Why not PCM audio on most Blu's - Blu-ray Forum

Canada · 01-13-2008, 05:50 AM

I know PCM takes up considerably more space than DD True HD or DTS MA. I also hear alot that companies hardly use the 50 gig's anyway, or am I misinformed. A lot of people including myself have said the notice a difference between PCM, DD True HD and DTS MA. I mean if you dont have to compromise the video quality why not put the PCM on the disk, plus another benifit any receiver can take advatage of it assuming the player/ receiver has 6 analog outputs.

Phane · 01-13-2008, 09:09 AM

Hmm... I thought DD True HD and DTS HD-MA were supposed to be lossless compression.

MarekM · 01-13-2008, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phane

Hmm... I thought DD True HD and DTS HD-MA were supposed to be lossless compression.

+1, yes they are same at the end...

bootman · 01-13-2008, 01:54 PM

Who makes the receivers that can decode the new audio formats?

Does your receiver do any processing on the analog inputs? (correct speaker distances, crossover settings, sub settings etc.? 99% of them don't!)

This year every major CE will have HD audio capable gear for sale.
PCM was great when the new equipment wasn't available, but it will be gone soon.

Leopold BUTTERS · 01-13-2008, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bootman

Who makes the receivers that can decode the new audio formats?

Does your receiver do any processing on the analog inputs? (correct speaker distances, crossover settings, sub settings etc.? 99% of them don't!)

This year every major CE will have HD audio capable gear for sale.
PCM was great when the new equipment wasn't available, but it will be gone soon.

which is too bad if you ask me! PCM is the same as DTS 5.1 MAHD and DDTHD. So why not just use PCM 5.1 since most Receivers can do PCM 5.1...my receiver does not decode DTS MAHD and DDTHD so now i have to get a ps3 so i can get DDTHD through my receiver and hopefully soon there will be an update so the ps3 can decode DTS MAHD.. which reminds me....every fox title is DTSMAHD

sadness until i get a ps3 with F/W update..

richteer · 01-13-2008, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Canada

I know PCM takes up considerably more space than DD True HD or DTS MA. I also hear alot that companies hardly use the 50 gig's anyway, or am I misinformed. A lot of people including myself have said the notice a difference between PCM, DD True HD and DTS MA. I mean if you dont have to compromise the video quality why not put the PCM on the disk, plus another benifit any receiver can take advatage of it assuming the player/ receiver has 6 analog outputs.

PCM not only takes up more disc space, but also requires more bandwidth. That might be an issue for some titles.

crackinhedz · 01-13-2008, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leopold BUTTERS

so now i have to get a ps3 so i can get DDTHD through my receiver

your Sharp BD player decodes TrueHD.

?

WickyWoo · 01-13-2008, 06:23 PM

I think a large reason is because PS3 can only output PCM as stereo

crackinhedz · 01-13-2008, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

I think a large reason is because PS3 can only output PCM as stereo

7.1PCM

Baseball3 · 01-13-2008, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

I think a large reason is because PS3 can only output PCM as stereo

Not everyone here would realize you were joking!

WickyWoo · 01-13-2008, 07:11 PM

What I meant was that over optical, it can only output stereo

Which is how 99%+ of PS3 owners would have their systems hooked up at this time

crackinhedz · 01-13-2008, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

What I meant was that over optical, it can only output stereo

Which is how 99%+ of PS3 owners would have their systems hooked up at this time

I figured you ment optical...I kept thinking "wicky must of had a really late night"?!!

Leopold BUTTERS · 01-13-2008, 08:10 PM

well i thought it would decoded DDTHD as well...i was watching 300 and was switching between DD and DDTHD and there is 0 change in sound....and i have heard DDTHD and it sounds awesome...so i have no idea why my Sharp BD player is not decoding it...I have super shitty speakers tho..but i know there should be a huge difference anyways.

navychop · 01-13-2008, 08:39 PM

Why do I not want 5.1 PCM? Because I want 7.1!

I bought Klipsch speakers, nice 7.1 system with a nice sub, and an Onkyo 805. Yep, I'm ready. My PS3 puts out nicely over HDMI, though I need to find cables that don't slip out so easily. I wish they clipped in like the old Centronics parallel interface cables did.

I'm sure the CE companies would greatly prefer Blu-ray push for HDMI for everything, so they can sell more. But we get better toys this way.

crackinhedz · 01-13-2008, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leopold BUTTERS

well i thought it would decoded DDTHD as well...i was watching 300 and was switching between DD and DDTHD and there is 0 change in sound....and i have heard DDTHD and it sounds awesome...so i have no idea why my Sharp BD player is not decoding it...I have super shitty speakers tho..but i know there should be a huge difference anyways.

do you have the Player HDMI Audio Output set to PCM (not AUTO)?

it should be PCM.

WickyWoo · 01-13-2008, 09:36 PM

Quote:

I'm sure the CE companies would greatly prefer Blu-ray push for HDMI for everything, so they can sell more. But we get better toys this way.

Analog in/outputs will be phased out completely by 2012

DaViD Boulet · 01-13-2008, 09:46 PM

The push here should be to make sure that content providers give us lossless audio on EVERY BD title... period.... no matter what the CODEC they use.

only 27% of HD DVDs offer lossless. And when Universal and Paramount come on board, that will probably be more sub-standard audio on BD.

