'Star Trek Beyond' - July 22, 2016

[stvn1974]

I normally don't care about or follow box office results but this is one time I hope the film bombs or under performs. After the third they should reboot it again with a competent director and writers or just let it die.

[Iron-Fisted Punk]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

Cap was in Tulsa, OK and Basic Instinct was in Wichita, KS.

I've had bad experiences in Tulsa with movie theaters. Especially the dollar theater.

"...a very special level of hell. A level they reserve for child molesters and people who talk at the theater."

[AaronJ]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

I normally don't care about or follow box office results but this is one time I hope the film bombs or under performs. After the third they should reboot it again with a competent director and writers or just let it die.

Yes, because if you're not interested in it, none of us should get to see more films by the same team.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

I normally don't care about or follow box office results but this is one time I hope the film bombs or under performs. After the third they should reboot it again with a competent director and writers or just let it die.

Just how many topics are you going to constantly threadcrap anyway?

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by jscoggins

That wasn't why it was awkward.

You know those moments in life when you're just so embarrassed you get a kind of tingly sensation, like it's so bad your body's giving you a squirt of adrenalin or something? That bit in STID was one of those times. Just.....ugh.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by MechaGodzilla

Not to mention he started mouth breathing heavily during the final quarter of the film, which wasn't just unpleasant to listen to but - not surprising considering he'd consumed a massive amount of popcorn, candy and chips prior - smelled bad. That was kinda annoying.

I'd imagine his corpse is still there.

[Geoff D]

And I tell you what, as parodied as that bit is in Wrath of Khan, it's actually a very smart beat because Kirk - as angry as he clearly is - turns it all the way up to 11 to convince Khan (over the comm) of his desperation and that he's beaten him. The scene is played to the hilt - especially with the cheesy "echoing in space" shot - so even when looking back you kinda forget that it plays a role in the story, whereas rageSpock's bit has no purpose other than to act as a dreadfully hammy callback. The filmmakers' defence might be "but it's also a dreadfully hammy scene in the original!" and while that's true it serves a purpose in the story other than for Shatner to overact, whereas the later example is the perfect metaphor for how misguided a Trek film STID is: it's loud, embarrassing and completely misses the point.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

The filmmakers' defence might be "but it's also a dreadfully hammy scene in the original!" and while that's true it serves a purpose in the story other than for Shatner to overact, whereas the later example is the perfect metaphor for how misguided a Trek film STID is: it's loud, embarrassing and completely misses the point.

True, it's sad that something that could have worked better with a subtle look, turned into a full-on nonsensical Hulk Out! We've gone from steely resolve to man-child freak outs ...

[WhySoBlu?]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

You know those moments in life when you're just so embarrassed you get a kind of tingly sensation, like it's so bad your body's giving you a squirt of adrenalin or something? That bit in STID was one of those times. Just.....ugh.

You guys across the pond may have a different term for it, but over here we call it "douche chills."

[Show spoiler]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBelT-Xi1CY

[Show spoiler]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1i-Yw7s-Pw

[Petra_Kalbrain]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

I normally don't care about or follow box office results but this is one time I hope the film bombs or under performs. After the third they should reboot it again with a competent director and writers or just let it die.

Epic fail on that one, pal.

Originally Posted by Geoff D

And I tell you what, as parodied as that bit is in Wrath of Khan, it's actually a very smart beat because Kirk - as angry as he clearly is - turns it all the way up to 11 to convince Khan (over the comm) of his desperation and that he's beaten him. The scene is played to the hilt - especially with the cheesy "echoing in space" shot - so even when looking back you kinda forget that it plays a role in the story, whereas rageSpock's bit has no purpose other than to act as a dreadfully hammy callback. The filmmakers' defence might be "but it's also a dreadfully hammy scene in the original!" and while that's true it serves a purpose in the story other than for Shatner to overact, whereas the later example is the perfect metaphor for how misguided a Trek film STID is: it's loud, embarrassing and completely misses the point.

Really? Because I saw that bit in ST:ID as being just as crucial a story device as it was in ST: WOK. More so just for Spock's character story than the overall story. However, a crucial and meaningful moment nonetheless. In fact, now that I think about the two in comparison, I see it's use in ST:ID as being more effective than in ST: WOK to be honest.

It is simultaneously the cementing moment of realization for Spock regarding the friendship that exists with Kirk AND the purging moment of Spock unapologetically accepting his emotional human side without the shame/embarrassment which he had associated it with his entire life previously.

[Geoff D]

So Spock has now stopped struggling against the thing that made him such a fascinating (no pun intended) character to begin with, i.e. his latent humanity? Gotcha.

[Petra_Kalbrain]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

So Spock has now stopped struggling against the thing that made him such a fascinating (no pun intended) character to begin with, i.e. his latent humanity? Gotcha.

