Need to run a question by others dealing with managed copy

[Scenic Labs]

Hello.
I'm new on this forum. I've been in the DVD, then HD DVD, and now Blu-ray industry for the last 10 years. I've been working on 3 simultaneous releases (Dec 1), for which I flagged the projects as allowing managed copy.

The ISAN Number was added to the project, and the MCMF.xml currently points to aacsla.com (default) with all files included. It is my intent to allow individuals to make personal copies as they see fit, since it's the kind of content that *in many cases* might actually work better off of a server (more seamless looping) or a Kaleidoscape type device (it's a 1080p screensaver type thing).

Anyway, my projects do not contain a menu item that would point to managed copy (and since there's no way to test it yet, I am not sure it would work). I guess I always expected that a device that supported managed copy would have the option in the firmware -- possibly even on the remote control and would check the AACS permissions on the server and allow a copy if it was the intent of the rightsholder.

Can anybody with experience the hardware side tell me if this is how your devices will work? I believe that BD decks would permit copies of my discs, but they would have to have a button on the remote or somewhere in the deck's firmware. Thanks!

Jason Rosenfeld
Scenic Labs

[Scenic Labs]

Well, I did some footwork on this and it *seems* to me that as long as I:

1) applied for an ISAN for each disc (done)
2) flagged the discs for managed copy permission (done)
3) ensured that the MCMF.xml file points to aacsla.com's managed copy server (done)

then managed copy should work. Of course, there is no hardware capable of testing this. I guess a backup plan would be to provide downloads to verified customers if this whole AACS thing doesn't pan out.

If anybody here eventually gets their hands on a deck that supports managed copy, please contact me via PM (even if months have gone by). I'm interested in testing the feature.

I also want to note that my understanding of managed copy is slightly different from some press accounts I've read lately. While a disc may include a managed copy link, in most cases, it appears that the player (or BD software for a PC or Mac) will have the feature, and will merely submit the disc info to the server before making a copy. I don't believe that there will only be a menu option on the disc itself that only shows up when managed copy is available.

[Anthony P]

you might try asking kjack in the insider forum the company he works for makes chips for BD players.

[Scenic Labs]

Thanks, Anthony,

I heard back from AACS Administration via email this evening, but I wanted further clarification on things I've read here, on EngadgetHD and on other sites, so I called back and spoke to a rep.

Here's what we discussed:

1) Regarding the menu function for managed copy -- it sounds as though it's a feature of the player's own built-in UI, although a disc could also include a link to its own URI (uniform resource indentifier) server in its own menu.

A managed copy-enabled disc would have the url for the URI server in its MCMF.xml file. Based on this feedback, I contacted my lead authoring engineer tonight to make sure that the URI used is from the most-recently published spec back in June. We authored after that, so I'm pretty sure it would be correct.

This question was important to me because even though we've enabled managed copy on all of our discs, we have been relying on players or PC software to have the menu feature or remote control button to handle copy management. It seems like this is the case.

2) It sounds as though AACSLA have selected the vendor (or vendors) to provide their default server service, although as the spec provides, a company could also run its own server.

3) Also, he told me that fees are still being determined. Also, it is possible that if Scenic Labs decided not to charge for a managed copy, there still might be some transaction fee involved in the copy process.

And per his email response (this is verbatim): "In the future (date TBA) it will be necessary for Content Providers to provide AACS LA with the details of their Managed Copy Offers (prices, etc)."

4) I also asked for some clarification about "serialization" of discs -- the concept that each disc would have its own serial number (something I've read on the internet, but it sounded kind of expensive to implement). It sounds as though this is not the case. Each disc that is enabled for managed copy does have an ISAN assigned (I had to order these through Secure Path o/b/o of ISAN.org). This number, which is embedded in the files of the BD identifies the disc to the URI, which then would see which managed copy features are enabled by the content owner.

It's interesting because this could mean that a content could modify their managed copy policies on the server (affecting future transactions). This last part is speculative, but it would make sense. It would mean that the price to copy a disc could be reduced in the future.

Anyway, since we're all in the same boat, I thought that this information might be helpful to those trying to get a better idea of what is going on.

Also, if you are on the hardware side and are in need of an enabled disc to test out managed copy, I'd be more than happy to send one.

[Scenic Labs]

Just a followup to say that AACSLA were great and responded to my enquiry very quickly. I sent the URI setting that we used, and they confirmed that it is still the same in the final spec.

This means that for the 3 discs we're releasing in a few weeks, managed copy should be ready to go (pending player support, of course). I'm looking forward to being able to try it out in a few months when there is player support.