The Format War

[vladittude0583]

Blu-ray's Side:

1) Cooler Name (I think anyways)
2) Higher storage capacity (greater audio/video quality)
3) Support of most of the CE's in the industry
4) Support of more than half of the major film studios
5) Ratio of 2 to 1 sales when compared to HD-DVD
6) BD in every Playstation 3 game console (monetarily speaking - it is an overall cheaper piece of machinery given its list of standard features compared to that of the XBox 360 Premium and Elite

HD-DVD's Side:

1) Suckier Name
2) Lesser storage capacity (diminished audio/video quality)
3) Support of "gorilla" Microsoft and Intel (however, Intel made an announcement a few months ago that they will go neutral next year)
4) Support of only one dedicated film studio (Universal) and a very, very confused Paramount
5) Has always been beaten in sales by BD since the beginning of this year
6) HD-DVD add-on to XBox 360 has only quality audio/video if connected to the XBox 360 Elite which uses HDMI connectivity, whereas the other XBox 360's use component cables as the highest possible AV connectivity

Now, on to the main stuff:

Hypothetically, let us just say that WB does exclusively support BD, then as we all know it, HD-DVD is just going to have to bow down and proclaim that not only is BD a higher quality format, but it was declared the victor from the get-go. The main thing that concerns me now is definitely the sub $200 prices for HD-DVD players coming out now because BD players are still hovering around $400-$500 with the exception of the new 40GB PS3 which duals as a game console. I am sure that you all will agree with me that those who support HD-DVD and the common consumer, they are primarily clueless as to the actual specifics of the formats competing and I would agree that the common consumer is probably going to be driven by the lower priced Hi-Def players. Supposedly WB does support BD, what are our chances or ensuring a final and decisive victory if the masses start buying those cheap ass HD-DVD players just because its cheaper than the nearest competing BD player? What do you guys think?

[br85]

Well, I for one think that just about any country that isn't America is gonna be majorly pissed off because of the insanely high blu:red ratio we have in the rest of the world. I know that in Australia, France, UK, and Japan (At the very least, there is probably more that I don't know about), the Blue:Red ratio is higher than 3:1.

WB just can't go HD DVD exclusive if they care about the rest of the world getting their movies in high def in the next 12-18 months. They would do well to consider that if they are even toying with the idea...

[Sonny]

Just based on the rest of the world All the studios should go BD exclusive,if they had any firkin sense

[br85]

Originally Posted by Sonny

Just based on the rest of the world All the studios should go BD exclusive,if they had any firkin sense

Yeah true but to be fair, U.S America is selling much higher numbers of HDM than anywhere else, so there is that fact, but still, the rest of the world wants blu, and so does more than half of the US HDM market, seems like a no-brainer to me, I don't know if Betamax ever had that kind of success...

[bluraylover]

I hope this format war ends soon

ive now bought my 90th blu ray movie the latest was die hard 4.0 and rise of the silver surfer
and i have 15 more on preorder between now and christmas im sure there are a lot of titles tied up waiting to be released wb need to go blu ray exclusive how will they judge the format war fairly i mean there are a lot of titles that are hd dvd exclusicve on wb ex, batman begins,matrix trilogy and v for vendetta i think the studios will loose a lot of money if they dont sort this out soon i will not buy download movies wheres the fun in collecting , any way i will be ordering more wb blu rays to do my bit hope that disney release die hard with a vengence in the uk soon as it was distrubuted here by them
we can only get die hard 1,2 and 4.0 and as there is multi region codeing on fox discs i will not be able to own the set

[br85]

Originally Posted by bluraylover

I hope this format war ends soon

ive now bought my 90th blu ray movie the latest was die hard 4.0 and rise of the silver surfer
and i have 15 more on preorder between now and christmas im sure there are a lot of titles tied up waiting to be released wb need to go blu ray exclusive how will they judge the format war fairly i mean there are a lot of titles that are hd dvd exclusicve on wb ex, batman begins,matrix trilogy and v for vendetta i think the studios will loose a lot of money if they dont sort this out soon i will not buy download movies wheres the fun in collecting , any way i will be ordering more wb blu rays to do my bit hope that disney release die hard with a vengence in the uk soon as it was distrubuted here by them
we can only get die hard 1,2 and 4.0 and as there is multi region codeing on fox discs i will not be able to own the set

You'd be right at home with Yahtzee's "Zero punctuation" reviews. He talks with no punctuation at all, it's actually pretty funny.

[SamInNorthCakalakey]

Originally Posted by br85

Yeah true but to be fair, U.S America is selling much higher numbers of HDM than anywhere else, so there is that fact, but still, the rest of the world wants blu, and so does more than half of the US HDM market, seems like a no-brainer to me, I don't know if Betamax ever had that kind of success...