I wouldn't say that he has stopped struggling against the thing that made him such a fascinating character. In that moment, yes... he let go completely. However, that doesn't mean that he will allow the floodgates to be open at all times. He is still instinctively going to be drawn to his previous ways and his upbringing. However, now, instead of being single-minded about emotion being completely unacceptable in every situation, he will be able to approach any situation with a judgement on whether emotion is acceptable or not. In fact, this "Hulk out" moment may prove to be a catalyst for him to properly gauge his emotional responses instead of just blocking them out completely. Or maybe it will be a catalyst for him to revert back to blocking them out completely out of fear of losing control again. There are so many possibilities...

Of course, we will have to wait and see what the ramifications of this are from the writers and actor perspective. It could all go terribly sour. However, I think that they will respect the character enough to not completely turn him into an uncontrolled emotional mess. It offers the opportunity to have the same old Spock character with a bit of a twist in certain aspects of his life.

[Bruisermoore]

Originally Posted by WhySoBlu?

You guys across the pond may have a different term for it, but over here we call it "douche chills."

Nobody calls it that. Well, maybe douche bags do.

[WhySoBlu?]

Originally Posted by Bruisermoore

Nobody calls it that. Well, maybe douche bags do.

It doesn't mean that the person feeling the chills is a douche. That wasn't a dig against Geoff in any way. It's that they're getting an awkward, uneasy, douchey vibe from the other person and what they're doing. Basically what Geoff described above.

If you're not American, you may not have heard the term and I can see how it could appear that I was calling Geoff a douche, but that's definitely not the case.

I remember getting douche chills when I first started watching Curb Your Enthusiasm, every time Larry David was... well being himself.


And it is a thing...

[Show spoiler]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otsK6cPFdc8

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Petra_Kalbrain

I wouldn't say that he has stopped struggling against the thing that made him such a fascinating character. In that moment, yes... he let go completely. However, that doesn't mean that he will allow the floodgates to be open at all times. He is still instinctively going to be drawn to his previous ways and his upbringing. However, now, instead of being single-minded about emotion being completely unacceptable in every situation, he will be able to approach any situation with a judgement on whether emotion is acceptable or not. In fact, this "Hulk out" moment may prove to be a catalyst for him to properly gauge his emotional responses instead of just blocking them out completely. Or maybe it will be a catalyst for him to revert back to blocking them out completely out of fear of losing control again. There are so many possibilities...

Of course, we will have to wait and see what the ramifications of this are from the writers and actor perspective. It could all go terribly sour. However, I think that they will respect the character enough to not completely turn him into an uncontrolled emotional mess. It offers the opportunity to have the same old Spock character with a bit of a twist in certain aspects of his life.

But he hulks out so much (I count three physical attacks in two movies, including one when he was a kid before he was "emotionally compromised", with the KHAAAAAAAAAN bit on top) it's getting to be a bit boring. For once, I'd love to see him using his brains to solve a problem rather than repeatedly hitting it in the face, or calling old Spock up for a quick look at the ol' Star Trek Alt. Universe playbook. As sad as it was when Nimoy passed away, at least it removes that avenue from the filmmakers.

Heck, it'd be something of a novelty to have a quiet, considered Spock who's inwardly a roiling mass of emotions. But they'll probably write him going through Pon Farr into the ST3 script so they can have him raging out yet again.

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

I normally don't care about or follow box office results but this is one time I hope the film bombs or under performs. After the third they should reboot it again with a competent director and writers or just let it die.

Fast 7 shows how competent Lin is, he is one of the top action director's working today

[Petra_Kalbrain]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

But he hulks out so much (I count three physical attacks in two movies, including one when he was a kid before he was "emotionally compromised", with the KHAAAAAAAAAN bit on top) it's getting to be a bit boring. For once, I'd love to see him using his brains to solve a problem rather than repeatedly hitting it in the face, or calling old Spock up for a quick look at the ol' Star Trek Alt. Universe playbook. As sad as it was when Nimoy passed away, at least it removes that avenue from the filmmakers.

Heck, it'd be something of a novelty to have a quiet, considered Spock who's inwardly a roiling mass of emotions. But they'll probably write him going through Pon Farr into the ST3 script so they can have him raging out yet again.

Who knows? Perhaps they will use all of your points and mine to decide that it is time to have Spock become far more strict on himself regarding his emotions? I've enjoyed what I have seen so far, and I'm going to remain optimistic that they will continue to make the character interesting in one way or another. However, I acknowledge that it is treading on a line that verges on a powder keg resting next to a camp fire.

[StingingVelvet]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

You know those moments in life when you're just so embarrassed you get a kind of tingly sensation, like it's so bad your body's giving you a squirt of adrenalin or something? That bit in STID was one of those times. Just.....ugh.

I have this sensation all the time when my wife is watching reality shows.

[Infernal King]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

Fast 7 shows how competent Lin is, he is one of the top action director's working today

Are you confusing Justin Lin with James Wan or are you saying than Furious 7 was sorely lacking Lin in the director's chair?

[dvdmike]

Originally Posted by Infernal King

Are you confusing Justin Lin with James Wan or are you saying than Furious 7 was sorely lacking Lin in the director's chair?

The latter, it was a mess