooded]

Well, this is starting to get off-topic, but since I'm very much affected by the current situation (as I live in the US and have a car), I had to chime in: I think it's insane to disallow oil drilling off of our coasts for US based companies, but other nations are free to do so (China and Cuba in the Gulf, for example), and are signing long-term leases for the rights! So, let me get this straight, we'll refuse to drill oil off of our coasts (and I think you're wrong about putting a dent in our consumption, as the Gulf has arguably the largest concentration of accessible oil in the world), but we'll let a third party do it, then pay 10x as much to buy the oil back from them that they're drilling from off of our own coasts? How does that make sense? How is that environmentally solid policy? At least if we're doing the drilling, we get the benefit of lower cost fuel, as well as being able to regulate how the oil is taken from the Earth. I'd really like someone to explain this one to me, because I just don't get it...

[WickyWoo]

Please settle down the off topic political stuff

[NMErickson]

Originally Posted by Tarheel72

I have two that I got at Costco. One is a 42" plasma and one is a 37" LCD. I got both in the fall of 2006 so they are grandfathered as far as the "lifetime" Costco guarantee is concerned. I felt like with that kind of a safety net I was ok, especially if the company goes out of business. Having said that, they have not caused me any problem so far and I am pleased with the picture. Neither are primary TV's, one is in a bedroom and one in a gameroom. But for my purposes they have worked fine.

Agreed. When I purchased my Vizio I knew it was not going to be my last HDTV. Just for the meantime. I have kind of grown to it and like it. Since the prices are so good we really shouldnt lose much even if the worst happens and they go under. But overall, it's just a capable good not great HDTV set and great for gaming.

[m_tyson]

The local tech fee is a very tiny part of the cost of operating a local repair shop. For a leading HDTV seller in the U.S., like Vizio, it is far more efficient to run large central facilities and use high volume/discount cost courier services. Henry Ford would agree.

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

Definately not, especially for large items like TVs. They're going to spend at least $60-80 to package and send your TV back and forth, which is probably more alone than they'd end up actually paying the local tech in fees.

Let me put it this way

For Christmas, I got a defective Pioneer upconverter DVD player. My brother did not keep the receipt for the item, and couldn't remember when he bought it, so BB wouldn't take a return for an exchange.

So it just took them 2 months to send the part out, and pay the tech $30 to install it. If they'd just shipped me the stupid board I could have put it in for free in 10 minutes and saved them a lot of money.

It costs $20 to even ship a DVD player back and forth via FedEx. How is that more efficient, especially with shipping prices only likely to go up?

Ubiquitous equipment like HDTVs are quickly becoming is simply too large of a volume for them to handle. While the installed base is small, it is cheaper to use their own hub places rather than mass tech training, but 2-3 years from now? Not so much

[Squozen]

Originally Posted by Beta Man

Although I agree with you..... on all points.....

one thing doesn't have anything to do with the other....

If they stole technology from someone, and made it WORK WELL, and affordable, I'd buy it.... but they not only stole technology, they cut corners and made a crappy product.....

Hopefully you never make anything worthwhile in your life then, or the karma monkey will make sure it's stolen from you.

I don't buy Behringer products for the same reason - stealing ideas (well, complete designs in Behringer's case) is morally wrong.

[SpikesBluBlooded]

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

Please settle down the off topic political stuff