Push for lossless. Push Warner. And Push Parmamount and Universal when they get here!

Clark Kent · 01-14-2008, 12:12 AM

I believe the studios mostly want to move away from PCM for bandwidth reasons. Using PCM cuts into the extras that you can add like multiple foreign language tracks and PIP.

And this might be the first time I've ever disagreed with something WickyWoo has said. The mass market stuff might drop analog input/output but the audiophile community would go on a jihad if manufacturers dropped analog.

LembasBread · 01-14-2008, 12:18 AM

I'm not so sure that bandwidth plays as much of a factor as most would think. Lionsgate seems to have no problems getting PiP on War and 3:10 to Yuma as well as 7.1 uncompressed audio.

Leopold BUTTERS · 01-14-2008, 02:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

do you have the Player HDMI Audio Output set to PCM (not AUTO)?

it should be PCM.

i have it set to auto...so if i set it to PCM it will decode DDTHD, and movies that only supports DD and not PCM DDTHD or DTSMA will it still do DD without me having to set it back to auto?

01-13-2008, 05:50 AM	#1
Canada Blu-ray Archduke Top contributor Member since:Mar 2007 Location:Victoria, BC Home Theater Gallery:17 4K collection:305 Blu-ray collection:1201 DVD collection:37 Blu-ray reviews:42	Why not PCM audio on most Blu's I know PCM takes up considerably more space than DD True HD or DTS MA. I also hear alot that companies hardly use the 50 gig's anyway, or am I misinformed. A lot of people including myself have said the notice a difference between PCM, DD True HD and DTS MA. I mean if you dont have to compromise the video quality why not put the PCM on the disk, plus another benifit any receiver can take advatage of it assuming the player/ receiver has 6 analog outputs.

01-13-2008, 01:54 PM	#4
bootman Special Member Member since:Sep 2007 Location:The Burghs	Who makes the receivers that can decode the new audio formats? Does your receiver do any processing on the analog inputs? (correct speaker distances, crossover settings, sub settings etc.? 99% of them don't!) This year every major CE will have HD audio capable gear for sale. PCM was great when the new equipment wasn't available, but it will be gone soon. Last edited by bootman; 01-13-2008 at 01:56 PM.

01-13-2008, 07:11 PM	#11
WickyWoo Blu-ray Champion Member since:May 2007 Trading Score:2	What I meant was that over optical, it can only output stereo Which is how 99%+ of PS3 owners would have their systems hooked up at this time Last edited by WickyWoo; 01-13-2008 at 07:13 PM.

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01-13-2008, 09:09 AM	#2
Phane Active Member Member since:Nov 2007 Location:Rochester, MN	Hmm... I thought DD True HD and DTS HD-MA were supposed to be lossless compression.

01-13-2008, 06:23 PM	#8
WickyWoo Blu-ray Champion Member since:May 2007 Trading Score:2	I think a large reason is because PS3 can only output PCM as stereo

01-13-2008, 08:10 PM	#13
Leopold BUTTERS Blu-ray Guru Member since:Jun 2007 Location:AB,Canada Blu-ray collection:93 Blu-ray reviews: 2 Trading Score:1	well i thought it would decoded DDTHD as well...i was watching 300 and was switching between DD and DDTHD and there is 0 change in sound....and i have heard DDTHD and it sounds awesome...so i have no idea why my Sharp BD player is not decoding it...I have super shitty speakers tho..but i know there should be a huge difference anyways.

01-13-2008, 08:39 PM	#14
navychop Active Member Member since:Jul 2007 Location:Northern VA	Why do I not want 5.1 PCM? Because I want 7.1! I bought Klipsch speakers, nice 7.1 system with a nice sub, and an Onkyo 805. Yep, I'm ready. My PS3 puts out nicely over HDMI, though I need to find cables that don't slip out so easily. I wish they clipped in like the old Centronics parallel interface cables did. I'm sure the CE companies would greatly prefer Blu-ray push for HDMI for everything, so they can sell more. But we get better toys this way.

01-13-2008, 09:46 PM	#17
DaViD Boulet Blu-ray Guru Member since:Jan 2007 Location:Washington, DC Blu-ray reviews: 1	The push here should be to make sure that content providers give us lossless audio on EVERY BD title... period.... no matter what the CODEC they use. only 27% of HD DVDs offer lossless. And when Universal and Paramount come on board, that will probably be more sub-standard audio on BD. Push for lossless. Push Warner. And Push Parmamount and Universal when they get here!

01-14-2008, 12:12 AM	#18
Clark Kent Blu-ray Prince Top contributor Member since:Oct 2007 Location:Metropolis Blu-ray reviews:2 Trading Score:184	I believe the studios mostly want to move away from PCM for bandwidth reasons. Using PCM cuts into the extras that you can add like multiple foreign language tracks and PIP. And this might be the first time I've ever disagreed with something WickyWoo has said. The mass market stuff might drop analog input/output but the audiophile community would go on a jihad if manufacturers dropped analog.

01-14-2008, 12:18 AM	#19
LembasBread Active Member Member since:Dec 2006 Blu-ray reviews:1	I'm not so sure that bandwidth plays as much of a factor as most would think. Lionsgate seems to have no problems getting PiP on War and 3:10 to Yuma as well as 7.1 uncompressed audio.

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