Does anyone know what the ratio was between VHS and Beta-Max after the first year?

[David Craig]

Regarding the original post.

Yes $200 HD DVD players do worry me too.

Hopefully something "big" will happen soon to help out the Blu-ray side.

Maybe though, the kind of person that buys a $200 player will just use it for upscaling DVDs, i.e., they won't even realize HD DVD disks are for sale or will object to buying HD DVDs for $30 bucks when DVDs can be had for $10. If so, the sales of movies will continue to favour Blu-ray.

[xtop]

i actually prefer the hd dvd name, i mean, what better way to get people to automatically recognize what you're talking about.

but as for the 200 dollar players. aren't they discontiuned 1080i players? who gives a hoot

[bazie]

oh cool i didn't know intel was going neutral! Link?

[xtop]

oh and for the record, the elite 360 isn't the only 360 with hdmi

[bazie]

Originally Posted by David Craig

Maybe though, the kind of person that buys a $200 player will just use it for upscaling DVDs, i.e., they won't even realize HD DVD disks are for sale or will object to buying HD DVDs for $30 bucks when DVDs can be had for $10. If so, the sales of movies will continue to favour Blu-ray.

then why would they not just get an upscaling DVD player?

[RUR]

Originally Posted by bazie

oh cool i didn't know intel was going neutral! Link?

http://www.edn.com/index.asp?layout=...leid=CA6479670

[davidPS3]

If Warner really looked at the big picture as I am sure they have, they would see that HD DVD is dead just about everywhere in the WORLD and their only stronghold is the US. But even in the US, Blu Ray is outselling 2 to 1.

Warner has said they want to see the war end. They know what they need to do so let's see them act on this.

[matts]

Just to compare...

Originally Posted by vladittude0583

1) Cooler Name (I think anyways) vs. Suckier name?

This is so subjective. I think HD DVD makes more sense simple because we have TV, we have HD TV. Then we have DVD and HD DVD. Seems very simple. Only major confusion is caused by CE's because the market upconversion players as HD-DVD players or High Def DVD Players. That's the only way blu-ray has the edge there. On the down side, leave out the - and it looks like bluray or blurry.. if you just glance.. kind of laughed first time I saw that.

2) Higher storage capacity (greater audio/video quality) vs. Lesser storage capacity (diminished audio/video quality)

You need to remove any reference to video quality here. It just hasn't shown to be the case. Movies on both formats look incredible. I'd also argue audio quality, but I don't have a lossless receiver, so I can't speak directly to it. All I can say is that all my movies on HD DVD or Bly-ray equally sound awesome too. ONLY possible advantage in space is if a TrueHD track can't fit on an HD DVD

3) Support of most of the CE's in the industry vs. Support of "gorilla" Microsoft and Intel (however, Intel made an announcement a few months ago that they will go neutral next year)

Not sure this really matters. Sony is really the big guns behind the blu-ray player sales. I'm not sure the other players really have much of a significance in comparison. And like any format war, choices here are always subject to change. I've never seen this as much of an advantage - at least not one to give a win to anyone.

4) Support of more than half of the major film studios vs Support of only one dedicated film studio (Universal) and a very, very confused Paramount

Even with this, total titles available is still very close. Each side has an advantage here because they each have exclusive studios. You want to watch an exclusive movie, you need that format. MAYBE we'll see blu-ray with more of an advantage next year, but I personally don't see it today.

5) Ratio of 2 to 1 sales when compared to HD-DVD vs Has always been beaten in sales by BD since the beginning of this year

I'm actually starting to see this as more of an advantage for HD DVD. Seriously. Blu-ray's been 2:1 since the start of the year - I think pretty much since PS3 released. Since then, it's stayed 2:1. What's that say? It simple says that the PS3 had a one-time effect and that both formats are growing at an equal rate. It also says that the good news blu-ray had earlier this year (Target, Blockbuster..etc) didn't have an effect. All that time, there seemed to be little good news (or titles) from HD DVD. I don't think this is at all a good sign for Blu-ray. I truly expected they'd keep pushing a little further ahead, especially around some of the specials and such that came about.

6) BD in every Playstation 3 game console (monetarily speaking - it is an overall cheaper piece of machinery given its list of standard features compared to that of the XBox 360 Premium and Elite vs HD-DVD add-on to XBox 360 has only quality audio/video if connected to the XBox 360 Elite which uses HDMI connectivity, whereas the other XBox 360's use component cables as the highest possible AV connectivity

See #5. I do think the PS3 is a better piece of hardware. But I don't really give any disadvantage to the 360 add on. For the majority of buyers in either format, audio and video are still going to be the same. My PS3 and 360 with add-on both look and sound the same. PS3 is connected via HDMI and 360 by component.

I think things are actually pretty even right now. Depending on the quantity of HD-A2's that stores will have available at their $200 prices and black Friday prices, things could change. All year long, I've felt blu-ray had the edge. I think HD DVD is starting to get an edge now.

Just my thoughts.. take them or leave them.

[almy]

Content is king. Blu has at leat three studios exclusively. HD "bought" Paramount and only has them for another 16 months. Just yesterday an exec from Warner said they are committed to Blu and are re-evaluating their neutral status. Universal has never made a penny from Blu and is certainly following the sales charts - which always favor Blu. How are the buyers of those 200.00 HD players going to feel when they can't use Blu exclusive titles? There are a lot more "big hit" movies out now on Blu than HD and it will remain that way for the next year or so,

[xtop]

Originally Posted by matts

Just to compare...



I think things are actually pretty even right now. Depending on the quantity of HD-A2's that stores will have available at their $200 prices and black Friday prices, things could change. All year long, I've felt blu-ray had the edge. I think HD DVD is starting to get an edge now.

Just my thoughts.. take them or leave them.

my only problems with what you've said, and i think you make great points. is that the uncompressed audio available on blu-ray is a huge selling point for me. the difference is amazing and i reccomend you get a receiver to take advantage. and yes the video quality is very close on both formats, but if you take a look, don't more blu-ray movies get higher pq scores than hd dvd? i'm not saying disk size has ANYTHING to do with this. but just throwing it out.

and the 2-1 sales lead is bad for hd dvd, no matter how you look at it. with hd dvd's price advantage, blu-ray shouldn't be able to hold that. i imagine if we saw a map, both formats have been selling more. but to keep the 2-1 lead with a more expensive product sounds like bad news for hd dvd to me.

[xtop]

Originally Posted by almy

Content is king. Blu has at leat three studios exclusively. HD "bought" Paramount and only has them for another 16 months. Just yesterday an exec from Warner said they are committed to Blu and are re-evaluating their neutral status. Universal has never made a penny from Blu and is certainly following the sales charts - which always favor Blu. How are the buyers of those 200.00 HD players going to feel when they can't use Blu exclusive titles? There are a lot more "big hit" movies out now on Blu than HD and it will remain that way for the next year or so,

just because they bought them doesn't take away from the fact that they have them as an exclusive

[matts]

Originally Posted by xtop

my only problems with what you've said, and i think you make great points. is that the uncompressed audio available on blu-ray is a huge selling point for me. the difference is amazing and i reccomend you get a receiver to take advantage. and yes the video quality is very close on both formats, but if you take a look, don't more blu-ray movies get higher pq scores than hd dvd? i'm not saying disk size has ANYTHING to do with this. but just throwing it out.

Yeah, I plan on getting a receiver that can support it. Whether I can tell the difference or not really won't matter to me much as the movies sound great now. I think MOST consumers will feel this way.

and the 2-1 sales lead is bad for hd dvd, no matter how you look at it. with hd dvd's price advantage, blu-ray shouldn't be able to hold that. i imagine if we saw a map, both formats have been selling more. but to keep the 2-1 lead with a more expensive product sounds like bad news for hd dvd to me.

Movie prices are pretty equal between the two. In fact, I think HD DVD may be more expensive in many cases due to combo's.

My simple point about the 2:1 ratio is that it pretty much started at that with the PS3 and during this year all Blu-ray has been able to do is maintain that. That certainly says something. If blu-ray was truly doing much better, it would be increasing this ratio.

I don't think its bad that blu-ray is leading sales 2:1 - What is bad is that it hasn't been able to increase this lead at all. Especially when you consider all of the other factors blu-ray had going for it. I think HD DVD has been waiting for this time of year to pull out all it can.

[xtop]

Originally Posted by matts

Yeah, I plan on getting a receiver that can support it. Whether I can tell the difference or not really won't matter to me much as the movies sound great now. I think MOST consumers will feel this way.



Movie prices are pretty equal between the two. In fact, I think HD DVD may be more expensive in many cases due to combo's.

My simple point about the 2:1 ratio is that it pretty much started at that with the PS3 and during this year all Blu-ray has been able to do is maintain that. That certainly says something. If blu-ray was truly doing much better, it would be increasing this ratio.

I don't think its bad that blu-ray is leading sales 2:1 - What is bad is that it hasn't been able to increase this lead at all. Especially when you consider all of the other factors blu-ray had going for it. I think HD DVD has been waiting for this time of year to pull out all it can.

i guess we just see things differently. what does the ps3 have to do with blu-ray vs hd dvd sales anyways? you seem to be basing the fact they've stayed at an even 2-1 lead on the ps3. why is it the ps3's fault for anything? if the survey a few weeks ago was correct, the majority of owners have no idea it plays blu-ray.

and blu-ray hasn't, imo, had any huge titles until recently, and in the coming weeks.